Joe Aguirre: what do you think of this character as portrayed in the movie?

[serious crayons]

Now to the comment Aguirre made in the trailer in 1964 when Jack came back for a new job. Essentially, Aguirre was willing to let Jack leave without mentioning his knowledge that Ennis and Jack's affair created an inattention to the sheep. This negligence contributed to the unacceptable financial losses Aguirre suffered that year. Of course Aguirre wasn't going to hire him again! But he didn't bring up his knowledge of their 'affair'.... UNTIL, Jack tried to use Aguirre as a dating service!

Exactly!

Ah, but they succeeded in something much, much more important.

True. But that would be from our standpoint.

I was reading in True West Magazine that the main reason two sheepherders were sent up the mountain together was so that they could, er, keep each other company through the long summer. Even for the most staunchly straight guy, a whole summer without the companionship of anything but sheep and dogs was just too much to ask.

Yes, that's what I've heard, too. And that the employers were often pretty laissez faire about how they defined "keep each other company."

 

[moremojo]

But if Aguirre were sending Jack and Ennis up the mountain together to keep each other company, why would he take umbrage when they ended up doing precisely that?

It's also important to remember that Aguirre is breaking the rules himself, from the very beginning, by asking one of the boys to camp overnight on land declared off-limits for such by the law. Jack and Ennis could perhaps be excused for being lax with Aguirre's rules when he himself was lax with the government's rules.

[moremojo]

My opinion of Aguirre has changed recently.  It seems that when Jack was exiting the trailer after his last encounter with Aguirre, a scene was cut which showed two mechanics who  stare accusingly at Jack.  It seems Aguirre had spilled the beans to a few of the locals about what he had witnessed.  Conjecture is that after Jack saw their reaction, he was apt to prove his heterosexuality and hooked up with Lureen.

Darn, I guess we will never get to see those deleted scenes. My source was READING BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN.

The film as it now stands would complicate this implication, since we see Jack hitting on rodeo-clown Jimbo (admittedly in Texas) after his exchange with Aguirre.

[serious crayons]

But if Aguirre were sending Jack and Ennis up the mountain together to keep each other company, why would he take umbrage when they ended up doing precisely that?

Because the sheep count wasn't what he'd hoped for.

[moremojo]

Exactly, the bureaucrats in Washington did not then and probably now still do not understand the challenges faced in rural areas.

While this is no doubt true, it is worth remembering that some of those Washington bureaucrats were elected to office by the very Rocky Mountain ranch folk who seem to chafe at the restrictions their representatives impose upon them. By the same token, a few of those Washington bureaucrats come from ranch and farming backgrounds (e.g., Dick Cheney, Larry Craig).

[brokeplex]

Ah, but they succeeded in something much, much more important.

You are correct, without their taking the time to establish their relationship there would be no story here. But, from Joe Aguirre's point of view ( and I started this thread to talk about Joe and his motivations, strengths and weaknesses), they were bad hires, with Ennis less a bad hire than Jack.

That doesn't mean that I don't love Jack. Jack as a character held my heart in his hands right from the beginning, when I first read the ss. Ennis finally had me in the last scenes of the movie.   

[Artiste]

Wow, very interesting comments! Thanks all of you!!

One comment is: KISS, straight guys don't kiss! I do not think that I ever seen a straight guy kiss, moi nor anyone straight, gay, bi or otherwise!!

But since Ennis did kiss Jack when Aquirre was looking from afar, and if you consider all three straights (somehow or maybe one or two), then the movie was different from Annie's story?

If the movie would have been more strict to Annie's story, would Aquirre be otherwise?

Hugs!

Merry, Merry, Merry Christmas and  Happy Gay Holidays to all!!

[Ellemeno]

I'm late to the party.  Some brief thoughts that may have already been said:

I have never seen any sign of homophobia at all in Aguirre.  He's pissed that they let the dogs babysit the sheep, not that they stemmed the rose.  I think his "I don't have no work for you" is one of those points in the movie to show us the paranoia Ennis and Jack have to live with, the constant "What did that person mean by that?  Do they Know?"


Men at the top of the heap can be just as cranky as guys with bosses stepping on their necks.  Running the business isn't less pressure than taking orders.


One thing I always see in Randy Quaid's performance is a  - I don't know what term to use - a kind of deliberate aware semi-ironic tone, like from a very differently-toned movie, one where all the actors are alluding to the fact that they know they are in a movie, almost sort of like the old TV show "Get Smart."  Especially in the Uncle Harold scene.  I always feel like Jake (the actor, I mean) senses this about Randy Quaid's performance in that scene, so doesn't quite know how to play it.  He kind of goes along with it too.  Does anybody get what I'm trying to say?

[brokeplex]

One thing I always see in Randy Quaid's performance is a  - I don't know what term to use - a kind of deliberate aware semi-ironic tone, like from a very differently-toned movie, one where all the actors are alluding to the fact that they know they are in a movie, almost sort of like the old TV show "Get Smart."  Especially in the Uncle Harold scene.  I always feel like Jake (the actor, I mean) senses this about Randy Quaid's performance in that scene, so doesn't quite know how to play it.  He kind of goes along with it too.  Does anybody get what I'm trying to say?

just as a clarification, are you saying that Randy Quaid's performance as Aguirre has a touch of irony? or are you saying that Jake Gyllenhaal is playing Jack Twist with a touch of irony?

I think that Quaid captured a weary tone and demeanor of a businessman who is probably tired of fighting all of the elements that make his tasks difficult. I can see how that might be thought of as an semi-ironic tone.

But, I have noticed that at times in the film, Gyllenhaal does come across as somewhat ironic to me and somewhat removed from the character, but at other times, very serious and very into the Jack Twist character. Heath Ledger on the other hand is consistently right into the Del Mar character, and I am very disappointed that he didn't win an Oscar for his role. 

[serious crayons]

But, I have noticed that at times in the film, Gyllenhaal does come across as somewhat ironic to me and somewhat removed from the character, but at other times, very serious and very into the Jack Twist character.

I remember one reviewer saying he was put off, at first, by Jake's performance. The reviewer thought that Jake appeared to be too obviously posturing as the classic iconic cowboy. Then he (the reviewer) realized that what Jake actually was doing was playing a character who postured as the classic iconic cowboy. Good distinction, and I think Jake pulled it off well.