Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
TOTW 03/08: "There was some open space..." - What do you think this means?
Rayn:
--- Quote from: ineedcrayons on January 22, 2008, 12:42:59 pm ---One interpretation I think is possible goes along with my belief that Jack was killed in an accident. So, "There was some open space between ..."
... what he knew: Jack had been killed in an accident
... and what he tried to believe: Jack had been murdered.
Ennis tried to believe Jack was murdered because that would justify his fears and he wouldn't have ruined both their lives for nothing.
--- End quote ---
I agree with inneedcrayons, but see more to it, but first let me say, I'm so glad this topic is here because it helped me see that the line is about both Jack's Death and Ennis' Love for Jack. It's clear evidence that Ennis loved Jack with his whole mind and body even though he had a conflict about it in his own mind.
I came to this conclusion by looking at the line in context of the paragraph in the book. I had to consider clear indications that is had a lot to do with the way Jack died, but also with the way Ennis felt about Jack. In the paragraph just before, about dreams Ennis had, it reads ... "The spoon handle was the kind that could be used as a tire iron. And he would wake sometimes in grief, sometimes with the old sense of joy and release; the pillow sometimes wet, sometimes the sheets"
Pillow (SWEAT from his Head / Mental State)
Sheets (Love / Emotional State expressed in Sex i.e. sweat from his whole body or maybe wet dreams [release] too.)
So it has a lot to do with death (tire iron) and sex (love) and ultimately, without doubt, it points to his painful mental & emotional conflict over both. He wanted be believe Jack was murdered, but had no actual evidence of that except the fears from childhood that his father had imprinted on his mind. He also wanted to believe that Jack knew he loved him, even though he never said that to Jack. In fact because of his fears, a fuller, richer life with Jack was lost.
Thus we get the other lline "Jack, I swear..." which has become almost a "classic" topic on Bettermost, and I ain't too shy to say so! (smile). Yes, these lines, so close in the book, are very much related though one is a quote of Ennis and the other is narrative from the author.
I hope that helps some.
Rayn
PS: To anyone who has ever dealt with fears of loving someone, the story can have a strong message: If fears stand in your way of loving someone, deal with and overcome them so you can give a full expression of love while you're able, which is pretty obvious, I guess, I thought I'd include it just the same.
moremojo:
What did Ennis actually know by this point in the story? He knew that Jack was dead. He knew that he was attracted to and in love with Jack, and the shirts proved that Jack had reciprocated these feelings for him.
What could he have been trying to believe that was in variance with these things? I feel uncomfortable with the interpretation that Ennis was trying to disbelieve the homosexual nature of the relationship he shared with Jack, as the whole thematic trajectory of the story seems to lead to this hard-earned awareness ("Jack, I swear--"). Right now, I'm leaning towards an attempt to believe that Jack remained in love with him to the end, that Old Man Twist's story of the ranch hand down in Texas did not indicate Jack quitting Ennis. There would have been sufficient uncertainty ("open space") for Ennis to have been able to sustain this feeling, but the uncertainty would have remained, and was probably irresolvable.
I agree that this closing sentence of the story is intentionally ambiguous, and that a variety of interpretations are not only rendered possible thereby, but probably even encouraged.
nakymaton:
--- Quote from: Sandy on January 21, 2008, 02:12:50 pm ---Wonderful topic.
I'm going to refer to a comment made by a resident who's name I cannot remember in a thread I cannot find! So, if anyone can remember the author please advise.
--- End quote ---
That may have been me:
http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php/topic,2973.0.html
I still read it as being (still, after 20 years of being in love with a man) conflicted about his sexual orientation. But I can understand why other people would read it differently. But I've got my reasons, others have theirs; ain't one that's better than the other.
Now, I read the last sentence and think about Heath (and about all the speculation and dirt-digging that's in the media). It makes the last sentence even sadder and more powerful. :(
Front-Ranger:
--- Quote from: Rayn on January 29, 2008, 03:21:26 am ---
I agree with inneedcrayons, but see more to it, but first let me say, I'm so glad this topic is here because it helped me see that the line is about both Jack's Death and Ennis' Love for Jack. It's clear evidence that Ennis loved Jack with his whole mind and body even though he had a conflict about it in his own mind.
I came to this conclusion by looking at the line in context of the paragraph in the book. I had to consider clear indications that is had a lot to do with the way Jack died, but also with the way Ennis felt about Jack. In the paragraph just before, about dreams Ennis had, it reads ... "The spoon handle was the kind that could be used as a tire iron. And he would wake sometimes in grief, sometimes with the old sense of joy and release; the pillow sometimes wet, sometimes the sheets"
Pillow (SWEAT from his Head / Mental State)
Sheets (Love / Emotional State expressed in Sex i.e. sweat from his whole body or maybe wet dreams [release] too.)
So it has a lot to do with death (tire iron) and sex (love) and ultimately, without doubt, it points to his painful mental & emotional conflict over both. He wanted be believe Jack was murdered, but had no actual evidence of that except the fears from childhood that his father had imprinted on his mind. He also wanted to believe that Jack knew he loved him, even though he never said that to Jack. In fact because of his fears, a fuller, richer life with Jack was lost.
Thus we get the other lline "Jack, I swear..." which has become almost a "classic" topic on Bettermost, and I ain't too shy to say so! (smile). Yes, these lines, so close in the book, are very much related though one is a quote of Ennis and the other is narrative from the author.
I hope that helps some.
Rayn
PS: To anyone who has ever dealt with fears of loving someone, the story can have a strong message: If fears stand in your way of loving someone, deal with and overcome them so you can give a full expression of love while you're able, which is pretty obvious, I guess, I thought I'd include it just the same.
--- End quote ---
Your words gave me an epiphany here, Rayn! I would just like to add on to what you're saying in that Annie Proulx is addressing the gulf between the sacred and the profane, between love and sex, between accident and murder, between the spoon and the tire iron, between the mountain and the plain. And the truth is, there really is no space between them, the space only exists in our minds! Okay, my mind is reeling right now!!
Shakesthecoffecan:
I think it could mean different things on different levels. In the story I see it as the contradiction Ennis has, having been indoctrinated by his father that he was not a queer, and the realization he was attracted to Jack. That conflict is that space, he knew being a queer could get you killed, he tried to believe he could sublimate himself, his life, taking low playing jobs, denighing himself the comfort of Jack at his side because he didn't feel he could face up to the reality and responcibility. There is also the conflict he feels as he gets the news, accident or tire iron? He tried to believe, but he will never know for sure. There is also that panel of the dream, that he does not force his attention to.
You ever have an idea in your head and the more you try to describe it you feel it slip away like someone pulling a pillow out from under your head?
For readers and viewers that space is the unanswered questions. Did Jack really leave Ennis? Was it murder or accident? We know how we feel, but we believe we can do better. I think we are always trying to believe something.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version