Author Topic: Exactly WHEN does Jack decide.. th 1st tent scene..is gonna be th 1s tent scene?  (Read 22566 times)

Offline twistedude

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I guess we're pretty much agreed that Jack has been cruising Ennis, since, maybe the first time he laid eyes on him. He takes one look at Ennis, and drapes his body beautifully over the side of the truck...but there is no reaction. Calls for a change in plans, or a plan, or a postponement of a plan--or what? Exactly when does Jack decide...to move?


1) ignorant talk about the Petecost leads to Ennis saying "You may be a sinner, but I ain't yet had the opportunity." Is it then?

2) Seems pretty matter-of-fact when he brings Ennis a blanket and says "You'd be better off sleeping in the tent."

3) Ditto, when he's lying alone in the tent with his eyes open, listening to Ennis's teeth chattering and his occasional exclamations. Almost "Can I get back to sleep...jeez, Ennis is freezing his butt off"

4) My choice: after Ennis is inside, and asleep (most likely), he moves a lot closer to him (after full moon shot, shot of white floor of tent--where Jack used to be lying.

The rest is history...or do you think it was all a master plan that started much earler? (Like, for instance, when Jack says they should both be in the camp? Or some other time?)

Hope I don't sound callous. It's pretty obvious: if you are someone with some (no matter how little) sexual experience, and you want someone who has--literally--NONE, you have to seduce him somehow...

« Last Edit: April 24, 2006, 02:53:55 am by julie01 »
"We're each of us alone, to be sure. What can you do but hold your hand out in the dark?" --"Nine Lives," by Ursula K. Le Guin, from The Wind's Twelve Quarters

Offline Aussie Chris

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I like the question Julie, sort of flies in the face of all the "first tent scene was unrealistic" stuff.

I think I agree with you and your assessment.  I think it's clear that this was on Jack's mind from word-go, the truck-draping, the stealing of a peak as Ennis washes, etc.  But when we get into the tent there's that lovely little pan of the camera showing how close Jack had scootered over.  But this is where is gets a little harder (no pun).  Was there a master plan?  Did Jack, for example, get Ennis particularly loaded that night so he couldn't go and tend the sheep?  I think maybe.  There doesn't seem to be any obvious indication that Ennis was receptive to such a move while sober, but fully loaded (again no pun) with liquor?  Maybe if it didn't work out Jack could laugh it off as a drunken mistake?  As it turns out, there was no mistake... ;D
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Offline twistedude

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I agree completely...Ennis thought of Jack as a--wonderful--friend--and that was IT. The liquor may well have been intentional--but then, Jack seems to have gotten pretty loaded himself! He (Jack) seems to have realized that Ennis, no matter how familiar he was with the sexual behavior of animals, had never had sex with--anything--including his own right hand!

Sometimes, pretty serious measures are required--even something  usually considered as dishonorable as..booze. But maybe the whiskey gave Jack the courage he needed as well, and the 1st tent scene wasn't "finalized" (UGH! what a corporate word) untill they were both in the tent, and warm. 
« Last Edit: April 24, 2006, 03:21:16 am by julie01 »
"We're each of us alone, to be sure. What can you do but hold your hand out in the dark?" --"Nine Lives," by Ursula K. Le Guin, from The Wind's Twelve Quarters

Offline Aussie Chris

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Don't forget that Jack was extremely good at holding his liquor, and he would have known this.  After all, he didn't have much of a problem standing up and getting Ennis a blanket.  Ennis barely made it back to the fire without falling over.  Jack knew what he was doing.

Ah booze - getting ugly people laid for centuries!
Nothing is as common as the wish to be remarkable - William Shakespeare

Offline Sheyne

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Well, there were a few things in the tent scene + build-up that made me think the "getting Ennis trashed as seduction tactic" was Jack's MO. Firstly, as Chris pointed out: Jack was nowhere near as loaded as Ennis.  After Ennis claims he's going back to the sheep but barely makes it out of the campsite on all fours (pant pant), watch Jack.  He's sitting up, fairly alert and intently watching this attempt Ennis makes to leave (which doubles nicely as an excuse to perv on Ennis's incredible butt  ;D). 

Now there are two possiblities we have to consider here: either a) NEITHER boy was terribly drunk and BOTH faked it in order to spend the night together; OR b) Jack didn't have as much alcohol as Ennis (or as Julie pointed out, he may have been better at holding his alcohol), but got Ennis drunk to lower his guard a little.

As soon as Ennis mentions he'll stay in the campfire, again, watch Jack. He springs quickly to his feet to fetch him a blanket - no staggering or tripping. He's quite nimble and actually seems, for the most part, quite sober.  Certainly isn't slurring etc.  Is it worth considering that Ennis may have been pretending to be drunker than he really was, especially if he was picking up on the subtle attraction between he and Jack. There's definitely an interest there, but I'm not sure somebody with such little experience as Ennis would have recognised it for what it was. (Which was heaven, but we all know that!!!  ;D ;D ;D)

And we all know what happens next.  ;)
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Offline Brown Eyes

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I think the "I haven't yet had the opportunity" statement was a clear as a bell signal from Ennis.  Especially since it was accompanied by deliberate, direct eye contact.  It's that very same night that Jack gives Ennis the opporunity.  Also, that little bit of music that punctuates Ennis's little confession here, I think is meant to be a clue to the audience that this line is important (and may even be Ennis's awkward attempt at flirting).

Well, at the very beginning when Jack drapes himself against his truck, he may not know that he got a reaction from Ennis... But, Ennis does take the opportunity to look Jack over and he keeps checking him out with "stolen glances" so to speak.
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Offline Aussie Chris

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I think the "I haven't yet had the opportunity" statement was a clear as a bell signal from Ennis.  Especially since it was accompanied by deliberate, direct eye contact.  It's that very same night that Jack gives Ennis the opporunity.  Also, that little bit of music that punctuates Ennis's little confession here, I think is meant to be a clue to the audience that this line is important (and may even be Ennis's awkward attempt at flirting).

And wasn't there a little noise that Jack makes at this time?  It's not words so I can't spell it out here, but to me it's a cheeky noise almost like a "you don't say" or even a little bit like a dare.

Quote
Well, at the very beginning when Jack drapes himself against his truck, he may not know that he got a reaction from Ennis... But, Ennis does take the opportunity to look Jack over and he keeps checking him out with "stolen glances" so to speak.

Oh there were lots of looks that Ennis gives Jack.  Also, I know it's not the film, but I've been reading the 2003 version of the screenplay, and there are many little references to Ennis "warming up" to Jack, even so far as explicitly saying that Ennis had never enjoyed himself in his life.  Somehow that translated to a stoic glace by the time it was filmed.
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Offline Pipedream

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when we get into the tent there's that lovely little pan of the camera showing how close Jack had scootered over.  But this is where is gets a little harder (no pun).  Was there a master plan? 

I'd say, Jack hadn't only scootered over but even wrapped Ennis in his bedroll. When Ennis first comes into the tent he lays down with his own blanket. After the shot to the full moon they are both under one. No plan on Jack's part? Hmmm...
   
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Offline ednbarby

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I think that "I haven't yet had the opportunity" is very significant, too.  For a young man to admit to another that he is a virgin is *HUGE*.  And the direct eye-contact, so rare for Ennis to begin with, is definitely flirting on his part.  Even my husband noticed this and has commented on it since - that that's when Jack got "the go-ahead."  To me, that and of course Ennis opening up to him about his childhood not long before.

Alcohol removes our inhibitions.  It makes us more of what we already are.  Jack knows this, and he has spent a great deal of time reading Ennis.  Tipsy or not himself, he knows with a good degree of certainty that Ennis won't rebuff him when he finally goes for it.  Think of the monumental risk he's taking - if Ennis is straight or homophobic enough as to flip out when he makes a pass at him, he might beat the hell out of him at worst or at best leave the mountain because of it.

I think it's all by design on Jack's part.  Just like ingratiating himself into the camp in the first place is.  I don't think it's getting Ennis to switch with him that he's after in that conversation - it's getting him to invite him to stay.  Like Lureen, he sees what he wants from the beginning and he goes after it.  He's just a lot more cunning about it than she is.  Really, because he has to be.
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Offline serious crayons

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Great thread, Julie! I can't believe we haven't hashed this out before, because it's such a key issue, and there seem to be a lot of different opinions. Here's mine: Jack made his decision outside Aguirre's trailer; Ennis made his inside the tent.

Jack is attracted to Ennis the moment he jumps out of his truck, and resolves to look for an opportunity to make his move. He characteristically goes after what he wants, but in this area he hasn't honed his approach much -- just boldly takes his chances. (Later, he tries that with Jimbo and fails.) But he has to wait for the right time. He gives it a shot after the bear incident, but Ennis rebuffs him. So, more waiting. He is encouraged as Ennis opens up to him, perhaps also senses that Ennis is attracted to him. His complaints about the QT camping are partly like his complaints about beans -- he doesn't want to put up with uncomfortable restrictions he considers unfair. But he also realizes that if they fiddle with the sleeping arrangements the opportunity is more likely to arise. And sure enough, it does. I don't see him as deliberately scheming to get Ennis drunk, but he is better able to hold his liquor, so as the evening wears on he sees this may be his chance.

Ennis probably is immediately attracted to Jack, too, but he would never admit it, even to himself. He has trained himself from age 9 to squelch those feelings the instant he becomes conscious of them (I'm assuming he knew before Earl that he liked boys, which made the experience all the more scarring). Meanwhile, he quickly develops an enormous affection for Jack as a friend. He can hardly believe how lucky he is to find someone like this. He's falling in love, though he wouldn't think of it that way. At some level, his physical attraction grows, and though Ennis will not let himself acknowledge it (as when he leans out to watch Jack ride off and then, half a second later, forces himself to turn away), he is also partly aware of it. He probably senses Jack's attraction, too, though he wouldn't let himself think about this, either. I don't interpret "I ain't had the opportunity" as deliberate, conscious flirtation -- I just don't think Ennis is there yet. (You'll think me naive, I'm sure, but I'm not even convinced it's a deliberate admission of virginity.) But maybe it's unwitting flirtation and, in any case, Jack interprets it as such.

So as the night progresses -- the conversation, the flirting, the drunkenness, the cold, the tent -- Jack knows this is his best chance. He cuddles up to Ennis. So far so good. So he makes the big move and repositions Ennis' hand.

When Ennis jerks awake, his first impulse is to go with his 10 years of self-training: denial, anger, pushing Jack away. But then ... he stops. He may be drunk, but his mind is working. Confronted by this powerful attraction, he finally allows himself to consciously acknowledge it. He realizes that he is being offered for something he has always wanted but never in his life expected to have. In that instant, he sets aside everything he has told himself all these years and decides to go for it, to reach out for this one chance. It's a huge turning point for Ennis. That's why I consider this moment (pictured in Julie's jpeg!) perhaps the most powerful five seconds in the movie. He moves toward Jack, grabs onto him and pulls him closer (just as he will do 20 years later by the lake).