Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
Ennis and Jake are homosexuals, bi-sexuals or??
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: ednbarby on March 25, 2007, 05:54:29 pm ---You imply that I'm presuming things, and yet you're presuming an awful lot based on your interpretation of the movie, too.
--- End quote ---
It really does depend on your interpretation of the movie, and how you understand that parts that are hinted at but not spelled out. There aren't always right and wrong answers.
My interpretation is close to Barb's. I don't think Ennis had anything beyond mild nonsexual affection for Alma, and maybe not even that for Cassie. He sounds pvery uninterested in either when he talks to Jack about them. Similarly, I think any love Jack had for Lureen is of the good-friends type.
Maybe gay vs. bi is also a matter of interpretation and personal definition. But to me, it's less based on whether a person is sexually functional with someone of the opposite gender than whether they are sexually attracted to people of the opposite gender. I see no sign that Jack and Ennis are attracted to women.
RossInIllinois:
--- Quote from: ednbarby on March 25, 2007, 05:54:29 pm ---First of all, we all know Ennis never had sex - period - before Brokeback because he tells Jack so. And he's not one to lie. "You may be a sinner, but I ain't yet had the opportunity." At this point, we can be fairly certain it isn't gay sex Ennis is talking about, but sex in general.
And to say that he was madly in love with Alma before Brokeback is what's really being presumptuous. 1. We know Ennis is a virgin. 2. We know Ennis plans to marry Alma when he comes down off the mountain. And yet it is with Jack that he shares his family and childhood history in a way we can be fairly certain he hasn't shared with Alma. How can we be? Because he says so. "Hell... That's the most I spoke in a year." He's spoken more in that one conversation with Jack than he spoke in a whole year with Alma. Does that not tell you something? Anything?
And just because he is in denial about his own homosexuality does not make him any less homosexual.
Also, if we look at the short story, there is even more evidence. What he says about Alma there is this: "I love my girls. And Alma? This ain't her fault." There is no "I love Alma" or "I thought I loved Alma once." Just "I love my girls" and "This ain't [Alma's] fault."
You imply that I'm presuming things, and yet you're presuming an awful lot based on your interpretation of the movie, too.
Let's just agree to disagree on this. You will no sooner convince me that Ennis is anything but predominantly homosexual any sooner than I'll convince you that he's anything but straight.
Truce?
--- End quote ---
Do we know Ennis didn't have sex??? Im not so sure about that one. I wouldn't think a 19 YO kid would think of sex as sinning... I could be wrong. The short states "nothin heed done before" no instructions needed ( ;D hehehe my hero!) Proulx isn't very clear on this statement as sex in general or anal sex with a guy. You could be right. We do learn Ennis has good aim with both guns however! Piece of cherry cake indeed! :P
ednbarby:
I think Ennis is talking about sex in general here because he is in *deep* denial about his own sexuality. Do you really think he'd be telling Jack at this point that he'd never had sex with a man before? In the early 60s (as it is now in some circles), pre-marital sex was considered a sin. They still call kids born out of wedlock "bastards."
I mean, my God - Ennis couldn't even admit to himself that he had loved a man until he said, "Jack, I swear." 20 years later and who knows how long after Jack's death. So you think he's referring to anal sex when he's 19?
Artiste:
Wow, wow, wow, wow!!!!
Thanks very, very, very much all of you!!!!!!!!!!
This information is interesting!!
There are different types of gay sex and/or relationships, same for bi-men, for heterosexuals, and by others,
it seems more evident now.
It remains that at 19 Ennis said to Jack that he had not sex yet. At 19 then, one does think about sex or does not??
Still... a puzzle!! At what age and time sex was an allure for Ennis?? For Jack too??
Why the mention of religion, was that NOT then too?? During that same conversation?? And that made a difference if you were/are gay, bi-, hetero, and/or of other orientation??
Hugs!!
brokebackjack:
Le Truce!!!!!!
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