The World Beyond BetterMost > The Culture Tent
In the New Yorker...
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: serious crayons on May 11, 2017, 10:36:12 am ---Yeah, I know. And far be it from me to absolve Trump of any wrongdoing, but the people who wind up in hell for this particular piece of legislation will be Paul Ryan and the so-called "Freedom" caucus.
--- End quote ---
We can only hope. ...
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: serious crayons on May 11, 2017, 10:39:23 am ---Oh. Duh. It was sitting amid the papers right next to my computer, where I'd brought it so I could address this topic here. Anyway, May 15.
--- End quote ---
You mean May 15 is the issue with the Gopnik piece? I don't think my copy has arrived yet. I have May 1 with me here at work, and I guess it must be May 8 lying on my dining room table. ...
Possibly Gopnik says nothing I don't already know about the Founding Fathers (rich white guys all), but I'll have to see.
Did you read Ariel Levy on the author who wrote Olive Kitteridge? I thought it was kind of dull for Ariel Levy.
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: Jeff Wrangler on May 11, 2017, 11:48:42 am ---You mean May 15 is the issue with the Gopnik piece?
--- End quote ---
Issue arrived in Thursday's mail. I will probably jump ahead and read the Gopnik.
serious crayons:
We all know the Founders were rich white guys whose concepts in the Constitution didn't extend much beyond rich white guys. We're able to overlook that (and even their human-being possession) because of their ideas' long-term value in applying those concepts to a much broader demographic. If there's anything Americans of almost every political bent agree on it's that the Founders were wise and heroic (if flawed products of their time).
But this article is more complicated than that.
I'm still in the middle of it, but looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Jeff Wrangler:
--- Quote from: serious crayons on May 12, 2017, 12:51:53 pm ---We all know the Founders were rich white guys whose concepts in the Constitution didn't extend much beyond rich white guys. We're able to overlook that (and even their human-being possession) because of their ideas' long-term value in applying those concepts to a much broader demographic. If there's anything Americans of almost every political bent agree on it's that the Founders were wise and heroic (if flawed products of their time).
But this article is more complicated than that.
I'm still in the middle of it, but looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
--- End quote ---
Reading the Gopnick now, and may have to read it more than once. At this point I can only say that I was really annoyed by a rather flippant comment he makes about Loyalists, calling them Authoritarian Reformers who were on the losing side, or something close to that (I don't have the issue with me here at work).
Well, no. Most of the Loyalists in the Colonies were nothing like that. They were ordinary folk, farmers and tradesmen and such, who believed in their allegiance to Britain, and they suffered for it. In some places, such as the back country of the Carolinas, it got really nasty. The Revolution presented an opportunity for local conflicts to be played out, too (e.g., if you thought your neighbor was a Tory, and you owed him money, here was your chance to get him and get out of paying your just debt). These people lost their lands, their businesses, and their homes. Many of them had to flee to and settle in Nova Scotia and what is now part of Ontario.
So far I don't see Gopnick or his authors mentioning the benefit that Canada received from this influx of settlers from the new United States.
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