TOTW 16/07: Did Alma Jr. know Ennis was gay?

[Penthesilea]

Howdy BetterMostians,

after having a Brokeback Thanksgiving quiz last week, we're back to our regular TOTW today.
This week's topic involves a bit of conjecture, since we only have few indication for one opinion or the other. But even though there's no definite evidence about it, we can still have our own thoughts on it, can't we?

And we want to hear your take on it, so share it with us. 

Did Alma Jr. know Ennis was gay?

[Marge_Innavera]

IMO she'd started to wonder about it around the time (film version) that she met Cassie.  Alma Jr would have remembered meeting Jack that one time, and both girls would have noticed their father acting differently after Jack drove away. Even his posture and facial expression would have caught their attention.

Also, we don't know what happened at Alma and Monroe's house after Ennis storms out that Thanksgiving, but Alma was clearly upset enough to make remarks the girls would have wondered about. And if she told Monroe any details about the fight, would the girls not try to eavesdrop?  What they know at that point is that their father joined Alma in the kitchen right after dinner and just a few minutes later he abruptly leaves and she's yelling and smashing something.

Besides, Alma Junior and Jenny are not only from a very different generation but they also probably have much more contact with the larger world than Ennis did growing up.  By the early 1980s, homosexuality was no longer the taboo subject it had been when Ennis and Jack were the same age, so it would be surprising if they didn't at least speculate about it.

[tampatalon]

I thought that in the film that Alma Junior may have known or suspected that her father was gay by the remark to Cassie, that she was "good enough". I thought Junior's statement was opened ended because Cassie was good enough, but Jack would haven been better?

TampaTalon^">

[jstephens9]

I think Alma Jr. may have suspected that her father was involved with Jack both by his actions when Jack appeared after the divorce and by the talk I'm sure that went on between Alma and Monroe. As Marge said, I think Alma Jr. and Jenny would have known more about the existence of gay people, but I'm not so sure that the lifestyle would have been accepted at all in Wyoming. It is still not what I would call accepted in Wyoming today. For some reason I get this feeling that Alma Jr. would have referred to Jack as Ennis' friend. For whatever reason, in areas where there is acknowledgement of someone being gay, it becomes more proper to refer to someone as a friend rather than as a gay person. The word "gay" brings up all kinds of bad connotations in more rural locations from what I have seen. I do think that Alma Jr. would definitely accept Ennis if she did know he was gay. It was very obvious that she deeply and truly loved her father. I think she was quite proud of him being her father. As far as Cassie goes I do think there are indications there that Alma Jr. knows "she" would not really be what Ennis wants. I also got the feeling that Alma Jr. didn't particularly like Cassie and I wholeheartedly would agree with her on that. Yes as Steve says I think Alma Jr. would definitely think Jack would be much better.

[southendmd]

In addition to witnessing the post-divorce Jack visit, and the Thanksgiving debacle, the way Junior says to Cassie, "Maybe he's not the marrying kind..." made me think she knew about Ennis.

[Jeff Wrangler]

In addition to witnessing the post-divorce Jack visit, and the Thanksgiving debacle, the way Junior says to Cassie, "Maybe he's not the marrying kind..." made me think she knew about Ennis.

I've always thought that was kind of a strange remark. After all, he married her mother and presumably would have stayed married. It was Alma, Sr., who divorced Ennis, not the other way 'round.

[tampatalon]

In the kitchen after Thanksgiving dinner,and please excuse my paraphrase, did Alma not say about finding another woman "that me and the girls worry about you." Could this indicate that the town folk of Riverton might be running their gators that Ennis is different. The girls would surely have heard this town gossip and that confirms Ennis's preference?

TampaTalon^">

[Jeff Wrangler]

In the kitchen after Thanksgiving dinner,and please excuse my paraphrase, did Alma not say about finding another woman "that me and the girls worry about you." Could this indicate that the town folk of Riverton might be running their gators that Ennis is different. The girls would surely have heard this town gossip and that confirms Ennis's preference?

TampaTalon^">

Close enough. She says he ought to get married again, and that she and the girls worry about him being alone so much.

I've never quite known what to make of Alma's claiming that she worried about her ex-husband.

[MaineWriter]

Close enough. She says he ought to get married again, and that she and the girls worry about him being alone so much.

I've never quite known what to make of Alma's claiming that she worried about her ex-husband.

I think she still loved him. I think she divorced him because he wasn't going to do the two things a husband should do (in her mind): 1) make babies and 2) support them. I don't think she divorced him because she fell out of love with him.

L

[Jeff Wrangler]

I think she still loved him. I think she divorced him because he wasn't going to do the two things a husband should do (in her mind): 1) make babies and 2) support them. I don't think she divorced him because she fell out of love with him.

L

I agree with you, Leslie. I don't think she stopped loving him.

I'm finding myself wondering, though, if the remark about him getting married again wasn't a bit of needling. She knew darn well what she was going to bring up, that Ennis didn't go up there with "Jack Nasty" to fish, so I wouldn't be surprised if she also pretty well figured out that Ennis would never marry again.

But this discussion is supposed to be about Alma, Jr.