The World Beyond BetterMost > Anything Goes
"Priscilla" - stage version
saucycobblers:
--- Quote from: Shuggy on October 27, 2006, 06:22:37 pm ---in the scene after they broke down in the outback, that the people who gathered with them around a campfire and they all entertained each other, were all white.
--- End quote ---
OMG, I hope not! It would change the whole sense of what that scene is about. They Aboriginal characters are representative of the mythical, almost 'forgotten' Australia in the movie - appearing as if from nowhere and disappearing just as quickly - like the lizards and Priscilla and her occupants, they are swallowed by the vastness of the Outback, both physical and psychological. It wouldn't make sense to have these characters as white, especially as the scenes set in the outback towns the characters pass on their journey are seemingly exclusively populated by white Australians / Europeans also.
I could go on and on about this movie - it's so interesting, but I will stop... for now! ;D
Shuggy:
Sorry, but I've had too many Australian hitchhikers go on about how ungrateful "the Abbos" are for white generosity to be objective about this. It seems to me that writing them out of the show is all too typical.
Tick:
I’m one of the producers of Priscilla, someone alerted me to this exchange.
Firstly, can I make the rather obvious point that none of you has seen the show!
Whatever the nature of your responses, the bandwagon you’re leaping on is based on a second hand report (which happens to be inaccurate).
I should ignore any messages which contain such overwhelming generalisations as ‘Australians are racist and heartless’ - I’m not interested in joining an exchange in which a directly racist e-mail makes the charge of implied racism (do any of you realise this?).
I see no point in answering people who hold such views – with equal legitimacy (meaning none!) I might write that all New Zealand men are uncommonly fond of their sheep or all Americans are warmongers. Such statements (ironically) reveal the prejudice of the author.
However there is an important point somewhere within this bullshit that I’m willing to make comment on.
For many years in our industry (throughout the world) indigenous roles were filled by non-indigenous performers. Think Olivier in Othello ... or Elvis Presley in Flaming Star.
In fact the Australian film industry since its infancy has a proud record of casting aboriginal performers in aboriginal roles – a record that I doubt can be matched by any other country (including New Zealand).
Of course no-one can argue for the awful prejudice that infected our work practices in the past, and this continues everywhere in the world (including – and not only – Australia).
However in the theatre world that I inhabit we now cast according to talent. Anything else would be tokenism.
We did not (and would not, and could not) ask our auditionees about their ethnicity, and we do not (and would not and could not) cast anyone because they had a particular background.
Apart from the illegality and dubious morality of such practices, it would contradict the message of Priscilla – which is one of equality, acceptance and non-discrimination.
It happens that we have employed a performer with an aboriginal background, and he has a prominent (leading) role in the scene referred to by the second hand friend.
Maybe they were sitting a long way from the stage – in which case they’re guilty of assumption.
The further assumption that aboriginal performers can be identified by their look on stage reveals in them the prejudice they wrongly see in us, and compounds the hypocrisy.
A look at the programme would have saved them from their misconceptions and prejudices (and – I hope – the embarrassment that this explanation visits on them).
If you think for more than a moment about the implications contained in this e-mail exchange – then the transexual roles would only be filled by transexuals, the drag roles only filled by drag queens, you’d have to be gay to play a gay role - and our very talented aboriginal performer would not appear in those scenes without an aboriginal presence.
I’m happy to address this further with anyone who has seen the show.
Actually – no, that’s not true.
I’m happy to address this further with anyone who has seen the show and does not subscribe to such nonsense sentiments.
Shuggy:
--- Quote from: Tick on November 02, 2006, 04:22:21 am ---I’m one of the producers of Priscilla, someone alerted me to this exchange.
Firstly, can I make the rather obvious point that none of you has seen the show!
Whatever the nature of your responses, the bandwagon you’re leaping on is based on a second hand report (which happens to be inaccurate).
I should ignore any messages which contain such overwhelming generalisations as ‘Australians are racist and heartless’
--- End quote ---
The one who's generalising is you. Neither I nor anyone else said any such thing.
--- Quote --- - I’m not interested in joining an exchange in which a directly racist e-mail makes the charge of implied racism (do any of you realise this?).
--- End quote ---
Australians are a race? But as above.
--- Quote ---I see no point in answering people who hold such views – with equal legitimacy (meaning none!) I might write that all New Zealand men are uncommonly fond of their sheep or all Americans are warmongers. Such statements (ironically) reveal the prejudice of the author.
--- End quote ---
Thank you for not saying those, then. So why did you mention them, if not to have the beneifit of saying them without the consequences of doing so?
--- Quote ---However there is an important point somewhere within this bullshit that I’m willing to make comment on.
For many years in our industry (throughout the world) indigenous roles were filled by non-indigenous performers. Think Olivier in Othello ... or Elvis Presley in Flaming Star.
In fact the Australian film industry since its infancy has a proud record of casting aboriginal performers in aboriginal roles – a record that I doubt can be matched by any other country (including New Zealand).
--- End quote ---
You'd be wrong there. Our earlierst movies with Maori characters used Maori as cast. The few shameful exceptions (eg the one based on "Spinster" that used Hawai`ians for Maori) were American productions made in NZ - and they were criticised for it at the time. Just don't even START comparing Australia with NZ for race relations.
--- Quote ---Of course no-one can argue for the awful prejudice that infected our work practices in the past, and this continues everywhere in the world (including – and not only – Australia).
However in the theatre world that I inhabit we now cast according to talent. Anything else would be tokenism.
--- End quote ---
It can also be called authenticity. With obvious exceptions, the sex of the performer matches the sex of the character, for example.
--- Quote ---We did not (and would not, and could not) ask our auditionees about their ethnicity, and we do not (and would not and could not) cast anyone because they had a particular background.
Apart from the illegality and dubious morality of such practices, it would contradict the message of Priscilla – which is one of equality, acceptance and non-discrimination.
It happens that we have employed a performer with an aboriginal background, and he has a prominent (leading) role in the scene referred to by the second hand friend.
Maybe they were sitting a long way from the stage – in which case they’re guilty of assumption.
The further assumption that aboriginal performers can be identified by their look on stage
--- End quote ---
Apparently it wasn't just the look. They were unable to detect anything of the aboriginal ambience they identified in the film, which as a previous poster has detailed, gave the scene its meaning.
--- Quote --- reveals in them the prejudice they wrongly see in us, and compounds the hypocrisy.
A look at the programme would have saved them from their misconceptions and prejudices (and – I hope – the embarrassment that this explanation visits on them).
If you think for more than a moment about the implications contained in this e-mail exchange – then the transexual roles would only be filled by transexuals, the drag roles only filled by drag queens,
--- End quote ---
For authenticity and to correct the discrimination of the past, it would make a lot of sense if they were at least given preference. They have trouble enough finding roles. Lovely though Olympia Dukakis is, I felt it was cheating to have her play Mrs Madrigal in "Tales of the City" - it's hardly surprising that everyone thought she was a genetic woman, because she was. Does it work the other way? Can a drag queen expect to be cast as Stanley Kowalski or Hercules?
--- Quote --- you’d have to be gay to play a gay role
--- End quote ---
No, that does not follow, because gayness is not (necessarily) visible.
--- Quote --- - and our very talented aboriginal performer
--- End quote ---
Anyone else detect a note of patronage here?
--- Quote --- would not appear in those scenes without an aboriginal presence.
--- End quote ---
Well the "aboriginal presence" in this scene seemed to my friends more like an "aboriginal absence".
--- Quote ---I’m happy to address this further with anyone who has seen the show.
Actually – no, that’s not true.
I’m happy to address this further with anyone who has seen the show and does not subscribe to such nonsense sentiments.
--- End quote ---
The show is your baby, and I'm sure it's lovely in every way.
Katie77:
Shuggy.....why dont you accept what this bloke has written, and admit that the information that you were given originally about the casting in the show, was wrong.
I think we should be thankful, that someone, who has first hand knowledge of the show and the casting process, has bothered to answer this thread, and set the record straight, once and for all.....I think he has explained things very clearly and politely and he should be respected for that.
The reason you wrote this thread in the first place, was to make mention of the fact that you were told that there was no aboriginal actors in that particular scene, you have now been told that this is information is incorrect.....what more can you say about it?
I believe now, that you are still trying to use this incorrect information, just to abuse Australians generally, and I take offence at that......this is not the place to do that and you should remember that this board is not a place to insult people who live in other countries.....I, as an Aussie, find your comments, not very nice, as I'm sure, the yanks, germans, english and others here from all over the world, would be insulted if you generalised them as being racist or "cutting the heart out of things"....please, dont be so rude, wake up to yourself.
Hey Shuggy.....Lets agree to disagree.....i've met some great Kiwis, as I am sure you have probably met some nice Aussies....hey mate, we are neighbours....how about we act like good neighbours....
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