Who helped Jack become agressive, his father or mother??

[Artiste]

We know that Ennis's parents had no money! Did that helped Ennis? Did poverty helped Jack?

1. Note that Ennis parents had no money, and neither like that it seems for Jack's parents!!

2. Nor much material things, for neither!! Not much land neither for parents of Ennis's nor Jack's?


3. If you listen to Ennis... about his parents passing, plus he grew up after with his brother who was also poor as there was no room for Ennis anymore (so his brother did not have a castle nor marry a wealthy girl)! Did that help Ennis?

4. Jack and Ennis lives as youths were similar in poverty!! But why is Jack more agressive? Because of his father and/or mother??

Hugs!

[Front-Ranger]

Jack was aggressive?? I'm not sure I understand. It was Ennis who was aggressive, picking fights and such. Jack was meek and mild. But perhaps you mean aggressive in terms of going after what he wanted, whether to get off the ranch or get Ennis. There again, he wasn't aggressive when it comes right down to it. Also, he wasn't aggressive with girls either, as his meetup with Lureen shows. So, I don't understand what you mean.

[Artiste]

Wow!

I still would like to find out if it was Jack's father or mother helped him to be agressive?

Am very surprised by your answer! As always thought Jack was the agressive one!!

So how is Ennis agressive?

Hugs!

[High Priestess]

Wow!

I still would like to find out if it was Jack's father or mother helped him to be agressive?

Am very surprised by your answer! As always thought Jack was the agressive one!!

So how is Ennis agressive?

Hugs!

Hi there Artiste,

Maybe I can help!

Jack wasn't really an aggressor, he was a ball of frustration and much more open with his sexuality.  Granted, in the opening scenes he comes across as a bit of a preying mantis when he keeps looking at Ennis outside of Aguirre's trailer.  But Jack was actually the more tender of the two when it gets down to brass tacks and yet he is constantly frustrated by Ennis' refusal to make a commitment.

Ennis was commited to work for after the divorce, he was lumbered with child support payments.  But all along, we see that Ennis is almost ashamed of his sexuality and when Jack and him have a play fight (Jack catching him with the lasoo), Jack cops a bonafide punch from Ennis.  Ennis is continually in denial until Jack's death and it takes the death of his one true love to make him stand up and accept his leanings.

Ennis was very much the aggressor.  He almost beat Alma at Thanksgiving when she referred to his non-existant fishing trips with 'Jack Nasty' in the kitchen.  He was sullen and untouchable - he hated himself and this is why he walked away/dismissed the girlfriend, Cassie with such ease, saying 'I guess I wasn't no fun anyway'.

Jack, on the other hand, was sprightly and provocative!  He was far more open and not at all in denial around Ennis.  The only reason he got sore was because Ennis was so damned obstinate.  Jack wanted a whole lot more than Ennis could realistically give.

I hope this helps a little!

Regards,

Lo 

[Front-Ranger]

In addition to Lo's comments, I would like to add that Ennis picked a fight with two tough bikers at an Independence Day family gathering! Now that's pretty aggressive! And after threatening Alma and scaring her to death, Ennis picked another fight, actually dragging a guy out of a truck!! Now, that's pppreeetttyyy aggressive!!

[High Priestess]

In addition to Lo's comments, I would like to add that Ennis picked a fight with two tough bikers at an Independence Day family gathering! Now that's pretty aggressive! And after threatening Alma and scaring her to death, Ennis picked another fight, actually dragging a guy out of a truck!! Now, that's pppreeetttyyy aggressive!!

Indeed!

Also, even at the crux of Jack's disgruntlement with Ennis  - the 'I wish I knew how to quit you' scene, Jack enveloped Ennis and held him as he collapsed to the floor.  Jack loved Ennis more than life itself but was desperate for Ennis to quit beating around the bush and make a more solid commitment for he hated this 4-yearly 'high altitude liaison' to put it politely 

I can't believe that my BBM DVD is sticking - to change the subject but not the subject matter!

It's refusing to run and it is not even scratched    I guess I will have to der a new copy now!

Regards,

Lo 

[Kd5000]

Jack was certainly more a dreamer, not an aggressor, then Ennis.  No doubt given the household Jack was growing up in, he certainly must have spent his days daydreaming about a better life for himself. "If I only get away from my old man and get my own place," that line of thinking.  He also wants someone to share his life with.

Ennis was orphaned. He was more concerned with just getting by and having a roof over his head. As bleak as Jack's household was, he didn't have to worry about day to day existence.   Ennis had a very large undercurrent which periodically surface. He was so repressed and wasn't very good about expressing his emotions.  I suppose he had learned to bury his feeling in order to survive.  No doubt, Ennis's dad wasn't good at child-rearing. Ennis learned to "shut-down" on the surface very early.  Be stoic and all. I'm sure happy days in his childhood and teen years was sparse to say the least.

I would like to think that Jack's mom tried to comfort him during his childhood as both had to suffer under the tyranny of Jack Twist Sr.

[Artiste]

Wow! Wow! Wow!
Just read your replies: Kd5000, High Priestess, and Front Ranger!!!
They are great!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And more can be said?

Awaiting your added remarks!!

Hugs to all!!

[welliwont]

4. Jack and Ennis lives as youths were similar in poverty!! But why is Jack more agressive? Because of his father and/or mother??

Hugs!

Hello Artiste!  Nice  to meet you!  I am only going to comment on question #4.....

Yep, both Jack and Ennis grew up poor.  Why is Jack more agressive?

Do you mean "why was Jack more agressive in life?"  "In FNIT?"

I agree, Jack was more agressive in life than was Ennis, much more agressive.  He went after what he wanted, much more so than Ennis, that's for sure!  He told Ennis "well I won't" (settle for beans).  In other words he would strive to get what he wanted from life.  He wanted Ennis, and he tried his damnedest to get him in his life.  But he couldn't budge ol' Ennis.

And of course Jack was more agressive in FNIT, he took Ennis' hand, etc etc.     A co-worker of mine (male) who did not get BBM at all, thought that Jack was a sexual predator after seeing FNIT!    

Anyway, you're asking if it was due to his mother or his father.  Well IMO I don't attribute Jack's gumption to either of them.  I think all of it was just his nature, I think this was just who Jack Twist was.  I don't think his parents had much to do with that part of Jack's personality.  We are talking about Nature versus Nurture here.  If Jack had been raised by Ennis' parents, and Ennis had been raised by Jack's I don't think they would have each others' personalities or outlooks on life.

Interesting to ponder, if Jack had been shown Earl's mutilated corpse at age 9, how would that have changed him?  I wonder.  I do not think he would have been as beaten down as Ennis was.....  Anyway I just wanted to comment on your question #4.

Gotta go read some fanfic now, 

Jane

[Artiste]

Thanks welliwont!!

Firstly, may I ask where are you in Ontario? Raised there? This is important to me, somewhat or a lot!!

Secondly: And your comments about Jack and Ennis , plus their parents are interesting!!

If you resee Jack's father, he had a great deal of influence on his son; re-hear what he said to Ennis!! Wow! Wow!  And Jack's mother is a good mother...helping Ennis, quietly!! Therefore, Jack was quiet like his mother listening to Ennis at the fires, tender to him in the tent!! Plus, Jack was like his father stern with Ennis... kept wanting like his dad a GOOD life with others and especially with Ennis (his love), and even raising his voice as needed like a man did at times, 1- to Ennis, and 2- to his father-in-law!!  Therefore, Jack is an extension of both his parents!! We all are so, I just realize!!

Both of Jack's parents are agressive, in their ways!! These degrees of each, let jack be better, hopeful for a better life, for mutual love too!!

Am very happy with what you say!! Did Jack's parents love each other?? May I ask?

Hugs!!

[welliwont]

If you resee Jack's father, he had a great deal of influence on his son; re-hear what he said to Ennis!! Wow! Wow!  And Jack's mother is a good mother...helping Ennis, quietly!! Therefore, Jack was quiet like his mother listening to Ennis at the fires, tender to him in the tent!! Plus, Jack was like his father stern with Ennis... kept wanting like his dad a GOOD life with others and especially with Ennis (his love), and even raising his voice as needed like a man did at times, 1- to Ennis, and 2- to his father-in-law!!  Therefore, Jack is an extension of both his parents!! We all are so, I just realize!!

Bonjour Artiste!

I can't argue with any of that, I agree, Jack was very sweet and tender!  I think he got that from his mother.  Here are two of my favourite tender Jack moments:

Did Jack's parents love each other?? May I ask?

I dunno, I never pondered that one.....  I guess I have to say I don't know if Jack's father ever loved his mother, I don't think Jack's father ever loved Jack, that's for sure!  Whether or not he loved his wife is debatable.  The question is:  did Old Man Twist have any love in him for anyone?

The same question adressed to Mrs. Twist would be a yes, I think she dearly loved her son.  Did she love her husband?  I think for sure she did in them earlier days, when she was first married.  I don't know if it lasted or not....

Sorry, I am not the best one to be answering these questions.....  How long ago did you first see BBM if I may ask?

J

[Artiste]

Merciyes thanks welliwont!

As am exhusted, will answer you tomorrow! Oui, demain!

Remind me then, please!

Hugs!

[Artiste]

Is Roland a member here?