Taking Chances, by E. L. Van Hine and L.H. Nicoll

[Helen]

Numero 4 Lauren for me

[louisev]

One of the reasons that I made Ellery such a different person... physically, psychologically, professionally (and sexually) is because my own philosophy about moving on and loving again is not about "replacing" people.  Jack cannot be replaced.  Nor could Ennis have loved Ellery unless he had first loved Jack, and lost him so tragically.  None of what happened in Laramie could have happened, had Ennis met Ellery first... because they lived in different worlds, and because the Ennis that refused Jack could not have accepted Ellery before Jack died, and Ennis went through his vale of mourning.

For me, the biggest problem of reading and seeing "Brokeback Mountain" was Ennis remaining behind, alone in grief, without his nature as a homosexual man having unfolded.  And in fact, his ability to respond to Ellery is because he is so different.  I think if he had met someone who looked like Jack he might have run back to Junior's sitting room and never ventured out.  It was his capacity to love Jack that gives him the capacity to love Ellery, and in my own experience as well as that of others, it is this capacity to love deeply that allows someone who has loved and lost, to move on, because the impulse to love another and embrace him is a capacity that is not limited to a single person at a single time, but can be extended to family, children, friends, mentors, and yes, to a new lover.

[Helen]

I have decided to continue writing the Laramie Saga into a fourth book. 

Excellent news  

[Bigheart]

Beautifully worded Louise  and I agree with you 100% 

[Helen]

Just a slight deviation.....loved the last two drabbles Louise.  Heath better get to it now!

[magicmountain]

Like a river, the great driving current throughout BBM is love.  Ennis' and Jack love was constricted and had to run underground. But love, as Louise just said, cannot restricted to one person or thing. And the object of love cannot be contained in just one person. It is the qualities in that person that are loved. And the capacity to love, once aroused and set free, can never be restricted just to one person either. It is too big for that. Ennis capacity to love has emerged and now runs like a wild river. (Sorry for waxing lyrical here.)

This is what is at the heart of the Ennis and Jack forever club versus Ennis moves on.

The difficulty is that Jack is such a charismatic and sympathetic figure. I have characterised him as Princess Diana as opposed to Ennis as Prince Charles. As such, it is very hard to let Jack go as an individual. We still feel his pull and feel the pang of his loss even as we celebrate Ennis' new life with Ellery. Those who cannot give up Jack, cannot allow Ennis to wander off into new relationships.  The Jack and Ennis forever people have somehow taken the powerful BBM concept of Love as a Force of Nature as embodied only in the Jack-Ennis relationship. Without that relationship, love somehow dies or its purity is somehow sullied. Almost like a religious dogma, Love can only be given expression through Jack and Ennis. It is like there is only one true  love and its name is Jack and Ennis.

Because of the powerful emotional impact of BBM and because the Jack and Ennis characters are somehow internalised by those who have been deeply affected by this film, people respond viscerally to how Jack and Ennis are represented in fan fics and how Ennis faces life after Jack. There is no doubt in my mind that similar processes are at work which run parallel to religious responses. Some people develop official scripture and dogma to be defended while others, like the gnostics of old, use the spiritual impact of the experience to develop their own understanding and are prepared to go where the impulse takes them in that quest for greater understanding and healing. Jack and Ennis and what they represent in a psychological sense, should not be preserved in aspic, but retain that dynamic quality which hit us all with such force when we first saw the film.

[MaineWriter]

Magicmountain,

Wow. That's great. Thanks for posting that.

Your last paragraph....the religious dogma vs. the gnostics. Very interesting comment. It makes me think of those of  who embody certain religious beliefs that would not allow them to see and experience BBM. Now we have people who have seen the movie, felt its impact, but are denying themselves an additional dimension of the "experience" that is BBM. Their loss.

Leslie

[David]

<wakes up, rubs eyes>  YAWN!  <rolls over to the right> "G'morning Ennis".

<rolls over to the left> "G'moring Ellery".

<bedroom door opens>   

"Ah, here comes Dupree with our breakfast".

Dupree:"Burnt Biscuits and hot butter.  Now who wants me to butter their buns first?"

 

[belbbmfan]

it's posts like these:

One of the reasons that I made Ellery such a different person... physically, psychologically, professionally (and sexually) is because my own philosophy about moving on and loving again is not about "replacing" people.  Jack cannot be replaced.  Nor could Ennis have loved Ellery unless he had first loved Jack, and lost him so tragically.  None of what happened in Laramie could have happened, had Ennis met Ellery first... because they lived in different worlds, and because the Ennis that refused Jack could not have accepted Ellery before Jack died, and Ennis went through his vale of mourning.

For me, the biggest problem of reading and seeing "Brokeback Mountain" was Ennis remaining behind, alone in grief, without his nature as a homosexual man having unfolded.  And in fact, his ability to respond to Ellery is because he is so different.  I think if he had met someone who looked like Jack he might have run back to Junior's sitting room and never ventured out.  It was his capacity to love Jack that gives him the capacity to love Ellery, and in my own experience as well as that of others, it is this capacity to love deeply that allows someone who has loved and lost, to move on, because the impulse to love another and embrace him is a capacity that is not limited to a single person at a single time, but can be extended to family, children, friends, mentors, and yes, to a new lover.

beautifully said Louise, thanks

and these:

<wakes up, rubs eyes>  YAWN!  <rolls over to the right> "G'morning Ennis".

<rolls over to the left> "G'moring Ellery".

<bedroom door opens>  

"Ah, here comes Dupree with our breakfast".

Dupree:"Burnt Biscuits and hot butter.  Now who wants me to butter their buns first?"

 

that make me love this thread soooo much
 

[louisev]

<wakes up, rubs eyes>  YAWN!  <rolls over to the right> "G'morning Ennis".

<rolls over to the left> "G'moring Ellery".

<bedroom door opens>   

"Ah, here comes Dupree with our breakfast".

Dupree:"Burnt Biscuits and hot butter.  Now who wants me to butter their buns first?"

 

now that would make an interesting comic outtake!  Buttered buns indeed!