"Coming Out" as a Brokie.......

[Katie77]

I have read the term "coming out" lately, when referring to ourselves individually as beng a Brokie, and I thought it would make an interesting thread to hear how and when we came out of our Brokie "closet". Of course, we have always been "outed" here on Bettermost, but for some of us, we kept our "brokieness" hidden from our family and friends in real life, preferring to keep silent about how many times we had seen the movie, or how many hours we spend in here at Bettermost, or even just how many times we stay silent when we would really like to discuss something about BBM.

I know, for me, when I first saw the movie, I could not shut up about it, trying to tell people to go and see it, expecting that everyone who saw it, was going to feel exactly like I did. Instead I found that most people around me, were not real intersted in going to see a "gay cowboy" movie, and yet they still had an opinion of a movie that they had not even seen. I found  I was getting into arguments about gayness, about movies, about how "crazy" I was that I had seen a movie so many times. I saw how people shied away from me sometimes, if I mentioned BBM, shook their head as if to say, "I cant wait until she gets over this thing".

So eventually, I kept my Brokieness, silent.....I still spent many hours in the forums but kept it all to myself, sometimes I even felt like I was "sneaking" in here, looking around me, hoping no one would see what was on my computer screen. But every now and again, I would subtly do or say something, just to let people know, that it was still in my system. I framed the BBM poster and hung it on the wall in my computer room, thinking "be damned with it, if people want to make comment, let them"....I even copied some of Milli's fan-art pics of Jack and Ennis and stuck them on the drawers of my filing cabinet...that room, with my computer and my pics, became my little shrine and after a while, my family and friends got used to it. They didn't say much, but they quietly accepted me, and allowed me some "dignity" over my obsession.

And so it continued over the last couple of years, me watching the dvd, silently.....comng into Bettermost, and discussing every word, scene and expression in the movie.....and in real life, occassionally discussing something that connected me with BBM. I could come in here, and be Brokie....talk Brokie, act Brokie, love Brokie......

Then......that terrible day in January, when I awoke to the news that Heath was gone.....when my stomach felt like it was going to come up through my throat, when I felt that agony of un-acceptance, bewilderment, sadness, anger, frustration....I sat staring at the TV screen, as the news rambled on, not knowing how I was expected to react, or how I could express how I was feeling......

.....and then......my husband came to me, and put his arms around me, and held me, and without even saying the words, he was showing me, that it was OK to let go, and let the tears and the emotions flow.....

and then.......the phone calls....my sons rang me, just to say...."Are you ok, mum?".......

and then.....the emails and more phone calls from my friends......"I was thinking of you, Sue, when I heard the news"...



I knew then.....as I do now......that I had not realized that I had not been keeping my "brokieness" a secret, everyone knew, and everyone had accepted it, long before January..........I guess, it just took that tragedy, for everyone to let me know.....

Yes......MY NAME IS SUE......I AM A BROKIE......AND I AM DAM PROUD OF IT......

[forsythia12]

HI.  I'M LEIGH-ANN .....AND I'M A BROKIE.....

well, i was like you when i first saw the movie.  had to tell EVERYONE, and i assumed everyone would react the way i did, but to my dismay, most did not.  i think people saw me as kinda weird, always wanting to talk about it, or bringing it up at strange times....so, slowly, over time, people got the idea that i was hooked.  my husband has known from the start, and teases me a little, but otherwise is understanding.  but, i didn't get any phone calls when heath died.   

[Mandy21]

I couldn't be more thrilled to have an outlet for my obsession about this film.  This is where I come when I get sad, about losing Heath, or about anything else.  It is so consoling to know that others feel the same.  This isn't just a movie, one that will come and go from our memory.  This is a masterpiece, a work of art, a thing of beauty.  Each word, spoken, rings endlessly.  It's meant to do so.  Consider yourself lucky, and gifted, to be so touched by it.

I do...

[forsythia12]

I couldn't be more thrilled to have an outlet for my obsession about this film.  This is where I come when I get sad, about losing Heath, or about anything else.  It is so consoling to know that others feel the same.  This isn't just a movie, one that will come and go from our memory.  This is a masterpiece, a work of art, a thing of beauty.  Each word, spoken, rings endlessly.  It's meant to do so.  Consider yourself lucky, and gifted, to be so touched by it.

I do...

very nice, and eloquently written.  thank you.

[optom3]

I still haven't come out!!! Friends just don't get me.My kids have banned the BBM cd from the car so now I listen to it on my mp3 instead and they listen to what they want.
Most of my friends accept my peculiarities,but this seems to be a step too far for them.What annoys me is that the majority of them still have not seen it.One very close friend who I thougt might be an ally is just completely disinterested and my husband thinks I am more nuts than usual.
I am starting to feel like an alcoholic hiding drink.I watch the movie when the house is empty,and come here when evryone is out, or in bed.
The only one who understands is my 11 year old son.
He worries that I might take too many tablets like Heath.He knows I take PKs fo a shoulder and back problem,and arthritis and he knows I take anti deps.and sleepers.I have reassured him that muumy is very careful and writes down all she takes so I don't make a mistake.
He is a truly blessed child,and yet very sensitive,he asked me the other day why he was so lucky and other people had such hard times.He said it made him very sad.
He often asks questions about the film, and is sad that Heath died leaving behind such a young child.He knows our hairdresser is gay and can't understand why people have a problem with that.He just says,but he is really nice mom.

I have explained some of the film to him, and he just says that is so sad mom,I guess that is why it makes you cry.
He wants to see the film that has so captivated his mom,but I think he is a bit young yet. He cannot understand anyone being killed for loving anyone.His answer is God loves everyone doesnt he, and he is a man so he must love millions of men!!!!!



He also,bless him, if it is just us 2  in the car,says you can put the cd on mom.He is my little ray of sunshine,he will come and give me a neck massage when my migraines get bad!!!!! and asks if my cd will make it better.But he is my son and not only does he not judge me,but he  loves me and accepts me for who I am.I am his mother so can do no wrong,at the moment anyway.
It is such a pity that we cannot keep that childlike innocence,when it is all so simple and logical.He is such a mix of incredible sportsman,intelligence and sensitivity.
He got the best of my genes and his fathers.One day I will let him watch the film when he is older and if he still wants to.I think he will get it.Perhaps one day he will be on this site as well.!!!!!!

[Shasta542]

He sounds like a great kid, Optom3. Rare for a child that young to be so sensitive to others' feelings. 

[Kd5000]

PPl know that I compare every movie I see with Brokeback Mountain, even Cloverfield.     

I do agree with other posters that Bettermost and other forums have been great outlets.  I may not be the big poster, but I just love the feeling of coming to Bettermost.  Brokeback Mountain is still an edgy film (I've gotten that look!), so it's not like I can just go expressing my love for BBM at my leisure.  Sometimes, I walk around the subject with ppl, i.e. mentioning Wyoming or Annie Proulx, etc, so how ppl will respond.  Recently somebody who went to the University of WY told me that ppl there are still upset the film wasn't actually filmed in WY. I thought she was going to say ppl were upset that the film was suppose to take place in their state and that it didn't portray the state in a flattering manner.   So sometimes it pays to bring up Brokeback Mountain with ppl you aren't well acquainted with...

[Brown Eyes]

No one in my "real life" knows that I'm a Brokie.  There are some or maybe even several who know that I love Brokeback.  But in conversations about it with friends and family I usually keep my comments about it rather brief.  No one, as far as I know, in my "real life" knows about BetterMost or even about the fact that I went to Colorado last May for the Brokie BBQ.  So, yes, I'm very secretive about my Brokie identity, and for some reason I kind of like it that way.  It's fun to have a secret identity.  Of course, now too, I've met a number of Brokies in real life, so categories do begin to break down.

So, it's interesting, far more people in my "real life" know I'm a lesbian than people who know I'm a Brokie... As far as the "coming out" question goes. 

[optom3]

No one in my "real life" knows that I'm a Brokie.  There are some or maybe even several who know that I love Brokeback.  But in conversations about it with friends and family I usually keep my comments about it rather brief.  No one, as far as I know, in my "real life" knows about BetterMost or even about the fact that I went to Colorado last May for the Brokie BBQ.  So, yes, I'm very secretive about my Brokie identity, and for some reason I kind of like it that way.  It's fun to have a secret identity.  Of course, now too, I've met a number of Brokies in real life, so categories do begin to break down.

So, it's interesting, far more people in my "real life" know I'm a lesbian than people who know I'm a Brokie... As far as the "coming out" question goes. 

Same here most people know I am bi polar bit not a Brookie,how bizarre is that.I am not ashamed I just dont want to be shot down in flames by those who just don't get it.I guess It is so complex I cant explain it to myself let alone others,who have not experienced it.Bi polar is easier,just go and google it!!!!!

[Brown Eyes]

Heya,

Yep, I agree, one of the hardest parts about imagining "coming out as a Brokie" to non-Brokies in "real life" is that it would be really hard to explain.  It would be hard to convey how important and even profound the experience is for me.  I wouldn't want it to come across that this experience is simply about being something as un-complex as "being a fan."  Mostly, the idea of trying to explain it sounds sort of exhausting.

There's an old saying that goes something like... "if you have to ask you'll never know"... and to a certain extent I think this applies a bit to the experience of being a Brokie.  Those of us who are Brokies really, really know it, and understand.  And people seek out these forums and Brokie communities.  Again, it would just be hard to convey all that this means to someone who's on the "outside" of the whole experience (and especially to someone who didn't like the movie or was only lukewarm in reaction to it).

[serious crayons]

Though there's obviously more damaging homophobia in the world than there is Brokaphobia,    I think the average straight person has a better understanding of -- or at least, familiarity with -- gayness than the average non-Brokie does of Brokieism. Even if they don't like gay people, they're at least familiar with their existence and grasp their motivations at some level.

Brokieism, they just don't get at all. It doesn't make sense to people. It's kind of like being a Trekkie or Star Wars fanatic, which people probably don't fully get, either, but again are at least more familiar with.

From my experience (others may disagree), a BBM obsession is particularly confusing to people if you're straight. For gay men, I would think, the connection might seem obvious. For gay women, there are if nothing else political reasons for loving BBM. But for straight people -- what's up with that? Sure it's a good movie, but there are lots of good movies. What's the big deal about this particular one?? That's what I imagine non-Brokies thinking.

I think it makes some people even secretly question your sexual orientation. And while in principle I have no big objection to that, it can be awkward wondering if people misunderstand you in that way -- especially if it's your husband and kids! 

[optom3]

Heya,

Yep, I agree, one of the hardest parts about imagining "coming out as a Brokie" to non-Brokies in "real life" is that it would be really hard to explain.  It would be hard to convey how important and even profound the experience is for me.  I wouldn't want it to come across that this experience is simply about being something as un-complex as "being a fan."  Mostly, the idea of trying to explain it sounds sort of exhausting.

There's an old saying that goes something like... "if you have to ask you'll never know"... and to a certain extent I think this applies a bit to the experience of being a Brokie.  Those of us who are Brokies really, really know it, and understand.  And people seek out these forums and Brokie communities.  Again, it would just be hard to convey all that this means to someone who's on the "outside" of the whole experience (and especially to someone who didn't like the movie or was only lukewarm in reaction to it).

Oh that sums it up beautifully.I feel tired just thinking of trying to explain it.Also if I have to explain it then they wont get it anyway otherwise they too would be a brokie.As a sraight woman it seems een more incomprehensible to some folk.I have been called kinky,weird you name it.So now I jus keep shut up.I got do fed up with trying to explain it is a gut wrenching love story of life changing impact,to be greeted with blank looks .
I now figure it's their loss .I am enriched and they have missed something so rewarding.Closed mind syndrome is my name for it.

[Katie77]

From my experience (others may disagree), a BBM obsession is particularly confusing to people if you're straight. For gay men, I would think, the connection might seem obvious. For gay women, there are if nothing else political reasons for loving BBM. But for straight people -- what's up with that? Sure it's a good movie, but there are lots of good movies. What's the big deal about this particular one?? That's what I imagine non-Brokies thinking.

I think it makes some people even secretly question your sexual orientation. And while in principle I have no big objection to that, it can be awkward wondering if people misunderstand you in that way -- especially if it's your husband and kids! 

I agree completely......

Yes......I remember......I remember someone saying to me one time..."Why would YOU like a gay movie?"....they probably were not thinking I was gay, but more so, could not understand why a straight woman would like it......maybe they did think I might be gay....hunh.....oh well, who gives a flying f***)

I do think though, if I were a straight man, going around raving about what a great movie it was, it would most probably be taken that I had gay tendancies, and for that reason, I think that there are a lot of straight men out there, who did enjoy the movie, but keep it to themselves, and some who might never have even dared go to a public theatre to watch it, for those same reasons. And.....I think, not that those straight men are necessarily homophobic but they just do not want to be quizzed about their sexuality, just because they like a particular movie.

Similarly, the responses I received, when I would mention the movie.....from straight women, it was, more or less a response about the movie in general, the actors, or the story, or if it was slow, or if the scenery was nice.

From straight men, the response, was nearly always about the gay theme, nothing else, just the gay theme. As if it was a taboo subject to talk about let alone put up there on the big screen. Some were quietly objectionable but a few were openly hostile. I actually got a surprise, to find that a couple of my friends who I had known for many years were downright blatantly homophobic.

I think, sometimes, I mentioned BBM and my admiration for the story, to not only say what a great movie it was, but to also make a statement that I am NOT homophobic, to be able to talk openly that the love story in the movie, was as normal as any other love story, that the story is not fictional, it is happening everywhere and as long as there are people who think of it as wrong, or abnormal, then there will be tragedies, and unhappiness. All it needs is understanding and acceptance......even if the person I was talking to, did not agree directly to me, at least it gave them something to go away and think about.

I think most of us Brokies think of BBM as a love story, beautifully written, and acted out by some brilliant actors...the gay theme is part of it, not ALL of it....

I guess we should not expect outsiders to understand us completely......gee, WE didn't understand ourselves at first, thought we were crazy, wondered what was going on....we have had the people here at Bettermost to help us understand......I guess its not understanding I was looking for, it was more a bit of respect for my beliefs, and some acknowledgement that the movie, did have a real story to tell and that it was told with dignity and passion.

[Brown Eyes]

From my experience (others may disagree), a BBM obsession is particularly confusing to people if you're straight. For gay men, I would think, the connection might seem obvious. For gay women, there are if nothing else political reasons for loving BBM. But for straight people -- what's up with that? Sure it's a good movie, but there are lots of good movies. What's the big deal about this particular one?? That's what I imagine non-Brokies thinking.

I agree with this aspect of explaining Brokie-ness as being slightly confusing or difficult.  For me, it's not so much political affinity... it's more that I love a good gay love story, whether it's between men or women.  So, on the most basic level, I suppose that was my initial interest in or attraction to seeing BBM.  Of course, from there my identity as a Brokie has become hugely more complex.

Sometimes I have a "throw caution to the wind" type urge to just send a link to BetterMost to my best friend (who is a gay man) and just see what his reaction would be to my involvement with this website and the Brokie community.  But, even with him I think he wouldn't understand... and I always stop myself from "revealing my secret identity" even to him.  Although, he knows I love BBM and he did too (but his appreciation for it never, ever rose to the level of Brokie-ness or Brokie fever).

[serious crayons]

I do think though, if I were a straight man, going around raving about what a great movie it was, it would most probably be taken that I had gay tendancies, and for that reason, I think that there are a lot of straight men out there, who did enjoy the movie, but keep it to themselves, and some who might never have even dared go to a public theatre to watch it, for those same reasons.

I've known only two or three genuine Brokies who were straight men. And I'll have to say that even I have secretly at times wondered whether they were "really" straight. Which is such an odd thing to confess, for a Brokie. Because on the one hand I can't see why anyone, straight or gay, male or female, could not be as in love with the movie as I am. But I've met so few straight male Brokies that, statistically, when I think about the few people out of hundreds, I can't help sometimes wondering. Sorry, straight male Brokies, you have every reason to love BBM too, and all the more credit to you for it! 

I agree with this aspect of explaining Brokie-ness as being slightly confusing or difficult.  For me, it's not so much political affinity... it's more that I love a good gay love story, whether it's between men or women.  So, on the most basic level, I suppose that was my initial interest in or attraction to seeing BBM.  Of course, from there my identity as a Brokie has become hugely more complex.

When I say political, I mean that not only in the strictest sense but also just the sense of the empowerment and recognition from seeing such a great movie about gay people in love. I would think that, if I were gay, that aspect would take on much more weight, if only because I'd be so sick of seeing almost nothing but straight love stories in movie after movie over the years.

[Sandy]

The reason I haven’t come out properly is because I can’t take the negative reactions.   When I first saw the film, I was so overwhelmed, bewildered and exhilarated that I couldn’t think straight.  I have now got some perspective and my calm thoughts have come back but the film is so personal to me that I can’t take any criticism.  I feel safe discussing the issues here because I know I am in like-minded company.  We might not all share the same viewpoint, but the love for the film binds us.

I have a fairly open minded, mixed bunch of friends but I tentatively stuck my toe out of the closet and knew immediately that I couldn’t really confide this in them because they just wouldn’t get it.  I have thrown BBM into conversation and have actually been horrified at some of the reactions I have gotten-how can you know someone for years and not know that (for all their alleged respect for others) they are in fact a complete bigot and won’t even watch it?

As you all know, my husband has been my rock but the funny thing is that I have only recently not felt a little shy when discussing. He is upset at this because he has always backed me.  I have now completely got over this and the rate at which I chatter he probably wishes I hadn’t!  But, the comments here apply to him.  He is not a ‘Brokie’ but liked the film.  When I do (casually) chat about the film, he defends it and others (including his work colleagues) have laughed at him and slagged him off.  Not cool. 

[Brown Eyes]

Hi Sandy!

I totally agree with you about not being able to stand criticism/negative reactions about Brokeback.  I can completely sympahtize with that feeling.

[serious crayons]

I totally agree with you about not being able to stand criticism/negative reactions about Brokeback.  I can completely sympahtize with that feeling.

Me too. I'll have to say that the worst reaction I heard from anyone was kind of mild indifference or lack of sufficient enthusiasm -- no one in real life has said anything overtly homophobic to me.

But even when someone says they outright liked the movie it's not completely satisfying, because it never seems like they like it quite enough. They might say, "Yeah, that was a good movie," when what I want them to say is, "Are you kidding? Seeing it changed my life, I'm totally obsessed, I long to spend hours a day on a Brokeback website analyzing it." 

[Mandy21]

Hey Kath, I agree totally with what you said.  I have tried and tried and tried to get either/or of my two boyfriends to watch this with me, with no success yet.  They come to my house, they see the Collector's Edition of the DVD sitting bare on top of the entertainment center (no point in putting it back in its case, I'd just have to get it out again every day to watch it), they see the postcards that came with the C.E. stuck to my fridge, they see the book "BbM, Story to Screenplay" laying by my bed, they see the wallpaper on my computer of Ennis and Jack leaning up against a truck, they know I spend hours and hours every day reading this website and IMDB's website and making friends and answering and posing questions to other Brokies.  They both know all this, that this is an integral part of me.  I've known one of them for 12 years, he is the love of my life and I am his, and the other one for 8 years.

But I wonder,

do they really know me at all if they can't even sit down and watch this movie with me......

Kinda scary...

[optom3]

Hi Sandy!

I totally agree with you about not being able to stand criticism/negative reactions about Brokeback.  I can completely sympathize with that feeling.

Me too in a nutshell.I dipped my toe in the water as someone here said,and was horrified by the reaction of some of my friends.With one interesting exception.My oldest "best" friend is deeply religious ad I was talking to her re BBM.She went out and rented it.And was blown away.Her reaction surprised me in a positive way.
I don't know why.I have always loved her because she embodies for me all that religion should be,tolerance,non judgemental and forgiving.She lets the way she lives her life,speak for her faith,and it has not been an easy life!!!!
She knows my life well enough to not be surprised at my reaction to BBM in fact she said,I bet that cut pretty deep!!!
Some of my so called liberal friends have been scathing in the extreme.That hurts,as does the fact that their intolerance is something that makes me look at them in a new light.It is hard to cope with criticism of BBM ,but it is equally hard to discover some friends are not the people you thought they were.That their so called tolerance and liberalism is on the surface only,almost for show,and that if you scratch the surface you find deep rooted prejudices.
I still maintain even more that it is their problem not mine.
As an interesting codicil,I was getting my daughter tested with a psychologist for gifted school this am.We arrived,me with BBM story and screenplay in hand.When he saw it he was nearly apoplectic,and told me just to put it way.This is a Jewish man whose parents were persecuted in WW2 and had to flee to the states.So he knows all about prejudice and persecution,yet his reaction was the most extreme.I thought he would of all people understand.He dismissed it out of hand.
I once thought that the people who "got" BBM would be those who knew of,had experienced,prejudice or heartbreak on some level.Now I will have to re think.
Now I think it is more simple, be open minded and open hearted.and live and let live without judgement.

[Brown Eyes]

That sounds pretty extreme that he asked you to put your Brokeback books away!  What did you do or say to that?

[optom3]

That sounds pretty extreme that he asked you to put your Brokeback books away!  What did you do or say to that?

Yes I was really thown.When we got in the car,my daughter age 9 said well he doesn't like BBM does he!!!!!
What I did was sat in the next room to the room where he was testing daughters I.Q with door open, I left my door open.Deliberately picked up the book,plugged in the soundtrack on my MP3 player and read it.
When he entered half way through,as daughter was given a break,I just placed it down cover outermost, and politely, with clenched teeth answered his questions about my daughter.
When he had finished I made a big deal of picking up book again and engrossing myself in it.
I was truly shocked.An educated man with a masters in psychology whose own parents had so been the victims of Hitlers Jewish hatred.I was to use an English expression Gobsmacked.
What was worse was he made it plain he thought I was an idiot for reading it,no words necessary,just a look of utter disdain.I was totally disgusted.I then gave my daughter a brief edited precis of the story,and all she said was 'That's so sad",pretty much what my middle son had said.Thank goodness my own kids are open minded and free from prejudice.If I get nothing else right with them I will consider that a major achievement.
The good thing was my daughters I.Q. tested high enough for her to go to the gifted school.
It was soured by his behaviour though.

[Monika]

very interesting thread, and very interesting to read everyone´s experiences

My experience was more of a non experience. sure there are Swedish anti-gay/anti-bbm people but the whole thing has been pretty de-dramatized here. I have always make my obsessions clear to the world, actually I think I tend to flaunt them. I´m proud of them and I put up pictures of them at work etc.
I have had a few discussions though, whenever I meet someone who is anti-gay it seems it´s fysically impossible for me to shut up, and I always take the fight. But if there´s one thing I´ve learned is that it´s impossible to win that kind of argument. Those individuals must come to see the light for themselves, still it seems, I can never manage not to say something.
And then the church is not a force to be reckon with here, and myself nor my family are religious, so I don´t have those issues to deal with either.