Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
Easter in the story and/or movie, and that religious word!! ??
Artiste:
Thanks Lynne!!
You say this:
Some interpretations of Brokeback Mountain suggest that the whole film is essentially an Easter story...I won't go through the whole analysis here, but the gist of it is that Jack is a Christ figure and that it is through the sacrifice of Jack's death that Ennis finds forgiveness and life.
The most direct reference to Easter that I can think of is the 'My Mama believes in the Pentecost' scene where Jack confuses the Pentecost with the Rapture. The Pentecost refers to the Holy Spirit being sent to the world after the resurrection of Christ on Easter.
...
May I comment too:
1 - I do find too that Jack is Christ in some ways!! Gays do get killed for nothing!! I had to save my life!!
And I think that Annie had no choice but to make it like an Easter story!!
It is a great choice, in order to wake up all humans to become civil, more!!
I say that especially gays need to think about this too as we need to be protected, etc., in many ways!!
As gays are getting killed because they are homosexuals as the reason... and that maybe Annie see this as it will get worst... like the islamic so-called religion do NOT accept gays, since they lined them up by the 100 or 1000's to be killed, yes murdered, by their governments, like in Iran to-day!!
As the muslims take over more and more countries, even our democratic countries in the USA, Canada, England, France, etc., they do not respect gays!!
2 - Explain to me more that rapture, and/or Pentecost??
Hugs!!
Lynne:
--- Quote from: Artiste on April 07, 2007, 02:20:49 pm ---It is a great choice, in order to wake up all humans to become civil, more!!...
Explain to me more that rapture, and/or Pentecost??
--- End quote ---
It is a good interpretation. I like how the one true Christian we see in the film is Mrs. Twist through her loving acceptance of Ennis, knowing his relationship with Jack, and her efforts to share and ease Ennis' pain.
I'm no Biblical scholar so I got this from wikipedia and I've decided I'm confused myself:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pentecost
Pentecost (Greek πεντηκοστή [ἡμέρα], pentekostē [hēmera], "the fiftieth day") is the fiftieth day after Easter Sunday, which corresponds to the tenth day after Ascension Thursday. It is a feast in the Christian liturgical calendar — symbolically related to the Jewish festival of Shavuot — that commemorates the descent of the Holy Spirit upon the Apostles and the followers of Jesus on that day, as described in the Book of Acts, Chapter 2. Pentecost is also called Whitsun or Whit Sunday in the UK and other English-speaking areas.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judgment_Day
In Christian eschatology, the Last Judgment or Day of the Lord is the simultaneous judgment of every human, after the resurrection of the dead, before the Great White Throne by Jesus Christ to either eternal life or oblivion in the lake of fire at the end of time. Salvation is granted by Grace based on the individual's surrender and commitment to Jesus Christ. A second particular judgment called the Bema Seat judgment occurs after salvation (or simultaneously) is discerned when awards are granted based on works toward heavenly treasures. What happens after death and before the final judgment is hotly contested; some believe all people sleep in Sheol until the resurrection, others believe Christians dwell in heaven and pagans wander the earth, and others consider the time to pass instantaneously. Nevertheless, the body is not fully redeemed until after Death is destroyed after the Great Tribulation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rapture
In conservative Protestant Christian eschatology, the rapture ("harpazo" in Greek in 1 Thessalonians 4:17) is the name given to the event in which all Christians living on earth are simultaneously transported to Heaven to be with Jesus Christ. This is a common belief among Fundamentalists, Evangelicals, Pentecostals, Baptists, and many independents. While almost all Christian groups believe that those who are saved will have eternal life, the term "rapture" is applied specifically to the event in which all Christians on earth simultaneously ascend to join Christ, and are transformed into immortal bodies.
There's plenty of more reading (and confusion) if you follow the wiki links. I'm now wondering if I've been misinterpreting Jack's explanation to Ennis of the Pentecost - something like 'when fellas like you and me march off to hell..' This seems more like Jack is referring to Judgment Day than Rapture, because Rapture focuses specifically on the ascension of the saved into Heaven. I think I've been confusing the two myself.
-Lynne
Artiste:
Thanks Lynne!!
It is confusing? Annie talks about the Pentacost; so does the film??
Maybe the 2 scriptwriters added and/or changed Annie's words or added their own words??
So, you say that maybe Jack says this: 'when fellas like you and me march off to hell',
so Ennis replies to that as he says he is a virgin!!?? It seems... so, in the film!!
Wonder how many times hell is mentioned in Annie's story??
So if it is not rapture, then it is what??
Rapture maybe in a sense since Jack had Ennis's shirt in his??
Awaiting your news,
hugs!!
Lynne:
--- Quote from: Artiste on April 07, 2007, 04:14:12 pm ---Thanks Lynne!!
It is confusing? Annie talks about the Pentacost; so does the film??
Maybe the 2 scriptwriters added and/or changed Annie's words or added their own words??
So, you say that maybe Jack says this: 'when fellas like you and me march off to hell',
so Ennis replies to that as he says he is a virgin!!?? It seems... so, in the film!!
Wonder how many times hell is mentioned in Annie's story??
So if it is not rapture, then it is what??
Rapture maybe in a sense since Jack had Ennis's shirt in his??
Awaiting your news,
hugs!!
--- End quote ---
Annie writes that "...[Jack] favored a sad hymn, Water Walkin' Jesus, learned from his mother who believed in the Pentecost...'
The screenwriters turn that into a conversation where Ennis questions Jack...I can't quote it verbatim, but along the lines of 'What is the Pentecost? My folks, uh, they was Methodists.' This always strikes me as sweetly innocent - that Ennis doesn't understand that Methodists would also believe in the Pentecost.
As far as I know, it's a basic tenet of most if not all Christian religions. Ennis lost his mother when he was young, though, so I doubt she had the opportunity to teach him all she would have wanted to. Though certainly, Ennis' father managed to scar him irreparably in the short time he was alive.
And then, of course, the script goes on with the joke...'You may be a sinner, but I ain't yet had the opportunity,' which I think is commonly accepted to be Ennis' declaring his virginity to Jack.
My confusion surrounds what exactly Jack is talking about when he says 'guys like you and me, marching off to hell.' I now think he has the Pentecost confused with the Final Judgment. Earlier, I mistakenly said the Rapture.
Regarding how many times hell is mentioned, that's an interesting question. There's plenty of swearing, but in terms of its use as a noun, I'm not sure - it'd be interesting to analyze it, I would think.
Artiste:
Thanks Lynne!
You say this:
Jack is talking about when he says 'guys like you and me, marching off to hell.'
...
Could I think that Jack says that queers like Ennis and he (Jack) are marching to hell (difficulties) since we are homosexuals ?? Then, in those days especially, being gay was being qualitfied a queer by society, which imprisoned gays and even placed many and/or all in asylums (as you were considered crasy)!! Hell is being gay therfore, then and now to many homosexuals, right??
Awaiting your news on this,
hugs!!
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