Author Topic: Would it have worked? Merged with "Would a SWEET LIFE ever have been possible?"  (Read 51649 times)

Offline Penthesilea

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All things considered, I really think their best bet might have been for Jack to buy a house near Riverton. That way they could be together a lot -- seemingly as "friends," hanging out -- but Ennis could still keep his job, his daughters and hopefully his peace of mind.

I've often wondered why this solution comes so rarely up in discussions - and never between Ennis and Jack (so far we can tell).
Any Kind of compomise: why didn't Jack divorce (in the later years) and start a ranch on his own near Riverton?  Maybe an one or two hours drive away? Or find himself a salesjob? He asked Ennis to move to Texas, but he himself did not make a move.
Ot both could have moved to an area in the middle of Childress and Riverton. I'm sure there's plenty of rural country between. Even if they had lived in two neighbour villages, it would have been better than what they had.

Offline Jeff Wrangler

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All those trips Jack makes to Lightning Flat to help out his old man, even though the old man despises him? That's one of the things I admire the most about Jack.

I'm an only child, too.
"It is required of every man that the spirit within him should walk abroad among his fellow-men, and travel far and wide."--Charles Dickens.

Offline ednbarby

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Ah, but there was always the dance they did.  Jack was so crushed after Ennis blew him off after the divorce, it took him a whole helluva lot of time to work up the courage to even suggest Ennis leave Riverton - and even then, he only did it because he saw an opportunity in it from Ennis saying he felt exposed, basically, in Riverton.  And knowing how exposed Ennis felt there, at that point Jack must have thought Riverton wasn't an option - that the only way he'd get him to budge would be to get him "outta there."
No more beans!

Offline ednbarby

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All those trips Jack makes to Lightning Flat to help out his old man, even though the old man despises him? That's one of the things I admire the most about Jack.

I'm an only child, too.

I admire it, too.  And it reminds me of my husband and all the trips he took up to Columbus, Georgia over the last few years to help his old man take care of his ailing mother, and in the last year to help his now ailing father.  He's not an only child, but he's the oldest of three, and has for whatever reasons always cared a whole lot more about what his father thinks of him than his siblings do.
No more beans!

Scott6373

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Ok, this is a serious reposne to this.

Since I am not sure of the sex (or sexual leaning) of everyone who has responded thus far, please forgive the generlization.

We are talking about 1983.  I am gay and in 1983, there was no way I could have been in any kind of openly gay relationship (and I was out then), and I lived in Boston.  Gay men and women and those with transgender issues, were tolerated, but still hidden, and still considered socially deviant.  "Will and Grace" was a long way off.

It is a tough thing not to impose out modern day sensibilites on the situation back in 1983, either for me or for the fictional Ennis and Jack in their rural setting, which no doubt was far more oppresive than where I was.

That being said, Ennis would never had a moment to breathe easy let alone come to terms with his sexuality.  He could barely acknowledge the love he had for Jack, until forced to by Jack's death.

While the love they felt was certainly enough to sustain a relationship, emotional, and societal pressures would have surely driven them apart eventually.  Neither one had enough emotional stability to forge ahead despite the oppostino they would face.  I had seen that happen to many of my friedns back then.  It happened to me.

It's just a fact of life 25 or so years ago, that gay relationships were not supported or condoned, and they were always outed eventually.

Offline jpwagoneer1964

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I think Ennis and Jack would have worked. Their compatability was established in the first few days in their relationship. They may not have been able to be together until after their kids were grown and had Jack managed to keep himself alive they would have ended up together.
Thank you Heath and Jake for showing us Ennis and Jack,  teaching us how much they loved one another.

Offline serious crayons

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We are talking about 1983.  I am gay and in 1983, there was no way I could have been in any kind of openly gay relationship (and I was out then), and I lived in Boston.  Gay men and women and those with transgender issues, were tolerated, but still hidden, and still considered socially deviant.  "Will and Grace" was a long way off.

It is a tough thing not to impose out modern day sensibilites on the situation back in 1983, either for me or for the fictional Ennis and Jack in their rural setting, which no doubt was far more oppresive than where I was.

I'm glad you said this, Scott. I think people tend to criticize Ennis for not accepting Jack's plan, as if it would have been a simple, carefree decision had he not been so obstinate and selfish and inconsiderate and unable to appreciate what he had.

Ennis did, indeed, struggle with internalized homophobia, and that is sad. But when we disregard the real obstacles they would have faced as a couple, and Ennis' pragmatic awareness of them, we are applying our contemporary attitudes to a very different time and place.

Offline ednbarby

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I'm glad you said this, Scott. I think people tend to criticize Ennis for not accepting Jack's plan, as if it would have been a simple, carefree decision had he not been so obstinate and selfish and inconsiderate and unable to appreciate what he had.

Ennis did, indeed, struggle with internalized homophobia, and that is sad. But when we disregard the real obstacles they would have faced as a couple, and Ennis' pragmatic awareness of them, we are applying our contemporary attitudes to a very different time and place.

I agree.  We can't be too hard on poor Ennis.  He was not merely being selfish or foolish.  He was fearing for his life and Jack's and had every reason to do so - even more reason than anyone else, including Jack, given his experience.  And the time and place, of course.

My answer here assumed that they lived in a much more perfect world than they really did.  It was really entirely hypothetical.  I looked at it like this: if the (very formidable) obstacles were removed, would their love have been as intense, or were the obstacles part of what made their love so intense?
No more beans!

Offline serious crayons

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My answer here assumed that they lived in a much more perfect world than they really did.

Where bluebirds sing and there's a whiskey spring?  :)

Under those conditions, I bet their love would be like most couples'. The obstacles probably did intensify the brilliant charge of their infrequent couplings. If they were together for the long haul, the love probably wouldn't be as intensely passionate, but could easily be strong and secure and lasting.

Offline opinionista

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I'm glad you said this, Scott. I think people tend to criticize Ennis for not accepting Jack's plan, as if it would have been a simple, carefree decision had he not been so obstinate and selfish and inconsiderate and unable to appreciate what he had.

Ennis did, indeed, struggle with internalized homophobia, and that is sad. But when we disregard the real obstacles they would have faced as a couple, and Ennis' pragmatic awareness of them, we are applying our contemporary attitudes to a very different time and place.


IMO Ennis turns Jack down for several reasons. His internal homophobia was just one of those reasons, perhaps the strongest one but certainly not the only one. Despite of his internal turmoils, Ennis was a down to earth person, unlike Jack who was more of a dreamer.
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.