Author Topic: Importance of the Jimbo Scene  (Read 47868 times)

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #40 on: August 21, 2008, 08:37:37 pm »
And there is a lot of bull... going on!

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #41 on: August 21, 2008, 10:57:35 pm »
Amanda, I agree with you on the interpretation of the scene entirely.

My previous post was just a "what if" kind of post, but not what I really believed happened.

Isnt it amazing how so many scenes can be inerpretted in so many ways.....

This has been a very interesting thread....ive done a lot of soul searching, while contributing to it.

Maybe you should start a smiliar one on the Randall and Jack scene.


Heya Friend!

Well, you're certainly right that there are many ways to look at different scenes.  And suggesting alternative viewpoints can definitely be helpful.

There's already a thread about Randall and Jack here in Open Forum... it was a Topic of the Week a while back called, "Did It Seem Like Jack Was Responsive to Randall's Flirtatiousness".  http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php/topic,13378.0.html

And, there's a very old, wonderful thread called "A Ninth Viewing Observation" http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php/topic,795.0.html that is all about Jack and Randall at the beginning.  That thread rambled into lots of different topics as it went along.  But, I remember it was a really fun thread... it's actually one of the classic Open Forum threads I think.

LOL, I tried to post this response over two hours ago, but my computer crashed right in the middle of me typing!! Yikes!  So, I just finished doing a system recovery... which, thankfully worked, but took most of the evening.
 :-\
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline optom3

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #42 on: August 21, 2008, 11:15:33 pm »
I think there's so much suggestiveness and tension in the way that Jack looks at Jimbo, and even the way that Jimbo looks back that there's serious flirting going on, at least from Jack's side.

Jack's going through all the classic motions of picking someone up... finding an entree or pick-up line and then the cliche of buying a drink.  As a scene in the film, I personally really do think it's meant to demonstrate the frustrations Jack encounters when trying to find a male partner prior to the reunion.
To me it would seem strange for the filmmakers to go through the effort of showing an elaborate scene where Jack is just trying to become friends with the rodeo clown.

I think there's a ton of ambiguity in the Randall encounter about who's flirting with whom, and what Jack's reactions to Randall's attentions are.  I think there's less ambiguity in the Jimbo scene.  But, with almost all aspects of BBM there's certainly room for multiple interpretations.

To me, Jack's decision to hook up with Lureen is a form of giving up.  He may partially have done it to squash rumors that might have existed about him.   But, mostly I think it's a form of reluctant resignation to an expectation that society is foisting on him with the end result being a marriage of convenience and a child he doesn't want. The bartender's comment in the Lureen scene about how much money Lureen's family makes seems to sweeten the deal slightly for Jack in this decision for him.  For Jack, I think it's as much about the money as anything else.






When I looked at the screenplay, it says ,Jack after watching Jimbo limps over to him,stands close to his shoulder. It then says. there is a frisson, a vibe,that gives the clown an uneasy feeling although he remains perfectly friendly.
That would definitely seem to imply, Jack was trying to pick him up. Jimbo feels it So could be he is another Ennis type who Jack has spotted, or he could be straight but realises what is happening.
The only thing that puzzles me now, is I would have thought that a straight man who has a man try to pick him up, would erupt. Particularly in that macho environment.Yet Jimbo does nothing.
I wonder if part of the point of the scene, is to let the viewer know, what the reader of the S.S does, that Jack has been riding more than bulls,prior to the reunion.
That being so, it could only really be with cowboys, rodeo riders, etc where he does his"riding"

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #43 on: August 22, 2008, 09:52:36 am »
Optom, I am surprised at you thinking that Jimbo does nothing !

You know what a frisson is to use your word?

Plus, Jimbo did react also AGAIN negatively in the movie towards Jack telling him off, and also creating a gang against Jack !

What is that? Nothing? Again, you miss how two men, a decent Jack, is dangered by the con artist Jimbo ?

Au revoir,
hugs!  Now, you are giving me the frisson ?
« Last Edit: August 22, 2008, 10:34:02 am by Penthesilea »

Offline Katie77

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #44 on: August 22, 2008, 09:59:06 am »
frisson
One entry found.

frisson 
   



Main Entry: fris·son 
Pronunciation: \frē-ˈsōⁿ\
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural frissons  \-ˈsōⁿ(z)\
Etymology: French, shiver, from Old French friçon, from Late Latin friction-, frictio, from Latin, literally, friction (taken in Late Latin as derivative of frigēre to be cold)
Date: 1777
: a brief moment of emotional excitement : shudder, thrill <produce a genuine frisson of disquiet — Patricia Craig> 
Being happy doesn't mean everything is perfect.

It means you've decided to see beyond the imperfection

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #45 on: August 22, 2008, 10:06:12 am »
Right Katie!

Jimbo by a frisson showed genuinely that he was ANTI-GAY!

And more ?

So why have pity on Jimbo !

I rather like Jack since at least he was the ONLY man there ! A real genuine man, a loving person!

Au revoir,
hugs!

Offline optom3

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #46 on: August 22, 2008, 10:36:15 am »
Right Katie!

Jimbo by a frisson showed genuinely that he was ANTI-GAY!

And more ?

So why have pity on Jimbo !

I rather like Jack since at least he was the ONLY man there ! A real genuine man, a loving person!

Au revoir,
hugs!

I disagree totally, he may have felt the frisson, and there is no direct reference as to whether it was Jack, him or both who felt it. But If I feel a man is comming onto me and I am not really interested, does that make me anti men. No it doesn't, it just means I am not interested in THAT man. Not the whole male population.
The use of the word frisson in the screenplay is ambiguous and deliberately so I think,the frisson makes Jimbo uneasy, but maybe that is because he, like Ennis is deeply closeted by fear. At no time does he seem threatening to Jack, in fact the screenplay says he remains perfectly friendly.

So it could be taken as the reverse of anti gay.Could be that he feels uneasy as he knows he is being watched, but that the frisson felt, is an indication that he fancies Jack, but is unwilling to admit it to himself, hence the feeling uneasy.In fact maybe Jimbo feels threatened by emotions he has, but does not understand or feel ready to accept.
He may be thinking, stupid sod, why didn't you do this somewhere else less obvious and I would have jumped your bones gladly.
As with all things BBM there are so may interpretations, all right as Proulx herself says, the story is not finished until it has been read, meaning we all have our own particular take on it, but welcome and indeed embrace the views of others. By so doing we open up our minds  to endless possibilities and the story becomes a classic, being debated, years and sometimes centuries down the line, eg, Chaucer, Steinbeck, and Shakespeare himself.
I think there is a big hint in the screenplay when it sates that Jimbo "remains perfectly friendly"

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #47 on: August 22, 2008, 10:45:02 am »

The use of the word frisson in the screenplay is ambiguous and deliberately so I think,the frisson makes Jimbo uneasy, but maybe that is because he, like Ennis is deeply closeted by fear. At no time does he seem threatening to Jack, in fact the screenplay says he remains perfectly friendly.

So it could be taken as the reverse of anti gay.Could be that he feels uneasy as he knows he is being watched, but that the frisson felt, is an indication that he fancies Jack, but is unwilling to admit it to himself, hence the feeling uneasy.In fact maybe Jimbo feels threatened by emotions he has, but does not understand or feel ready to accept.
He may be thinking, stupid sod, why didn't you do this somewhere else less obvious


Heya Fiona,

I think it's really interesting to bring the screenplay into this discussion.  And, I think this part of your comment is particularly interesting.  It seems like one really interesting possiblity regarding Jimbo... that he may have had some interest in Jack, but that the context of Jack hitting on him so publiclly made the whole situation too awkward.  I think there are at least two ways to see Jimbo's reaction based on what you mention about the screenplay.  Either it's a straightforward scenario of Jimbo being straight and truly not interested in Jack (but Jimbo remains polite, if a bit terse).  Or, he is a bit of an Ennis-type who's bottling up and trying to hide some of the feelings/attraction he may be having towards Jack or about men in general.


The fact that Jack is so relatively open about approaching a man in the context of that particular bar, even with the bartender hovering... illustrates a really cute/ sweet but naive aspect of Jack's personality I think. 

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #48 on: August 22, 2008, 11:04:38 am »
Optom, like Atz, I find it too really interesting that you bring the screenplay into the discussion, but I not that you know that I disagree with you about your intepretation of Jimbo's frisson ! ? Totally!

I will add later.

Right now was the word FRISSON used by Annie ?

Au revoir,
hugs!


Offline optom3

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #49 on: August 22, 2008, 11:11:52 am »
Heya Fiona,

I think it's really interesting to bring the screenplay into this discussion.  And, I think this part of your comment is particularly interesting.  It seems like one really interesting possibility regarding Jimbo... that he may have had some interest in Jack, but that the context of Jack hitting on him so publiclly made the whole situation too awkward.  I think there are at least two ways to see Jimbo's reaction based on what you mention about the screenplay.  Either it's a straightforward scenario of Jimbo being straight and truly not interested in Jack (but Jimbo remains polite, if a bit terse).  Or, he is a bit of an Ennis-type who's bottling up and trying to hide some of the feelings/attraction he may be having towards Jack or about men in general.


The fact that Jack is so relatively open about approaching a man in the context of that particular bar, even with the bartender hovering... illustrates a really cute/ sweet but naive aspect of Jack's personality I think. 



I agree about Jacks' naivety, we see that, when he is so surprised that Earl and Rich suffered the fate they did. He is almost childlike in his attitude, believing that if you want something enough you can get it, and why would anyone want to hurt you.
I also think that this simplistic view of life, in the early days makes Jack reckless as well.
I see some of that in my own kids, one of whom thinks he will be playing at Wimbledon and the other at the Olympics.I would never spoil those dreams for them because who knows anyway, and also if it does not happen, life will soon disillusion them.
I do not think Jack has seen enough of life yet to have his childlike naivety shattered. It is what remains so endearing about him.
Ennis by his very early teens had already lost his parents, then lost his home.He is much more battle scarred than Jack.
The scene by the lake when Ennis asks him if he thinks people know, genuinely seems to catch Jack by surprise. Ennis may be completely bottled up, but he is much more aware tahn Jack, or maybe just more paranoid.
Jack seems to exist to some degree, in his own little bubble, either blissfully unaware of what the world is really like, or if he does know, then determined to ignore it.