The World Beyond BetterMost > Anything Goes
Gays in Ancient Egypt and Other Civilizations
David In Indy:
--- Quote from: Kerry on January 21, 2007, 03:00:38 am ---Your wish is my command, David! Consider it done! ;D
--- End quote ---
Aww! Thank you Kerry! :-*
Native Americans had some interesting ways of identifying gay people. Quite often they would test potential wink'te at a very young age. If the Mother of a child suspected the child was gay, she would mention this to the spiritual leader of the tribe.
One common test they used (at least in many of the various Sioux tribes) was the "Basket or Bow" test. A ring was constructed using highly flammable material such as dry brush and sticks, and two objects were placed in the center of the ring; a basket and a bow. The child was instructed to enter the ring just as the dry brush was ignited. They would then tell the child to pick up only one object and exit the ring. If the child was male, the elders would consider the results of this test "positive" if he grabbed the basket instead of the bow.
The child would also be questioned extensively by the pejuta wacasa (medicine man) or the wicasha wakan (holy man) who, as Kerry accurately pointed out, was often a gay man (wink'te). See? Even back then Native Americans believed in using their "gaydar". lol
I had to reinstall my copy of AOL a couple of weeks ago, and for some reason it wiped out all my bookmarks. I am currently looking around on the Internet for those web sites I was telling you about. Just as soon as I find them, I'll post the links. Don't worry though, I'll find them! :)
Edited for typos.
Kerry:
--- Quote from: David925 on January 21, 2007, 05:30:02 pm ---The child would also be questioned extensively by the pejuta wacasa (medicine man) or the wicasha wakan (holy man) who, as Kerry accurately pointed out, was often a gay man (wink'te). See? Even back then Native Americans believed in using their "gaydar". lol
--- End quote ---
David, can I share something with you? When I was a child, long before the age of my sexual awakening, I used to go to the local cinema on a Saturday afternoon to watch the latest “Cowboys & Indians” movie. My attention was always drawn to the Indians. I guess it was a combination of things – their exotic dress, beads, feathers, war paint. And guess which member of the tribe fascinated me the most? It was the guy with the coolest headdress of the lot. The guy with the buffalo headdress. The Medicine Man. When I was a little boy, I would have done anything to have one of those buffalo headdresses! And now what is it that you’re telling me, David? That this guy I singled out for special attention was gay? Well, how’s that for finely-tuned, early-advent gaydar? And I didn’t even know it!
:)
Kerry:
It was all Hollywood fantasy with the buffalo headdress, wasn't it? :-\ Go ahead, you can tell me. I can take the truth LOL! :)
David In Indy:
--- Quote from: Kerry on January 22, 2007, 12:24:53 am ---It was all Hollywood fantasy with the buffalo headdress, wasn't it? :-\ Go ahead, you can tell me. I can take the truth LOL! :)
--- End quote ---
Hey Kerry. I know Hollywood likes to inject a lot of "fanfare" in their movies, but in reality I think it varied from tribe to tribe. I really don't know too much about all the different ceremonial costumes used. I do know the Sioux quite often painted their faces, especially just before and after a battle or a hunt.
--- Quote from: Kerry on January 21, 2007, 06:39:31 pm ---David, can I share something with you? When I was a child, long before the age of my sexual awakening, I used to go to the local cinema on a Saturday afternoon to watch the latest “Cowboys & Indians” movie. My attention was always drawn to the Indians. I guess it was a combination of things – their exotic dress, beads, feathers, war paint. And guess which member of the tribe fascinated me the most? It was the guy with the coolest headdress of the lot. The guy with the buffalo headdress. The Medicine Man. When I was a little boy, I would have done anything to have one of those buffalo headdresses! And now what is it that you’re telling me, David? That this guy I singled out for special attention was gay? Well, how’s that for finely-tuned, early-advent gaydar? And I didn’t even know it!
:)
--- End quote ---
Well, I think I've heard roughly 5 - 10 percent of the population is gay. My guess is this was probably also true hundreds of years ago. Therefore, it wouldn't be too unusual for tribes to find themselves without a gay tribal member. I also suspect that just because a person was gay, he or she wouldn't automatically become a spiritual leader of the tribe. They might have had other skills or talents that would better serve the tribe (musician, dancer, etc). The gay person certainly would have been an elevated and valued member of the tribe, no matter what he or she did. But yeah, quite often if the tribe was blessed with a wink'te, he or she would be placed in some sort of religious position, including a holy man.
I'm not sure if my tribe (Oglala Lakota) actually used a Buffalo headdress, but I don't see why they wouldn't.
I remember my Mother telling me our tribe did sometimes "adopt" non Native people into the tribe (think "Dances With Wolves"). She also told me our tribe sometimes would adopt a non Native gay person. Obviously back then, gay people were chastised and cast out of White communities. When this happened, the Sioux would adopt the gay person. I have not been able to verify this in books or the Internet, but I have no reason to doubt my Mother's word. This often happened in the South during the years of slavery. Escaped slaves would sometimes flee to the Native American tribes in the area (Cherokee, Choctaw, Seminole, etc) and assimilate rather than risk fleeing to the North and getting caught by the local regulators. So, the Sioux weren't the only tribes to "adopt" non Native people. Many tribes in North America did it.
TXdoug:
David...may I ask what your personal Sioux/Ogala Lakota tribe name is ? :)
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