Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
TOTW 16/07: Did Alma Jr. know Ennis was gay?
southendmd:
I have to agree with you, Laura, about the "once burned": it comes off as a real insult, and her barely contained anger lets loose. I'd probably let him have it, too.
Here's the line from the story:
"Once burned," he said, leaning against the counter, feeling too big for the room.
Ennis could have said something a lot more civil.
serious crayons:
I know I'm in the minority on this, but I can see "once burned" as meaning he was burned by the experience of a failed marriage, not by Alma's faults. True, even so it's not the most polite comment ever.
On the other hand, "You ought to get married" is not a remark anyone really wants to hear either, gay or straight, single or divorced. Who likes having people pressure you about that, whatever your reasons for being single? (A similar one, if you already are married, is, "You ought to have children.") And particularly not Ennis, who has a very specific reason for being unmarried, and one he wants to keep hidden. So Alma's initial question is a bit pushy itself.
I always see a direct line of causality between this conversation and his relationship with Cassie.
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: LauraGigs on December 04, 2007, 01:37:37 pm ---I don't know. Alma makes the 'married again' comment in a relaxed and offhand way, in a languid, almost sleepy voice (full of milk and turkey). It's after his "once burned" reply that she visibly bristles.
He'd cheated on her for years with someone he's met before they were even married (making his marriage to her a sham), sodomized her when she didn't want it, yelled at her out on the street, and indicated ("I'll be happy to leave you alone") complete lack of interest in her sexual and emotional satisfaction. And after all that, he's blaming her for the failure of the marriage?
I think anybody would let him have it after that, and be justified in doing so.
--- End quote ---
I'm really not disagreeing with any of this. I just believe she knew exactly where she was heading right from the start. But perhaps Ennis's comment influenced the way she chose to get there.
It suddenly occurs to me to wonder, too, whether Alma's comment that she and the girls worried about Ennis might not have had some role in provoking his "Once burned" remark. It occurs to me that it might strike you as annoying to have the woman who divorced you tell you that she worries about you. I mean, hunh? ???
southendmd:
--- Quote from: ineedcrayons on December 04, 2007, 02:30:43 pm ---I know I'm in the minority on this, but I can see "once burned" as meaning he was burned by the experience of a failed marriage, not by Alma's faults. True, even so it's not the most polite comment ever.
On the other hand, "You ought to get married" is not a remark anyone really wants to hear either, gay or straight, single or divorced. Who likes having people pressure you about that, whatever your reasons for being single? (A similar one, if you already are married, is, "You ought to have children.") And particularly not Ennis, who has a very specific reason for being unmarried, and one he wants to keep hidden. So Alma's initial question is a bit pushy itself.
I always see a direct line of causality between this conversation and his relationship with Cassie.
--- End quote ---
Intrusive, pushy, maybe. But, she adds something like, "Me and the girls worry about you being alone so much." (I don't see that as annoying; I mean, he accepted the Thanksgiving invitation.)
To me, the "once burned" comment said at that time implicitly blamed Alma for their marriage. So, she explodes with the only thing she's got, that she somehow held in for many years. As long as she was dependent on him, she never confronted him with the kiss, or the creel case.
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: southendmd on December 04, 2007, 02:43:34 pm ---To me, the "once burned" comment said at that time implicitly blamed Alma for their marriage. So, she explodes with the only thing she's got, that she somehow held in for many years. As long as she was dependent on him, she never confronted him with the kiss, or the creel case.
--- End quote ---
I agree with this.
--- Quote ---Intrusive, pushy, maybe. But, she adds something like, "Me and the girls worry about you being alone so much." (I don't see that as annoying; I mean, he accepted the Thanksgiving invitation.)
--- End quote ---
Nevertheless, if someone who had sued me for divorce turns around and says that she "worries" about me in any way, shape, or form, I think my first respnse would be, "If you're so all-fired concerned about me, then what the hell did you divorce me for?"
Which is not to excuse Ennis for what he said, maybe only to offer a possible explanation for what might have provoked the remark.
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