Author Topic: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?  (Read 242867 times)

Offline Katness

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #340 on: January 08, 2008, 10:36:51 pm »
This may be along the same lines as what others have said. However I'm not (at the moment) going to bother reading through that many posts. So here's my interpretation:

Ennis to me here, is saying several things.

"Jack, I swear I loved you since we first shook hands outside Joe Aguirre's office that day and I always will and if you were murdered, and I came to know them, who did it, they would get the thrashing of their lives. And I swear if I could go back and do things differently, then I would. I would have built us a cabin up there on Brokeback, where we could live away from the prying eyes of society. Where we could be just us"

Of course, Ennis might not be so ummmm articulate? but thats my interpretation and I'm sticking to it. *folds arms defiantly*  ;D
« Last Edit: January 09, 2008, 02:48:37 am by Katness »
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing.

If all is not lost, then where is it?

I used to have a handle on life, but it broke.

Offline Artiste

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #341 on: January 08, 2008, 11:29:11 pm »
Thanks Kateness!

Well said.

Kateness, melb, and all: I wonder if Ennis would build that cabin there, plus another elsewhere too??

Hugs!!

Offline Rayn

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #342 on: January 09, 2008, 01:26:15 am »
Rayn, I still would like to think about that 10 percent. Could it be some thing? What? Guess more...

Nah, now I told you.... it ain't gonna be that way....   See you got your ideas and that's fine, but I got mine... and they ain't the same.   Besides, all I got time for now is making a livin', so, you wanna go lookin' for that 10%, you go right ahead, but there ain't gonna be no more guessin' by me.....See, you're kinna stuck with what you got.

 I gotta go now.     ;)

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #343 on: January 09, 2008, 01:30:49 am »
This may be along the same lines as what others have said. However I'm not (at the moment) going to bother reading through that many posts. So here's my interpretation:

Ennis to me here, is saying several things.

"Jack, I swear I loved you since we first shook hands outside Joe Aguirre's office that day and I always will and if you were murdered, and I came to know them, who did it, they would get the thrashing of their lives. And I swear if I could go back and do things differently, then I would. I would have built a cabin up there on Brokeback, where we could live away from the prying eyes of society. Where we could be just us"

Of course, Ennis might not be so ummmm articulate? but thats my interpretation and I'm sticking to it. *folds arms defiantly*  ;D

Hey Kat!

That definitely would be a mouthful for our Ennis!  But, seriously, it's a lovely interpretation. 

I personally think Ennis was motivated to go look at his little shrine in the closet specifically because of the conversation about "love" with Junior.  So, I do think that it's very likely that the "word" love might be in Ennis's head as he makes this enigmatic statement.

Truly, I think the wonderful this is that the sentence is incomplete.  So all of us can fill in the rest based on our own interpretations and understandings.  It's the perfect manifestation of "completing the story" ourselves.

I love all the ambiguity that exists in BBM.  It seems to be one of the key reasons that we can discuss this endlessly.

And, you have the right instincts about some of these really old, long threads.  You certainly can just jump right in with your own comment on a topic without reading the whole thread.  I do that all the time.


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Offline Rayn

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #344 on: January 09, 2008, 02:29:00 am »
Excuse my manners!  Welcome to Bettermost Katness...Yes, that sure enough was a lovely post.

atz75, I agree with you completely on this, "I love all the ambiguity that exists in BBM.  It seems to be one of the key reasons that we can discuss this endlessly."   It's also a key to why both story and movie are so lifelike.  Life often has more uncertainty and ambiguity in it than certainty and clarity.

Ah, but those moments of clarity in between are so worth having, huh?  The dozy embrace is one of them, just a gentle song and a hug was all that was needed to say what they both felt for each other.



Offline Katness

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #345 on: January 09, 2008, 03:02:00 am »
Thank you for the welcome. I had originally written my post above as separate sentences. But then decided it would be better as one.

But, I agree Atz75, about the ambiguity of BBM. I......wait let me start that sentence again with a quote from the film itself, Well "son of a whoreson bitch" I love films that don't beat you about the head with what they are trying to say. But instead make you use your brain cells, sometimes in overdrive. And me being someone who could easily stay up 24 hours straight. I have all the time in the world to use my brain cells.

Eh, if I ramble like that a few more times. Don't mind me. It is most likely because I have not slept for close to 24 hours and I'm in deep thinking mode. That and I'm also on the autism spectrum. So I could ramble on about BBM and connect several other interests of mine to BBM in rather convoluted ways and bore everyone to sleep.....or death. So like I said don't mind me.  :P  ;D
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing.

If all is not lost, then where is it?

I used to have a handle on life, but it broke.

Offline Rayn

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #346 on: January 09, 2008, 03:09:58 am »
Thank you for the welcome.
Eh, if I ramble like that a few more times. Don't mind me
.


No prob Kat....  Ramble on, now's the time the time is now, sing your song..... ;)

Offline Katness

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #347 on: January 09, 2008, 03:15:06 am »
Cool. I only wanted to say that. Because sometimes I've been known to be told to shut up. Anyway. *steers the convo back to topic*

And that "Dozy embrace" WOWZERS. Speaking of camping I should start doing that again myself. Now that I don't live in the city anymore and more in the mountains. Head further out to Lithgow (which is sort of Northwest of where I live in the Blue Mountains) Where you have the possibility of coming face to face with a kangaroo. (looks out window in a daydream) No fun without someone by your side though. :(
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing.

If all is not lost, then where is it?

I used to have a handle on life, but it broke.

Offline Sandy

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #348 on: January 09, 2008, 08:02:44 am »
I have had difficulty with the really wrong threads as I too didn't want to repeat what someone else had said-but if that's ok with everyone else, then I'm good to go!

I agree with Katness and Amanda-everytime I watch the film and read the book, I marvel at the fact I see something else or interpret a conversation differently.  The sentence was never finished, and let's face it, it was a private thought! 

Another thing, even if Ennis had thought about his feelings for Jack,I reckon he would have pushed them to one side rather than face them. For him to have his shrine, and speak aloud shows his progression.  It took for Jack to die for him to get there and I wish he had reached that stage whilst Jack was still alive. 

Offline Rayn

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Re: "Jack, I swear..." What do you think Ennis meant by that?
« Reply #349 on: January 09, 2008, 11:19:26 am »
You know, Sandy, what you just wrote about Ennis and his shrine was actually the first time I have ever heard that observation and insight in the entire topic and I started it, so I've been with it from the git-go! 

Yes, it took Jack's death to get Ennis to speak his feelings openly, even if to Jack's memory or spirit, but I'm sure Jack never doubted Ennis' feelings, and vice versa.  In the end it was more about time..."Never enough time..."

Also, the greater part of Ennis' difficulty wasn't so much his inability to verbalize feelings, but rather it was his inability to get over this fears of being killed because they might be discovered.  That is what kept Ennis bound up inside and out too.  He lived in a prison of fear.

It's truly, and this has been said before, it's truly ironic that Ennis' fear of what happened to Rich and Earl kept Jack and Ennis' in hiding for years and then have the story end with the loss of Jack in an event that remains forever uncertain.  Was Jack murdered or was it an accident is a whole different topic I have contributed to and we shouldn't really go into here, but the sad irony of the end is profound, but not without hope.  For me, one of the great messages of the tale is, fear can kill a full expression of love and if not dealt with and overcome, it can end the exchange of love completely.

If new people like Katness or others come to this topic they needn't worry about repeating anything said before.  We all have a new and unique way of writing posts, you know?  I look at every topic as an endless conversation between new or different Brokie firends.  The function of a topic isn't to reach some final destination or conclusion, but rather it's a process of continuing communication.   People come in and out of it like they come in and out of a room.  Some listen, some add to the conversation and each person gets something from themselves out of it. 

 :)