Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
Where is the hay fun in the Brokeback Mountain film?
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: Phillip Dampier on April 03, 2007, 09:45:04 am ---Proulx doesn't want her story mixed up in the American popular culture myth of what represents a cowboy.
... By trying to avoid (and it frankly didn't work) the "cowboy" label, Proulx was trying to stay real, and away from doing battle with the pop culture iconography of the cowboy. The challenge of the image of the cowboy would be seen by all the usual "culture warrior" suspects as another attempt to usurp and destroy their cultural icons and images.
--- End quote ---
Very informative post, Phillip! I didn't know all that about the grass mats, etc.
But I'm surprised that Proulx's intention was NOT to have her story take on the cultural mythology surrounding cowboys. To me, part of the story's power derives from that very thing, that cowboys are seen as the ultimate "macho" icon and therefore widely presumed straight. I've always assumed that undermining those assumptions was Proulx's deliberate and brilliant intention.
I know technically Jack and Ennis are not cowboys, but close enough. If everything else were the same about the story and movie, except that the men were letter carriers or accountants or dentists or bus drivers, I think something would be lost.
Artiste:
Thanks ineedcrayons!
Yes, I did too find what Phillip Dampier about those grass mats a surprise!!
Ineedcrayons you say this:
I know technically Jack and Ennis are not cowboys, but close enough.
...
May I say the same as you here, as Ennis and Jack are like cowboys to me, as well as ranch hands!!
Ennis and Jack, they both did rodeos??
Hugs!!
Phillip Dampier:
--- Quote from: ineedcrayons on April 03, 2007, 01:43:04 pm ---Very informative post, Phillip! I didn't know all that about the grass mats, etc.
But I'm surprised that Proulx's intention was NOT to have her story take on the cultural mythology surrounding cowboys. To me, part of the story's power derives from that very thing, that cowboys are seen as the ultimate "macho" icon and therefore widely presumed straight. I've always assumed that undermining those assumptions was Proulx's deliberate and brilliant intention.
I know technically Jack and Ennis are not cowboys, but close enough. If everything else were the same about the story and movie, except that the men were letter carriers or accountants or dentists or bus drivers, I think something would be lost.
--- End quote ---
In this case, she wanted authenticity over folklore, which is why she went with ranch hands. In one of the first specials we'll have on Radio 2, I'll be including a feature interview with Proulx where she gets seriously annoyed with the interviewer the moment he says "cowboys." She has been very insistent on this point. She got the idea of the story after sitting in a Wyoming bar/restaurant where an obviously gay couple came in to be served. The moment they left, the owner/bartender started making a lot of loud, disparaging comments about the couple, which Proulx overheard. The contemplation of what life must have been like for someone growing up in Wyoming and confronting their homosexuality sparked the idea for the story. She wanted the two guys to be working class/poor and being otherwise considered "straight" in their interests and attitudes.
She never intended to make a sweeping societal statement or to bust stereotypes. She wanted to tell a story based on what life must be like for those who, like Jack and Ennis, grew up in a culture and society that has few, in any, resources for gay people. In the 1960s, in all but the largest cities, the issue was rarely, if ever discussed. Even into the early 1970s, there was a moratorium on exploring the issue. Remember shows like Ironside and Streets of San Francisco? How many gay folks were portrayed in those shows set in a city hip deep in them? :)
Imagine you're in rural Wyoming in the 1960s, and it's amazing they even knew what words to use to deny themselves.
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: Phillip Dampier on April 03, 2007, 07:04:54 pm ---The contemplation of what life must have been like for someone growing up in Wyoming and confronting their homosexuality sparked the idea for the story. She wanted the two guys to be working class/poor and being otherwise considered "straight" in their interests and attitudes.
She never intended to make a sweeping societal statement or to bust stereotypes. She wanted to tell a story based on what life must be like for those who, like Jack and Ennis, grew up in a culture and society that has few, in any, resources for gay people.
--- End quote ---
Oh, OK. Well, that makes sense, too. And of course it's natural that Annie would set her story in a Western millieu, since that's what she writes about, and ranch hand is a typical working-class Western job. And having them take a summer job together in an isolated sheep-grazing area is a good way to get the plot going.
Still, I don't mind if the story undermines overmythologized icons at the same time. If John Wayne is turning in his grave (as a few Hollywood types commented around last year's academy awards), it doesn't bother me. Figuratively speaking, I mean; I don't necessarily have anything against John Wayne, specifically. ;D
Artiste:
Thanks Phillip Dampier!
Very, very interesting is your comment here:
In this case, she wanted authenticity over folklore, which is why she went with ranch hands. In one of the first specials we'll have on Radio 2, I'll be including a feature interview with Proulx where she gets seriously annoyed with the interviewer the moment he says "cowboys." She has been very insistent on this point. She got the idea of the story after sitting in a Wyoming bar/restaurant where an obviously gay couple came in to be served. The moment they left, the owner/bartender started making a lot of loud, disparaging comments about the couple, which Proulx overheard. The contemplation of what life must have been like for someone growing up in Wyoming and confronting their homosexuality sparked the idea for the story. She wanted the two guys to be working class/poor and being otherwise considered "straight" in their interests and attitudes.
She never intended to make a sweeping societal statement or to bust stereotypes. She wanted to tell a story based on what life must be like for those who, like Jack and Ennis, grew up in a culture and society that has few, in any, resources for gay people.
...
When did Annie say she was in that bar where she say two gay guys? May I ask?
And when was that interview done?
So great to get your news,
hugs!!
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