The Reason This Place Might Not For Me

[TheStudDuck]

I talked about this in another thread... but I wanted to give it its own thread because I have a firm stand on this issue and I have a few things that I'd like everyone to hear -- especially since I was, in fact, personally attacked last week regarding something along the same lines only for everyone here to collectively act as hypocrites.

I've been the one who has been using the hidden feature... or one of them anyway... I think that there are a couple of more (at least one more)... it's me, I admit it.  I told everyone that I was sort of having a "me time" week and this feature allowed me to lurk without people hasselling me for still being here (and they actually did, by the way).

For all of you people that were filing complaints... I want to bring two things to your attention.

Number one, this is what's going on in our country today.  People are supporting our phones being wiretapped as a safety precaution.  We sacrifice freedom for security.  That's what you're doing.  I'm a registered user who has not caused any problems and yet, I still am not allowed to lurk without being seen because everyone here is paranoid.

And number two, if my suggesting that we have users in charge of the invites is "going off the deep end" (which I actually felt to be a personal attack, especially when everyone seemed like they were ganging up on me about it), then this is completely insane.

There is absolutely no more security with the hidden feature off.  You think there is, but there isn't.  If it were a troll, they could just create a screenname that seems friendly and lurk here and you wouldn't know the difference.  You wouldn't know until they start posting abusive threads.  Which is about the same thing that happens if you are hidden, no?  They're just here and it's not a problem until they start doing stuff that is a problem -- and you'll know who they are when they do it and then you can take action.

I just want everyone to realize how overly paranoid they are being with filing complaints and while I think Phillip is amazingly wonderful with handling this site, I think that this action to suit your comfort serves no merit and I will be protesting it by leaving this fine site.  I don't like living in a country that taps my phoneline to make sure I'm not a terrorist... and I don't like coming to a site that revokes my right to lurk so that they can feel better.

So April 5th will be my last day here if my hidden option is taken away... and to be honest with you, I had only planned to stay hidden for about a week.

Thanks,
David

[EnnisDelMar]

Ok. Well I agree about trolls and how the lurking feature won't help them much at all, so there's no point in taking it away. However, I do not understand why you would leave if it does get taken away...

Why is everyone being so pissy suddenly? Anyone else ready to leave?

[two_bloody_shirts]

I know I'm a relatively new "Tremblayan" but I feel I should make a comment on this.

I first read Phillip's entry before I saw this one.  My first impulse was that it's a drastic measure because I completely agree with you, David.  While I'm still a spring chicken when it comes to Brokeback forums, I have had considerable experience in other forums for several years.  I maintained an actor website for two years.  It does not matter if a member is hidden or not on forums if they plan to cause problems.

The only reason why someone is hiding on a forum is to read the entries with complete anonymity and privacy.  On my site and many of the forums I was involved in we prevented outsiders from reading entries by hiding all of the forums from public users.   

I should think the fear of trolls would be more limited here because frankly IMDb was not the most favored place for the caliber of people here.  IMDb is open for too many young users that have too much time on their hands and want to cause problems.  IMDb is a widely-known site.  This site, as of yet, is not.  I think everyone should sit back and relax, you have no reason to feel you are inevitably going to be under attack here. 

I hope this helps to ease fears.

[Spooky_Rabbit]

Molehill... Mountain

Molehill... Mountain

Ya know I love ya Ducky.........................  

[delalluvia]

I agree that people are getting way out of hand if they are doing such a tihing.  Who has been reporting it?

The 'hidden' feature is a normal option on this type of board.  I've been on many boards that have the same thing.  If it were not for our own recent run-in with abusive idiots over on the IMDb boards, I probably would be using the feature at times myself.

It's nothing to be upset about and the other members of this site - not all are Trembley members - also use the option and may want to come look and see what we're about.

If people here on PT have been reporting this as a bad thing, I'm with stud in that that is a bit much.  We can't expect other members of this site to cowtow because of our own sensitivities.

[Front-Ranger]

I sure would be sorry not to be able to converse w/u here, Stud Duck. I don't no why u would want to be hidden but better hidden than gone, I guess! Please don't leave us!

[TheStudDuck]

I just wanted some "me time" -- that's all. 

I just can't believe that this is such a problem for everyone that it has to be deactivated.  All of my liberal Tremblayan friends are acting like Republicans!

[vkm91941]

I have heard of NO reports on this subject.  I do know one of the moderators questions the meaning of hidden viewers but without any malice in mind.  I think everyone needs to take a deep breath and not make any hasty decisions here.  We are suffereing from a form of Post Traumatic Stress after the harrowing experinces of the last month on IMDb.

Act in haste and repent at leisure.  EVERYONE must remember that Bettermost while a wonderful forum which Phillip polices and controlls admirablly with the help of his moderators is still a public forum that anyone is free to join and participate in until their behavior causes that priviledge to be revoke. and remember CT is not the only board here...There are a lot of BetterMost Brokies here long before us.  We have no right to ask that these things be changed just for us and our paranoia.

There is no reason for anyone to be overly paranoid of troll concerns on this board.  That said However I have always shared David's opinion about a central person or person who are responsible for invitations issued to other IMDb users.  It should be someone with a significant IMDB history and with good skills of a smelling a rat.

If my opinion offends that was not my intention.  David take a deep breath and relax...you really don't want to leave do you?

[slayers_creek_oth]

I just wanted some "me time" -- that's all. 

I just can't believe that this is such a problem for everyone that it has to be deactivated.  All of my liberal Tremblayan friends are acting like Republicans!

Just because I am confused as hell.....what does this have to do with politics?  If it is Phillips choice to remove the hidden feature then so be it.....who are we to complain to someone who has opened his doors to us when we were in need? 

Why would you want to be hidden anyway.....I guess I just don't understand what the point of it is....

Please no one take any offense by this for that is not my intention either....

[TheStudDuck]

He's only removing the hidden feature because so many people have complained about it... if people didn't complain, it would still be a feature... one that Phillip originally decided on.

What does it matter why I want to stay hidden?  I don't understand why people can't be hidden if they choose to be?  I like it as an option... I do... and I'm not going to just let people complain about something if there is no merit for their complaints.

And, no, I don't want to leave everyone here.  But I also don't want to be around a bunch of people that will attack me for one thing and then turn around and do the same thing... and I also don't want to be around a bunch of people that don't want me to be hidden so that they can keep an eye on me.

I just don't like that.  I'm sorry.  And I'm not going to let this feature be taken away from me without my expressing disapproval of it.

[two_bloody_shirts]

Why would you want to be hidden anyway.....I guess I just don't understand what the point of it is....

The "hidden" feature is typically used so that you can read entries without anyone being aware you are on the site.  As David said, he wanted alone time.  Apparently people saw him active on the site and were wondering why he wasn't "active" as in posting.  I think sometimes people also use it when they are surfing from one site to another just reading things and don't want to be bothered by continuous PMs, etc.

[slayers_creek_oth]

No one wants to keep an eye on you.......I was just confused about why you would want to hide.....I couldn't really care less either way.....

I guess we just think differently....nothing wrong with that.....I respect your decision to do whatever you please.......even if I don't agree....

We'll miss you if you leave.....

[Ellemeno]

Sigh...

[delalluvia]

No one wants to keep an eye on you.......I was just confused about why you would want to hide.....I could really care less either way.

I don't think he's concerned about people keeping an eye on him, as much as he feels that way if people start reporting him for using it.

I like the option too.  Once we all calmed down, I'd've eventually used it myself if it wasn't going to be taken away.

No real reason, sometimes I just like to lurk and the option gives you the opportunity to do so as a member.

[vkm91941]

Can everyone just stand back and take a deep breath please all this drama is not healthy!

[YaadPyar]

Just because I am confused as hell.....what does this have to do with politics?  If it is Phillips choice to remove the hidden feature then so be it.....who are we to complain to someone who has opened his doors to us when we were in need? 

Gosh Slayer - you look so different in your avatar pic than what I'd imagined...so much more, I don't know - formal.  I guess I imagined you in jeans (who is that anyway?).   

Anyway - this is a new forum for most of us with new features and everyone has to decide what they're comfortable with.  The inquiries about what the "hidden" status were just that as previously stated - inquiries.  They were not personal attacks about anyone here, but remnants of IMDb Troll War PTSS, as Vic said.

I can understand the appeal of 'hidden' but even more so, especially at the moment, the perception that lurking is nefarious.  I have to say that I support Phillip in his choice(s), and am certain that they come only from a place of integrity.

I don't know if ya'll have any idea what a huge increase in the amount of time and attention and resources our presence has created, and totally understand why he wants to simplify wherever possible.  He's getting messages and e-mails and posts non-stop with inquiries and suggestions and ideas for modification...and he's handling it all with amazing grace and the same generosity that he extended last week.

So - I say let's give him and all of us a chance to settle in and see what works and what doesn't, and give him the time to figure it all out without us pressuring him.  We've been here just a few days, and it's gonna take a while, which seems more than fair to me. 

[dmmb_Mandy]

"this feature allowed me to lurk without people hasselling me for still being here (and they actually did, by the way)."

David, people were hasselling you for being here without posting? I've done that and noone has said a word to me. Sometimes I stay logged on and leave this open and browse the net elsewhere and then come back to it. I don't understand why that would be a problem to someone?

I agree, being reported for being 'hidden' doesn't do much help. Like you said, trolls can attack by other means.

To Brandon's comment - I'm not going anywhere. I've unpacked my bags, and I've even put pictures and paintings on the walls; I'm here to stay  

I agree that this whole troll situation has made people uneasy, but we have to try and keep in mind that we are fairly safe here (at least safer than we were at IMdB)  as long as the invites are carefully organized. We have to relax a little, take a deep breath like Vic said (btw *big hug, Vic*, no crying!) and stick together.

David hunny, please don't leave. Once people are nice and settled in and comfortable, there will hopefully be a lot less reporting & paranoia.  

[vkm91941]

"this feature allowed me to lurk without people hasselling me for still being here (and they actually did, by the way)."

David, people were hasselling you for being here without posting? I've done that and noone has said a word to me. Sometimes I stay logged on and leave this open and browse the net elsewhere and then come back to it. I don't understand why that would be a problem to someone?

I agree, being reported for being 'hidden' doesn't do much help. Like you said, trolls can attack by other means.

To Brandon's comment - I'm not going anywhere. I've unpacked my bags, and I've even put pictures and paintings on the walls; I'm here to stay  

I agree that this whole troll situation has made people uneasy, but we have to try and keep in mind that we are fairly safe here (at least safer than we were at IMdB)  as long as the invites are carefully organized. We have to relax a little, take a deep breath like Vic said (btw *big hug, Vic*, no crying!) and stick together.

David hunny, please don't leave. Once people are nice and settled in and comfortable, there will hopefully be a lot less reporting & paranoia.  

At last another voice of reason...Thank You Celeste... Please guys just relax, settle in, visit the neighbors,  post, enjoy... play ABC's and 123 and let's leave Phil alone to do his job which he has done so admirably without our help.

[slayers_creek_oth]

Just because I am confused as hell.....what does this have to do with politics?  If it is Phillips choice to remove the hidden feature then so be it.....who are we to complain to someone who has opened his doors to us when we were in need? 

Gosh Slayer - you look so different in your avatar pic than what I'd imagined...so much more, I don't know - formal.  I guess I imagined you in jeans (who is that anyway?).   

ROFLMFAO!  I'm gettin that a lot today.....its Mandy Moore.....

[montferrat]

No one REPORTED anyone.  From what I hear, a few people inquired what the "hidden" meant and posted pros or cons about it. Phillip decided to try disabling it. Phillip may change his mind about it. But I don't think any of us should threaten to leave here if Phillip does or doesn't do something.

That smacks of giving an ultimatum . IMHO that is particularly unconstructive.

Personally I have no opinion whatsoever about being hidden or not. Just doesn't matter to me at all.

[slayers_creek_oth]

That smacks of giving an ultimatum . IMHO that is particularly unconstructive.

Agreed!

[dmmb_Mandy]

Vic, that was me that you quoted, hun, not Celeste 

[TheStudDuck]

I know I was pretty upset when I made my original post... and I don't want to leave here at all... and I know that it was unconstructive for me to say that I would leave if it wasn't changed.

I do not want to leave... I love it here.

One of my main reasons for being as upset as I was is because lately I have felt like people aren't really thrilled with me being here... telling me I'm overly paranoid, stressed out, going off the deep end and whatnot.  And in order to sort of just step back and give myself some space, I stay hidden... and then people still don't like me.  I'm all of a sudden suspicious.

It's like I can't please anyone here... and that doesn't exactly make me want to stay, you know?

[dmmb_Mandy]

We love you Studly 

[slayers_creek_oth]

Well if I have made you feel that way then I apologize.  We had a little disagreement a few weeks ago about the Million $ Baby thing but I haven't really even talked to you since then....however that doesn't mean that I didn't offend you in some way and I offer my sincere apologies if I did.....

 

[montferrat]

David,

Personally, as I said , I have no problem at all with you or anyone being in hidden mode. Seriously, I completely understand that you want to just check in on stuff without getting a bunch of PM's. I also know how it feels when you think you can't please anyone.  I type before I think of how it affects others and it gets me into trouble sometimes,
and I seriously think you're a great young man. Perhaps just giving yourself a count of 10 sometimes before you post might make things a little easier?

And no, I am NOT suggesting you censor yourself. Just reflect on what you're going to post for a second.

Hope you'll stick around,

Paul

 

[RouxB]

David-

I love you enough to overrule EVERYONE!
I love you more than beans and whisky and elk and baby bears and horses with low startle points and crooked tents and warm bedrolls and SHEEP

Ruby

[MaineWriter]

David,
I believe I may have been the person (or one of the people, not sure if there was more than one) who made a comment about going off the deep end. My intent was never to offend and if I did, I apologize.

As I recall, I posted it in response to a message about getting organized, drawing up rules, etc...basically, I was trying to say what many others here have already said...let's take a deep breath, relax, enjoy the surroundings....we are all a little shell-shocked right now and it is taking all of us time to recover.

David, you have offered many great comments and insights to the board. You have also done alot of hard work (coordinating the whole PT interview, thanking the Tremblays, compiling the PT interviews, as just one example). I, for one, am extremely  appreciative of all that you have done. You are an asset to our group and I hope you decide to continue being part of the group. You have much to contribute.

Again, if my comment about "going off the deep end" was hurtful to you, please accept my most sincere apology.

I look forward to seeing your name in the "most recent postings" list.

Leslie

[EnnisDelMar]

Chris your breasts are distracting me, I couldn't read the thread..please refrain from sticking them out so far

lmao

[slayers_creek_oth]

ROFLMFAO!  Ok I'll try to control myself....

You think your pretty funny don't you....

[EnnisDelMar]

Naw, I just think your breasts are distracting

[littleguitar]

ROFLMFAO!! I'm with you brandon, I was just about to tell him he's looking rather busty tonight! 

[slayers_creek_oth]

There is that better....

[montferrat]

CHris, you make a Pretty Woman...

[slayers_creek_oth]

Wow......we're all comedians tonight aren't we!

ROFLMFAO!  Thanks Paul

[littledarlin]

hey, david.  although i appreciate your concerns and agree whole heartedly about the problems with this country, i think it's counter productive to accuse fellow brokies, especially because the majority of us (not all!) are on the same page politically.

i am extremely opinionated and clash with people on a daily basis, but i have never seen such an amazing display of respect that i have seen with my fellow brokies.  i've even impressed myself!  in most cases, if someone makes a comment i disagree with, i can either ignore them, or participate in a civil debate, coming out in the end finding common ground. 

i am completely ambivalent to the concept of hidden users.  but i can say that although we are in a slight state of paranoid, which is fading away by the minute, we are rightfully so.  someone real invaded our space with the sole purpose of destroying it for a laugh or to validate their existence or whatever their excuse is.  they deleted tons of threads that people poured their hearts and souls into, and threatened peoples' connections. 

anyway i've rambled enough.  what i'm trying to say is i hear what you're saying completely and you're not alone, but if you don't want to leave, don't.  because i know more than a few people will miss your presence. 

if someone pisses you off, say something, and this goes for all of us!  as i said, we all manage to remain civil, even friendly towards eachother whether or not we agree politically or socially or what have you.  we don't want drama, but we also don't want people unintentionally hurting others and driving us away. 

that's my two cents.  or.. silver dollar.  damn that was long.   

[Spooky_Rabbit]

That was a very NICE two cents!  A bargain!

Reading your post, littledarlin (aww, littledarlin.. in the book, but not movie... remember Brokeback?) made me really remember for a moment those few days back at IMDB.

They were really disorienting and then, yes, we did realize exactly what sort of clever attack was being launched.

I guess you'd have to call it terrorism?  Bad.

But, yeah, things are so peaceful and amazing here.  That's a good ball to keep our eyes on...   

[Phillip Dampier]

The only reason this is even an issue is that I got a large number of messages about it and I found myself investing a lot of time answering these concerns.  I would rather invest that time into public messages here and working on projects, so I decided the best move would be to drop the hidden feature awhile.  The root of all of this is a fear of trolls.  This is not IMDb.  I have a large number of tools available to me to deal with incursions, but until this place has been free of attacks for a few weeks, there is a natural fear that they could return.  That's why there is a concern about anonymous people and such.  But they really aren't anonymous - I see everyone's handle whether hidden or not.

I really think folks should take a deep breath and relax and get back to talking about the movie and its meaning.

BTW, nobody complained specifically about any user, just about the feature itself.  And everyone of those was rooted in a fear of trolls.

I'll keep reading your views about this and consider my ultimate decision tomorrow. 

[cmr107]

OK Studly. If you saw my post on Phillip's thread thanking him for turning it off, I did that completely without thinking it through. I just thought "oh look, he got requests and now he's accomodating them. That's so nice of him!" I am not used to an administrator who is actually considerate and thinks things through before acting because IMDb is my only prior message board experience, and we all know that if IMDb admins are even human beings, the certainly don't read threads before deleting them.

Of course it is understandable for opinions to differ, but much of what you read as attacks on you I read as kind-hearted teasing. You said you were taking time off, but you came back and posted. I have tried to tell myself several times that I will not get on the board for a day (or even for half a day) and try to catch up on homework or whatever, but I can't stay away. I like it too much here. I just thought aww, David loves it here as much as I do and can't leave for too long at a time like me. I can't speak for anyone else, but I think the only reason you got comments about being here is that you specifically said that you were taking time off from it. Personally, there are several windows I leave open on my computer here in my dorm room all day, from when I turn the computer on when I wake to when I turn it off when I go to sleep. This board is one of them, so I'm pretty sure it shows me as being online all day even when I'm not in the building. I have never gotten a single comment about being online and not posting, because I never said I was going to leave the board. Anything I ever said to you about being hidden and lurking or anything else mentioned in your post was purely affectionate joking. That is the downfall of the internet, it is hard to tell when someone is joking or not.

I think that if you don't want to leave the board, then don't. You are one of my favorite people here, and many of us would be sad to see you go. I'm still holding out hope for you coming to Chicago to meet Celeste, Andrew, and I (we're all really quite wonderful!). I think that if you give it even one more week, the level of paranoia will be significantly depleted. I feel quite safe here, and hope others will soon too.

[Ellemeno]

I know I was pretty upset when I made my original post... and I don't want to leave here at all... and I know that it was unconstructive for me to say that I would leave if it wasn't changed.

I do not want to leave... I love it here.

David, if that's the case, could you consider changing the upsetting subject line in your original post?  Every time I see it in the list of threads, I feel bad that you are so unhappy.  If you are doing better now, could that line reflect it?

Thanks,

Clarissa

[Sheyne]

Uhh... woah.  What did I miss?

Sheesh, you go to work for a day and suddenly there's tension!! 

:-S

I hope nobody leaves this place. And I hope misunderstandings get resolved cause it'd be a crying shame to break up this happy home.

Please don't leave Stud. 

[j.U.d.E.]

Bumping for later..

But what's going on?!

~ j U d E

[Chanterais]

Cupcake, anyone?

My personal crackpot theory of the day is that we're growing up a lot as a group. We're going through a sort of adolescent angst right now.  I know that in my own life, I have a tendency to bottle things up very, very tightly: making nice, avoiding conflict, rolling with the punches.  And then sometimes, my suppressed and unspoken frustrations rise up into a spangled festival of crankiness.  And in a lot of ways, it's not so bad.  Sometimes people (and communities) need to come to a certain crisis point before we can clear the air and move on.  I know I've said a few things in the last day that have been bothering me, and now that I've purged it from my system, I harbour no ill-will towards anyone.  (Except maybe Reanna, who is still too beautiful for me to bear.  I'll get you, my pretty!)

I don't think this is spelling the demise of our family.  I think that it's making us stronger, and wiser, and a bit more aware that we might be hurting other people's feelings.  This is all good.  We're growing up.  We'll get through it.  We'll be better for it.

And Studly, if you go, you'll be ripping out my heart and stepping on it repeatedly.  Me so sad.

[sparkle_motion]

Here's my really constructive criticism...
Are we going to have to beg a new person everyday to stay here? If you don't want to be here, go! Causing unnecessary drama is...unnecessary! Seriously, if you were invited here, then you are liked. All this IM LEAVING nonesense is really getting on my nerves and making this a negative place.

[Chanterais]

All this IM LEAVING nonesense is really getting on my nerves and making this a negative place.

With respect, Sparkle, nobody, and I mean nobody has been more relentlessly positive on Chez Tremblay than David.  When the world has seemed at its gloomiest, he's found a way to make it seem light again.  He's having a tough time right now.  I don't think it's nonsense.  I agree it's upsetting, but one of our own is sad.  Let's try and cheer him up.

[Impish]

Sorry to intrude, as I was never on the original Tremblay board.  But in my role as moderater of the Safe Haven board, I would like to toss my concern into the hopper.

I would like the "Hidden" option to remain available for people in the Safe Haven board.  Safe Haven is for GLBT members or those who think they might be.  I assume that Brokeback opened the closet doors of many, and many more will at last admit to themselves they are gay, lesbian, or bi.  These people would be nowhere near ready to come out of the closet... after all, they just went in the closet after seeing BBM!

It's my hope that such people will find their way to the Bettermost site (all of it, including Chez Tremblay).

When he or she sees the title of the Safe Haven board, I would like them to drop by and who knows? Maybe some of them would feel more comfortable with being hidden for a while. 

I realize that the Safe Haven board may attract trolls, and I risk enabling them to lurk.  I realize that I've asked our straight members to stay out of Safe Haven out of respect and understanding for newly-identified gay people, as I would like them to experience "being the majority" for once.  The hidden option allows those who resent my request to come and go as they please, and I'm willing to risk that too.

I'm willing to risk it because there may be one single individual out there who would hesitate before entering the Safe Haven board if he or she couldn't remain incognito.

I have not PM'ed Phillip about this, nor will I make a specific request of him.  The Chez Tremblay board and its concerns are equally important to those of the Safe Haven board, and if we look solely at the number of members and the number of posts, CT is more important.

So if the hidden feature goes away, I'll deal with it.  I just wanted to share another point of view with you all.   

[Ellemeno]

Hi Impish, welcome, welcome!  I had not considered that point.  I would rather help a person making an important and needed transition have that opportunity to do it at their pace.

I'm finding that when I look in the upper right hand corner to see who's here, the main thing sparked in me when I see a hidden person is boredom. 

I guess where I am now on the issue is neutral.  (My personal preference for how it affects me hasn't changed, but I'm seeing a bigger picture.)  I let those whom it matters to the most have their say.  Would it be useful to have a poll (NOT a vote, a poll) on the issue?

And here's a last (at least for this post) thought - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" is a pretty good saying.  Meaning here, the feature is already set one way and hasn't really caused a problem.

I know, I know, this is not my same tune from yesterday.  It's a human's prerogative to change her mind.

[RouxB]

Big internal debate on should I post or should I not.

"Should I" wins.

I have to echo Chanterais-David has been an invaluable asset to this board and to suggest otherwise does a disservice to all of us. He is not a "new person" whining about something he doesn't like about the board-he is a friend and family member who is having some stuggles and is reaching out to us. If people don't have enough heart to recognize and accommodate that then how are we calling ourselves a family?

Everyone needs to step back and take a big stinkin breath and calm down  and remember what your grammie told you "if you can't say anything nice, shut the flock up"

kisses to all
kisses and hugs to David and anyone else feeling alienated.

[sparkle_motion]

By "new", I did not mean David is new. I meant, everyday, a different person is going to be saying he/she wants to leave the board and we will have to reassure them and beg them to stay.
I stand my ground on this, whether I seem insensitive or not. I don't like drama. Period.
I mean, seriously, when it boils down to it, David is threatening to leave because a website function might be taken away. It shows what he thinks of this community and of these people if he's willing to leave over something so ridiculous.

[RouxB]

But being part of the discussion makes us a part of the drama. The only way to stay out of drama is to ignore it.

 I think I've only seem one other "outta here" post-once again from a long-time member of this group. I guess the point I'm trying to make is just cut people some slack-it costs nothing to be compassionate.  If one don't agree with what is being said, and  really wants to stay out of the drama, the option to not respond is a good one-the responses often  convey the same negativity that they are purporting to address.

If, in fact, everyday some new person wants to post an "I'm leaving" message, let em! So what?!  If I (or anyone else) want to post a "please don't" response, what is the issue? That is a loving, positive message. If, on the other hand, I (or anyone else) don't give a poop, where is the positivity in posting that?

I am an argue-er by nature-or nurture. Everyday I have to remember that I don't have to express every dissenting thought that goes through my head. Some things you just gotta let be. That being said, and to extricate myself from THIS drama, I'll shut up now.

Onward and upward and where is my damn DVD??

[opinionista]

Well, David has a point. We should really lighten up, relax. This is supposed to be for fun.