Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
getting hit hard by offhand revelations (story discussion)
Penthesilea:
--- Quote from: fernly on January 15, 2007, 05:32:26 pm ---Good points.
A couple other indications in the story:
When right after the separation Ennis felt "like someone was pulling his guts out hand over hand a yard at at time" and "He felt about as bad as he ever had and it took a long time for the feeling to wear off." That "long time" makes it sound, to me, like he was feeling that bad well into his married life.
And then, "he rolled her over. Did quickly what she hated."
--- End quote ---
Regarding the long time: I never took it as being longer than a couple of hours; days at most. I always thought the long time referred to Ennis' strong, bodily reaction (feeling nausea). But you could be right just as easily. Will think more about it.
"What she hated": yes, it's another hint in her description.
I'm sorry for hogging this thread today, but I wanted to answer all your insightful replies. Thank you all for them.
But now I'm finished with blabbering for today ;D. It's late here and my bed is calling.
nakymaton:
*puts on hat that says "shameless Annie Proulx fangirl"*
One of the things that I love about these descriptions - yes, fernly, good points about the other indications that the summer meant a lot to Ennis - is how contradictory statements (or contradictory language) is used to build Ennis as an internally conflicted character. Like in the scene in which Ennis rolls Alma over -- Proulx never comes out and says "Ennis lay on the bed, thinking about how wonderful it was to make love to Jack, and went through the motions of having sex with Alma anyway." She implies that by describing sex with Alma in a way that isn't particularly erotic, and then lets the reader make the connection when Ennis flips Alma over.
I was having a conversation with a friend about mixed metaphors (yes, sometimes I do talk about this stuff outside BBM discussions, and yes, that's particularly scary given that I'm not actually a lit person), and how the choice of metaphors can add a layer of meaning to a description. (Or not, if it's done poorly.) And I think that one of the fascinating things about BBM is that Proulx does this a lot -- like using "stink" to describe Jack's smell -- and I think that's part of the way she describes Ennis's internal conflicts.
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: nakymaton on January 15, 2007, 06:40:19 pm ---Proulx never comes out and says "Ennis lay on the bed, thinking about how wonderful it was to make love to Jack, and went through the motions of having sex with Alma anyway." She implies that by describing sex with Alma in a way that isn't particularly erotic, and then lets the reader make the connection when Ennis flips Alma over.
--- End quote ---
Which becomes all the more meaningful when Ennis says "I like doin it with women, yeah, but Jesus H., ain't nothin like this." He likes doing it with Alma, yeah -- when he can come as close as possible to replicating his experience with Jack.
Cameron:
I guess I am at the early stages of BBM grief, so I still am thinking about it all the time, and I had to go take a nice long walk because my head was spinning, being on these boards is very addicting in it self, isn't it?
But of cause I was still thinking all about it on my walk, and I have a few more thought on the topic.
I do realize that part of the point of this thread is on the book to, and I will admit that I read it quickly and not to carefully right after I first saw the film, I guess I was a little surprised and how different the tone is, so much coarser and less melancholy. I do have to go back to it.
Anyway, I really firmly believe that Ennis thought that it would continue, because what was not mentioned yet here on this thread was that his next line after 'what if we need to work for Aquire again' was 'We need to stick it out, Jack'. I think this suggests that Ennis really did think they would be together after the summer and needed to stick out the obstacles. I don't believe the line was just about the sheep.
I realize that it goes against so much to think that at this time Ennis saw a real future for them together, but I do see it this way because Ennis was totally free at this time, with no Alma and no children to be responsible for, and yes Earl was still there but I believe at this time he was so completely and totally in love with Jack that he thought he could deal with it. (the way he was looking at Jack after the sheep incident, with so much love.)
In fact to tie it all together, I have been reinterpreting the 'its a one shot thing, you know I ain't queer line'. My first thought was wrongly of course was that he was saying its a one night stand. Then I thought that he was saying well this is only going to last for the summer, which I think is what Jack thought it to mean. But now I am thinking that it meant that he was so incredibly in love with Jack (yeah even before TS2) that it meant that eveb though he is not 'queer' and there never ever could be nor would be any other man for him (hence, once shot) but that he was feeling so much for Jack, so that Jack himself was the one shot thing with no time limits..
However, Jack didn't understand all the things Ennis was saying and Ennis was not capable of being any more direct, so then all the misunderstandings happened as they were leaving BBM and at the truck.
Sorry for boring any old-timers, I never analyzed anything so much in my life.
What stage am I in???
Don't' mean to be off topic now, but you were posting while I was writing this,
taj:
--- Quote ---It's like being slammed, over and over, with the realization that these weren't just two guys who enjoyed having sex with one another -- this was an incredibly profound love. And we don't learn the depth of it until Jack's dead
--- End quote ---
While I agree that we should have learnt about the depth of their love, it is only understandable to a point anticipating that only death could separate the two. Even so it was death that made their love 'uttered' (although a little too late), being free to love and be loved in return
But maybe if anyone finally realised/learned, it was Ennis (and Jack) themselves...
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