The World Beyond BetterMost > Anything Goes
Why are the poor, poor?
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: HerrKaiser on May 09, 2008, 12:18:54 pm ---"It seems ludicrous to think hard-nosed anticipations of success or failure need to be completely related to compassion to ensure the efforts success."
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A perfect example of the muddled and convoluted prose I was discussing earlier.
--- Quote ---"compassion and results are indeed related."
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No, they are not.
--- Quote ---Have you heard of the concept of 'tough love'? That is exemplory of compassion with a eye toward a successful outcome rather than simply delivering another "fix" that has only short term satisfaction, if that. The entitlement programs have largely not been 'tough love' and the results have been, by nearly all measurements, failures in terms of helping people get out of the cycle of not being able to care for themselves.
--- End quote ---
Tough love may indeed be successful with individual troubled teenagers, but if you try it on a single mother on welfare, it's apt to be her children who suffer the consequences.
HerrKaiser:
--- Quote from: Jeff Wrangler on May 09, 2008, 01:17:51 pm ---A perfect example of the muddled and convoluted prose I was discussing earlier.
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Thanks for the personal swipe that is only an opinion! ;) :-X ;D
--- Quote from: Jeff Wrangler on May 09, 2008, 01:17:51 pm ---No, they are not.
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Ah, such perfection! I thought Oprah was the only one who thought she was God! ;D ;D ;D
--- Quote from: Jeff Wrangler on May 09, 2008, 01:17:51 pm ---Tough love may indeed be successful with individual troubled teenagers, but if you try it on a single mother on welfare, it's apt to be her children who suffer the consequences.
--- End quote ---
If the single woman had not felt comfortable, in the first place, that a child she could not afford would be covered by the broken system, she likely would have made better choices. ;)
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: HerrKaiser on May 09, 2008, 01:50:57 pm ---If the single woman had not felt comfortable, in the first place, that a child she could not afford would be covered by the broken system, she likely would have made better choices. ;)
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This exactly supports Jeff's point, which you appear to have missed.
If the woman DOESN'T make better choices, the child will suffer. Should the child have made better choices?
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: HerrKaiser on May 09, 2008, 01:50:57 pm ---Ah, such perfection! I thought Oprah was the only one who thought she was God! ;D ;D ;D
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Oh, I get it. The Right is allowed to know it all, but the Left never knows anything. Clearly you can't refute--or concede--my point that compassion relates to motivation and not to results, so instead you must try to turn it into a joke.
--- Quote from: seriouscrayons on May 09, 2008, 01:55:45 pm ---This exactly supports Jeff's point, which you appear to have missed.
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As usual.
Thanks, Crayons. ;)
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: HerrKaiser on May 09, 2008, 01:50:57 pm ---If the single woman had not felt comfortable, in the first place, that a child she could not afford would be covered by the broken system, she likely would have made better choices. ;)
--- End quote ---
A good example of the Right's bizarre way of thinking.
"Oh, she should have foreseen that her children would suffer when we kick her off welfare, so she should have had fewer (read: none) children."
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