Author Topic: OT: United 93 -- WILL YOU BE SEEING IT? (Read 18371 times)

rtprod · « **on:** April 25, 2006, 03:22:58 pm »

Hi everyone,

I saw it at an early press screening, and it's mind-blowing. Absolutely brilliant.

However, I keep hearing more and more from many friends that they have no interest. The stock line, and I'm hearing it about 90% of the time, is, "I don't think that I could see that." This doesn't bode well for box office hopes if my litmus test holds any merit across the population.

So the question is: WILL YOU BE SEEING IT?

rt

slayers_creek_oth · « **Reply #1 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:24:20 pm »

Yes I'll be screening it Thursday morning.....good is it?

JCinNYC2006 · « **Reply #2 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:30:26 pm »

I'm not sure yet. I have to get past this frustration and confusion about the need to know what happened on that flight, and what it's based on.

What did you like about it?

Juan

rtprod · « **Reply #3 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:32:18 pm »

It's very, very "good" and for different reasons. First of all, it's a tightly-wound exercise in filmmaking, and Paul Greengrass knows what he is doing with his camera and editing. Secondly, it's a valuable document. In the end, it's a pretty terrifying experience.

rt

wtbgirl · « **Reply #4 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:34:01 pm »

As a New Yorker, honestly, I can't handle watching it in a theatre, even though the film focuses on the flight bound for Washington. Two of my friends died in the World Trade Center - it was torture trying to watch that TV documentary on PBS a few years ago - and to this day I hate looking at that huge construction pit that was the WTC.

Maybe I could watch it by myself in my apartment.

rtprod · « **Reply #5 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:35:34 pm »

Juan,

I was blown away by specific scenes in this film, the rising dread as air traffic and norad discover what's happening on Sept. 11 nearly real-time, the complete helplessness of the passengers and the pandemonium that breaks out in the cabin, with a plane being flown at super-speed and far too low, utter chaos erupts when the hijack finally happens (an hour into the film) and the final attempted passenger coup...well, just see it. It is a classy film without an ounce of sensationalism, it simply mounts a terrifying episode with filmmaking economy and the emotions on that plane are just primal.

rt

chefjudy · « **Reply #6 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:37:10 pm »

umm, probably not in the theatre, I have an aversion to flying anyway so when I find out a movie has something bad happening to the passengers (like turbulence or crashes etc) I tend to not want to see them - add to that the horror that plays in my mind regarding those terrorist-flown planes and what happended to all of them - let's just say, I'm real uneasy about seeing it visually.................

EnnisDelMar · « **Reply #7 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:37:20 pm »

Sorry about your loss Amy.

Yes I will be seeing it, I actually don't really know everything about this particular story, and am interested in knowing more.

JCinNYC2006 · « **Reply #8 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:43:10 pm »

Sorry to hear that you lost two friends Amy. I only knew one person who died; we'd been out of touch but it was still shocking.

Interesting to be going back and forth between this thread and the one that's currently on Michael Moore. Maybe a documentary would have me more interested than a movie where it's assumed that some of the story is embellished for dramatic effect.

Juan

wtbgirl · « **Reply #9 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:44:36 pm »

Thanks Brandon - it's OK, it's been some time, and I've made as much peace with 9/11 as I'm ever going to make.

I think United 93 is actually a good story to tell, I don't find the fact that they made this film offensive in any way, honestly, I hope it does do well - it has gotten good reviews, and I think the passengers deserve their story to be told.

For me, I think it's just one of those things I need to see alone, at home.

rtprod · « **Reply #10 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:47:14 pm »

Amy, I too am so sorry to hear your story, and this film deals with all of the events of the morning -- New York and the planes that struck the towers is the first half of the film, so you might do well to stay away from it.

Juan, it actually doesn't really dramatize them per se, it just shows them in a docu-style -- many of the "actors" are the real-life air traffic controllers who played the same roles that day, as well as actual pilots playing pilots, the head of air traffic plays himself and it was his first day of work. It's a great "performance" he does, must have been something to relive.

rt

slayers_creek_oth · « **Reply #11 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:48:01 pm »

Quote from: amy7769 on April 25, 2006, 03:34:01 pm

As a New Yorker, honestly, I can't handle watching it in a theatre, even though the film focuses on the flight bound for Washington. Two of my friends died in the World Trade Center - it was torture trying to watch that TV documentary on PBS a few years ago - and to this day I hate looking at that huge construction pit that was the WTC.

Maybe I could watch it by myself in my apartment.

I'm sorry Amy....thats tough...

JCinNYC2006 · « **Reply #12 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:49:18 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 25, 2006, 03:35:34 pm

Juan,

I was blown away by specific scenes in this film, the rising dread as air traffic and norad discover what's happening on Sept. 11 nearly real-time, the complete helplessness of the passengers and the pandemonium that breaks out in the cabin, with a plane being flown at super-speed and far too low, utter chaos erupts when the hijack finally happens (an hour into the film) and the final attempted passenger coup...well, just see it. It is a classy film without an ounce of sensationalism, it simply mounts a terrifying episode with filmmaking economy and the emotions on that plane are just primal.

rt

Thanks rt, that helps. Underneath all my concerns about it's purpose, I think I'm just dreading how the movie will make me feel. (I felt the same way about Brokeback, but I welcomed it then). But your feedback helps a lot.

Juan

henrypie · « **Reply #13 on:** April 25, 2006, 03:56:43 pm »

There are a lot of great movies I won't see because I'm -- technical term here -- chicken.

It's hard to express to people why I won't see what I nickname "shot in the face" movies. I just can't process the fear -- I get physically sick. Part of me is willing to consider that it may be linked to a childhood experience of being mugged at gunpoint... although my intolerance is not strictly related to depictions of gun-use.

I've often thought I'd be a good film critic, but for my inability to handle so many movies.

So, no.

MaineWriter · « **Reply #14 on:** April 25, 2006, 04:05:22 pm »

This is one about which I am very ambivalent.

On one hand, I like to see movies that get good reviews and that people are talking about. Over on rottentomatoes this is at 92% right now. Plus, I have come to trust the opinion of our "critic in residence" rt so his endorsement carries a lot of weight for me.

On the other hand, I have my own personal 9/11 story (I won't bore everyone with the details). Not as horrific as many as I have heard, but there's a scar on my soul from that day. I'm not sure I'm ready to go there yet.

If I do see it, it will be in the theater.

L

wtbgirl · « **Reply #15 on:** April 25, 2006, 04:08:41 pm »

Thanks everyone for your thoughts.

Like Juan said, "I think I'm just dreading how the movie will make me feel."

I echo his sentiments. For me, I just don't know if I am personally ready to see this yet, especially the early parts of the film dealing directly with NYC (as was mentioned) but as I said, I think it is a worthwhile film for people to see.

dmmb_Mandy · « **Reply #16 on:** April 25, 2006, 04:40:13 pm »

*big hug, Amy*

Yes, I too will be seeing it.

ednbarby · « **Reply #17 on:** April 25, 2006, 04:53:57 pm »

Honestly, I was waiting to hear that it was faithfully and tastefully and respectfully done. Since it sounds like it meets those criteria and is a good film to boot, I will very likely see it. And like Brandon, I don't know as much about that story as some of the others, so I'd be interested in learning more.

I understand the aversion of many here to seeing it, believe me - my husband is a 767 pilot for American Airlines. And a good friend he was based out of Miami with for years who moved up to New Hampshire about 6 years ago to fly out of Logan lost his best friend who was piloting one of the American flights - he was a husband and father of two young boys who played with his two young girls.

jura86 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:04:30 pm »

I really want to see it but its not coming out in the UK till bloody September!!! Which is crazy, since its a British film, isn't it?

EnnisDelMar · « **Reply #19 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:12:17 pm »

No it's an American film, just the director is from the UK.

slayers_creek_oth · « **Reply #20 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:14:18 pm »

Quote from: jura86 on April 25, 2006, 06:04:30 pm

I really want to see it but its not coming out in the UK till bloody September!!! Which is crazy, since its a British film, isn't it?

Really? I thought it was American.....

Chanterais · « **Reply #21 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:16:08 pm »

Yep, I'm seeing it in the theatre, and I'll have an enormous, cathartic, howling cry. It'll be good for me.

My question is this:

Is it appropriate to stuff your face with popcorn while watching it? Skittles? Nothing seems right. Even sucking back an icy cold diet coke seems disrespectful. Can I mournfully crunch nachos? Eat a hot dog for liberty and freedom? It's a conundrum.

slayers_creek_oth · « **Reply #22 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:18:29 pm »

Quote from: Chanterais on April 25, 2006, 06:16:08 pm

Yep, I'm seeing it in the theatre, and I'll have an enormous, cathartic, howling cry. It'll be good for me.

My question is this:

Is it appropriate to stuff your face with popcorn while watching it? Skittles? Nothing seems right. Even sucking back an icy cold diet coke seems disrespectful. Can I mournfully crunch nachos? Eat a hot dog for liberty and freedom? It's a conundrum.

Wow....thats a tough question......hmmm!

Ellemeno · « **Reply #23 on:** April 25, 2006, 06:31:52 pm »

I'll see it. My sister's boyfriend's brother was on that flight. (September 11th happened before my sister met her boyfriend though). He was an aviation engineer and designer, and piloted smaller planes. His family feels that if he had had the opportunity, he could have piloted that plane, with help from the ground. They don't think he got the chance.

ednbarby · « **Reply #24 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:12:42 pm »

Quote from: Chanterais on April 25, 2006, 06:16:08 pm

Yep, I'm seeing it in the theatre, and I'll have an enormous, cathartic, howling cry. It'll be good for me.

My question is this:

Is it appropriate to stuff your face with popcorn while watching it? Skittles? Nothing seems right. Even sucking back an icy cold diet coke seems disrespectful. Can I mournfully crunch nachos? Eat a hot dog for liberty and freedom? It's a conundrum.

Uh... Wouldn't that be like making out with your significant other during "Schindler's List?"

slayers_creek_oth · « **Reply #25 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:15:05 pm »

Quote from: ednbarby on April 25, 2006, 07:12:42 pm

Uh... Wouldn't that be like making out with your significant other during "Schindler's List?"

What is that from? Sounds familiar...

wtbgirl · « **Reply #26 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:37:21 pm »

It was a Seinfeld episode.

delalluvia · « **Reply #27 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:42:49 pm »

Not only no, but hell no. Ditto what chefjudy said:

Quote

umm, probably not in the theatre, I have an aversion to flying anyway so when I find out a movie has something bad happening to the passengers (like turbulence or crashes etc) I tend to not want to see them - add to that the horror that plays in my mind regarding those terrorist-flown planes and what happended to all of them - let's just say, I'm real uneasy about seeing it visually...

rtprod · « **Reply #28 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:53:28 pm »

Quote

Is it appropriate to stuff your face with popcorn while watching it?

I did, but I had second thoughts about until I realized how damn hungry I was....!

rt

MaineWriter · « **Reply #29 on:** April 25, 2006, 07:59:59 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 25, 2006, 07:53:28 pm

Quote
Is it appropriate to stuff your face with popcorn while watching it?

I did, but I had second thoughts about until I realized how damn hungry I was....!

rt

Movie critics are allowed to eat popcorn? They actually serve popcorn? Somehow I pictured you in this incubator of movie-dom, separated from all things human, allowing the film to flow over, under, through, and in you, creating a sense of...

Oh never mind, you actually ate popcorn?
L

rtprod · « **Reply #30 on:** April 25, 2006, 08:30:01 pm »

Yeah, I did since this one was hosted in a multi-plex with roped off rows for us important types. LOL.

Most of the time we view in a bubble of isolation-dom (read: critics screening room).

rt

David · « **Reply #31 on:** April 25, 2006, 08:45:54 pm »

I may not go to the theatre to see it, but I'll probably rent it.

I've seen so much on all the things that happened on 9-11.

The one I liked the best was about what happened to all the flights that were diverted to Canada and Newfoundland.

It was heartwarming to see how these 10s of thousands of stranded people were welcomed into the homes of the local people. At the end of the show they revealed that some of the wealthy stranded passengers later sent back HUGE donations to schools and local charities. I sat there in tears watching it.

Personally, I liked how in the few weeks after 9-11 everyone around seemed so polite and friendly. Nobody cut eachother off in traffic, people held doors for you, they hung flags from every bridge and overpass on the eastcoast. It was nice. I still have my American flag flying to this day at my house.

What a shame that all the politeness and patriotism is gone. $:-\$

David

rtprod · « **Reply #32 on:** April 25, 2006, 08:50:08 pm »

David,

That politeness and patriotism has eroded for some very complicated reasons, not just apathy. The administration has divided us with their partisan posturing and unwarranted warmongering.

Also, I'm offering the perspective of international friends living in other countries, who initially poured out support and then recoiled for good and obvious reasons.

rt

David · « **Reply #33 on:** April 25, 2006, 09:11:31 pm »

Ugh, I know. The whole Iraq mess is a no-win situation for all involved.

Well, a few people are winning. The ones with stock in Haliburton Inc. !

oh! don't forget Exxon/Mobil Oil company. Who seem to be having record setting profits despite the turmoil in the Mid East that supposedly is causing fuel prices to rise.

Did anyone else get the Boycott Exxon/Mobil emails?
The theory is that if we ALL stop buying from those two Gas stations (they are the same company for those who didn't know that) thus they will have a huge surplus of gasoline in their depots. And you know what happens to any product when there is a glut of it! The price drops!!!

ARG!

Lynne · « **Reply #34 on:** April 25, 2006, 09:50:32 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 25, 2006, 08:50:08 pm

That politeness and patriotism has eroded for some very complicated reasons, not just apathy...Also, I'm offering the perspective of international friends living in other countries, who initially poured out support and then recoiled for good and obvious reasons.

Quote from: DavidinHartford on April 25, 2006, 09:11:31 pm

Ugh, I know. The whole Iraq mess is a no-win situation for all involved. ..Well, a few people are winning. The ones with stock in Haliburton Inc. !

Very good points, rtprod and David.

I will see United 93, but I do not know when. It will be hard - I also think viewing it at home alone might be best for me.

This is only peripherally related, but a co-worker today turned down a new, better position because it would involve travel to Israel. She is a German national, but our company is American, and some sectors have government contracts. Much of our conversation was about how since 9/11 we're reluctant to travel abroad - moreso because of the American connection than because of being female travelling alone.

It's a sad state of affairs.

-Lynne

--Edited to correct embedded quote problem.

Front-Ranger · « **Reply #35 on:** April 25, 2006, 10:50:25 pm »

I think I will see it. The New Yorker review of today was very positive

MaineWriter · « **Reply #36 on:** April 27, 2006, 01:09:58 pm »

Potential conflict of interest declared: I like Slate (www.slate.com) and find that their articles tend to resonate well with my fairly liberal point of view.

Okay, so I just read this at lunch, thought it was interesting. I won't post the whole thing, just the link. Head on over and read it, folks.
L
xo

Hijacking the Hijacking
The problem with the United 93 films.
By Ron Rosenbaum

http://www.slate.com/id/2140676/

isabelle · « **Reply #37 on:** April 27, 2006, 01:27:18 pm »

Yes I will see it, whenever it comes to France.
Yes I will be affected. Not only am I scared of flying, but I also have relatives in the US, and my cousin was working in the WTC at the time (I know the film is not about the crash into the WTC, but same day). The only reason he is still alive is that, THAT day, he was off sick!

delalluvia · « **Reply #38 on:** April 27, 2006, 08:25:59 pm »

Quote from: lnicoll on April 27, 2006, 01:09:58 pm

Potential conflict of interest declared: I like Slate (www.slate.com) and find that their articles tend to resonate well with my fairly liberal point of view.

Okay, so I just read this at lunch, thought it was interesting. I won't post the whole thing, just the link. Head on over and read it, folks.
L
xo

Hijacking the Hijacking
The problem with the United 93 films.
By Ron Rosenbaum

http://www.slate.com/id/2140676/

Well written piece, but I don't agree with most of it. It's hard to say what the motivations are behind the movie and how people are likely to take it.

twistedude · « **Reply #39 on:** April 28, 2006, 01:53:48 am »

As Front-Ranger said, the New Yorker gave it a great review; I will see it when it comes here. Preventing more than half of our congressmen from being incinerated seems to me to be more than dumb patriotism...

serious crayons · « **Reply #40 on:** April 28, 2006, 08:23:14 am »

Well, I burst into tears yesterday while watching the commercial. Not that the ad was that effective, but that thinking about that flight in particular always gets to me. I wasn't sure I wanted to see it dramatized.

So I was on the fence. I thought I'd read a few reviews before deciding. The New Yorker one was glowing. And now, the a recommendation from RT, someone I actually know (sort of) and whose opinon I respect, I'm leaning toward going.

Flashframe777 · « **Reply #41 on:** April 28, 2006, 10:05:17 am »

This is a hard one, but yes, I am going to see this in the theaters.

Lynne · « **Reply #42 on:** April 28, 2006, 10:46:11 am »

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5368216 (Audio)

I heard this review on NPR this morning - positive, yet mixed. I thought it was interesting information about the film-making being focused toward a 'group protagonist' by using unknown actors to blend with the real-life people involved. It mentions how drama requires well-defined protagonists (Jack and Ennis, for instance) to resonate with an audience.

-Lynne

Kelda · « **Reply #43 on:** April 28, 2006, 03:20:11 pm »

Can I ask a question?

Was there no a tv mini drama thing on ABC or something that also covered the washington flight?

When i was in Cuba in Feb they had all these american cable channels and I remember watching a chat show that was interviewing all the actors and some relatives of those the actors were playing.. and they were all talking about how great and piognant it was.. I was sure it was for a tv drama/documentary... but I may be wrong.. but it seems a bit early for it to have been the film

If so, what type of reaction did it get?

I am undecided whether I'll see it..but I have till Sept to decide...

rtprod · « **Reply #44 on:** April 28, 2006, 05:47:56 pm »

The Wall Sreet Journal this morning contains an excellent, insightful review.

Just at FYI.

rt

Chanterais · « **Reply #45 on:** April 28, 2006, 06:14:48 pm »

Quote from: latjoreme on April 28, 2006, 08:23:14 am

Well, I burst into tears yesterday while watching the commercial.

Oh, me too. How silly is that? I'm not normally susceptible to the manipulations of 30-second ads in commercial breaks, but I was just flattened by it. Not just a lump in the throat, or a quiet sniffle. I bawled for a good five minutes. Very therapeutic. Invest in Kleenex stocks now.

Flashframe777 · « **Reply #46 on:** April 28, 2006, 09:42:37 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 28, 2006, 05:47:56 pm

The Wall Sreet Journal this morning contains an excellent, insightful review.

Just at FYI.

rt

I've only heard or read positive reviews myself.

twistedude · « **Reply #47 on:** April 28, 2006, 10:08:20 pm »

Read a review in the local rag this afternoon, which said, no matter ho0w well-made it is, if it's not helping anyione get over the tragedy, why bother to see it?

I don't feel that way. I had nobiody involved, except several people I know in NYC mentioned that the smell of decomposing bodies was a real downer (something that didn't get mentioned in the papers), but I am still going to watch it..

Like theJFK assination, we all know where we were, when it happened...

serious crayons · « **Reply #48 on:** April 29, 2006, 12:20:20 am »

Quote from: Flashframe777 on April 28, 2006, 09:42:37 pm

Quote from: rtprod on April 28, 2006, 05:47:56 pm
The Wall Sreet Journal this morning contains an excellent, insightful review.

Just at FYI.

rt

I've only heard or read positive reviews myself.

Slate's review isn't all that positive, and I really like the woman who is now their film critic (Dana Stevens). But that don't mean nothin; nobody's infallible.

rtprod · « **Reply #49 on:** April 29, 2006, 12:18:16 pm »

Read the Rotten Tomatoes meter -- it's 93% fresh.

Funny that some reviews would like to focus on whether or not it's "right" to make this film or whether it "adds" anything -- oh, please, let's look at what a terrifically made film it is, and not throw the baby out with the bathwater. It has just as much right to exist as the Hollywood dreck opening each weekend.

Many are talking about their personal sensitivity to the subject, but that really has nothing to do with what an expert film this is when it comes to craft, and speaks to scenarios we personally visit on movies, rather than looking objectively at a core statement:

What was the director trying to achieve? And how well did he achieve it?

Whether or not we "like" it doesn't always make much difference if we want to be objective. I might personally think certain modern art is junk but by the definition above, it certainly is my point of view rather than the artist's intention or execution. My personal opinion doesn't remove its merit. It's an interesting subject.

rt

starboardlight · « **Reply #50 on:** April 29, 2006, 12:44:20 pm »

I haven't tried to look up any reviews. All I've seen are a couple of tv ads. Maybe it's the failing of the marketing, but it's not telling me what I'd get from the film other than reliving what the people went through. I want it be more than just a dramatized version of what happened. I want it to give me a better understanding or something. I don't want to relive their terror for the sake of reliving their terror. Is there a catharsis that come from going through that terror? That's what I'm not getting from the marketing of the film. If it's going to touch on such a horrific event in our lives, it better be transcendent. Otherwise, I'd just feel like people are exploiting the tragedy for the not much more than money.

luigival · « **Reply #51 on:** April 29, 2006, 01:36:09 pm »

My personal opinion is that we're still too near in time to the real events, so this could deter a large number of viewers.
As far as I am concerned, though I am still shocked by those tragic events, I will try to see it as soon as it arrives here in Italy to honour those who lost their lives in that mournful day.

dmmb_Mandy · « **Reply #52 on:** April 29, 2006, 01:46:40 pm »

BTW, did anyone watch CNN last night? Larry King had people on talking about the movie. Some of the actors from the films were there, as well as family members of some of the people who were on the flight. They called the program "United 93: Too Soon?" About half of the guests loved the film and didn't think it was too soon, and the others thought it was too soon.

rtprod · « **Reply #53 on:** April 29, 2006, 02:04:11 pm »

I JUST DON'T GET THIS "TOO SOON" THING.

Too soon for what? It's a great film, guys, and a critical event in American history, and if it's "too soon" for a movie to be made about it, then isn't it also "too soon" for the scores of books that have been written about in the last five years? Is it also "too soon" for The Falling Man, the short doc about the Windows on the World employee who was photographed, tragically and famously, falling from the WTC? These are stories that have shaped us, and I'd rather look at them eyes open and see where I've been.

rt

rtprod · « **Reply #54 on:** April 29, 2006, 02:06:47 pm »

Quote

If it's going to touch on such a horrific event in our lives, it better be transcendent. Otherwise, I'd just feel like people are exploiting the tragedy for the not much more than money.

It is a work of art and a valuable record without an ounce of sensationalism. Anyone who knows Paul Greengrass' Bloody Sunday knows that he is as far away from a commercial profit-meister as a director could be in handling a real-life incident as in that film and this one.

Money, no. This is not a commercial film as we know them, it has not an ounce of manipulation and exists to document as well as enshrine those on that plane.

rt

delalluvia · « **Reply #55 on:** April 29, 2006, 02:22:08 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 29, 2006, 02:04:11 pm

I JUST DON'T GET THIS "TOO SOON" THING.

Too soon for what? It's a great film, guys, and a critical event in American history, and if it's "too soon" for a movie to be made about it, then isn't it also "too soon" for the scores of books that have been written about in the last five years? Is it also "too soon" for The Falling Man, the short doc about the Windows on the World employee who was photographed, tragically and famously, falling from the WTC? These are stories that have shaped us, and I'd rather look at them eyes open and see where I've been.

rt

I think the 'too soon' thing is about being sensitive to people's emotions. Some people are still grieving over their lost ones. Calling up the memory and repeating over and over the deaths of their loved ones in bright 40 foot screens of Technicolor, large billboards, TV commercials may be too much to take.

People need time to work through their emotions, time is the healer. Memories fade for a reason. The expression I think is 'tearing open old wounds'.

MaineWriter · « **Reply #56 on:** April 29, 2006, 03:21:23 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 29, 2006, 12:18:16 pm

Many are talking about their personal sensitivity to the subject, but that really has nothing to do with what an expert film this is when it comes to craft, and speaks to scenarios we personally visit on movies, rather than looking objectively at a core statement:

What was the director trying to achieve? And how well did he achieve it?

rt

Perhaps, rt, it is "too soon" for many people in that it brings back memories, opens a wound, scratches across a scar that one thought was healed...and in that, a person is not able to get to the "core statement" and be objective.

Time is a great healer. I think for many, five years is not enough time. I am not of the "it is too soon to make this movie" mindset...I mean, they were making WWII movies during the war. However, for me, it may be too soon to see it. I haven't decided.

L
xo

starboardlight · « **Reply #57 on:** April 29, 2006, 03:51:52 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 29, 2006, 02:06:47 pm

Quote
If it's going to touch on such a horrific event in our lives, it better be transcendent. Otherwise, I'd just feel like people are exploiting the tragedy for the not much more than money.

It is a work of art and a valuable record without an ounce of sensationalism. Anyone who knows Paul Greengrass' Bloody Sunday knows that he is as far away from a commercial profit-meister as a director could be in handling a real-life incident as in that film and this one.

Money, no. This is not a commercial film as we know them, it has not an ounce of manipulation and exists to document as well as enshrine those on that plane.

rt

well that's good to hear. i honestly didn't look into who were involved in the film making or anything. i'll check it out when I get a chance.

JCinNYC2006 · « **Reply #58 on:** April 29, 2006, 08:27:51 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on April 29, 2006, 02:04:11 pm

I JUST DON'T GET THIS "TOO SOON" THING.

As a New Yorker, part of the 'too soon' thing is that in some ways, it doesn't feel like it's totally over. I still occasionally have conversations with people wondering whether New York could get hit again. I can see the Empire State Building, and the thought of what it might be like for that to be attacked crosses my mind regularly.

I hope that doesn't sound paranoid, and of course I don't speak for all New Yorkers. It's hard to describe, but maybe in a way, the movie is for the rest of the country. From what I've read it doesn't include any visuals of the WTC attacks, they're mentioned in the context of the hijacking and apparently motivated the passengers to try and organize a response.

There is an interesting cover story on this week's NY Press (www.nypress.com. It takes a more questioning, critical tone of the movie and this is one of the quotes that really stood out for me: "this film, which is dedicated to the memory of all who died, is ironically designed to make you erase everything but the 100 most emotionally intense minutes of 9/11."

Because the movie is based partly on the limited amount of recordings and accounts available, it's hard to say how much of it is 'docu' and how much is 'drama'. But probably many people will leave the movie with the impression that it's exactly what happened. I'm not sure why that bothers me so much, but something about that does. Eh, my thoughts aren't very organized right now. Yeesh.

Juan

rtprod · « **Reply #59 on:** April 29, 2006, 11:57:43 pm »

Juan,

Got your point -- by the way, yes the destruction of the two towers figures prominently in the first half of the film, and incorporates actual video footage of the second tower being hit.

Not sure why it bothers you so much about the exact accuracy of what went on in the cabin as the majority of it is culled from trascripts, phone calls, etc., and not much seems to have been "dramatized" really though the passengers do get into the cockpit in the final moments, which is a supposition many have made. It's likely the best and closest depiction of reality we will see.

rt

JCinNYC2006 · « **Reply #60 on:** April 30, 2006, 12:28:41 am »

It's very hard to communicate this through writing without sounding insensitive or crass. I don't understand why there is a need to know what happened. I think the Slate article articulated my thoughts about it better than I can.

The stuff about trying to find something redemptive in the hijackings and the attacks to regain a sense of control. With a pointless war going on, I'm not really seeing much to be optimistic about. I'm really not trying to be provocative, I thinking out loud and the prospect of the movie freaks me out. But who knows, I may see it and change my mind. So far, none of my friends want to see it though.

Juan

EnnisDelMar · « **Reply #61 on:** May 01, 2006, 10:03:04 am »

I just saw it last night, my advice: Go see it. It was unlike any movie I've seen. It was really like you were you watching it as it was happening back on September 11th. It leaves you with a lot of respect for the passengers on 93, who gave their lives to save the lives of others, and stand up for their country.

rtprod · « **Reply #62 on:** May 01, 2006, 11:10:07 am »

Quote

I just saw it last night, my advice: Go see it. It was unlike any movie I've seen. It was really like you were you watching it as it was happening back on September 11th. It leaves you with a lot of respect for the passengers on 93, who gave their lives to save the lives of others, and stand up for their country.

I can't imagine how they did this after realizing the plane was on a kamikaze mission, but they did. They were driven by this unknowable force, an innate and primal drive to do what was "right" even though they likely knew the outcome. That fact that they did this in such a panicked rush without a clear strategy, under such duress, is really something.

rt

JennyC · « **Reply #63 on:** May 01, 2006, 06:26:33 pm »

I will be seeing the movie, hopefully some time this week. Since few materials were available on what exactly happened on the plane, I am interested in how they are going to tell the story.

kirkmusic · « **Reply #64 on:** May 08, 2006, 01:55:38 am »

There was a Rolling Stone article about the flight some years ago and it was an amazing story. Since the film is getting such great reviews I will be seeing it. I see anything that is so well received.

ednbarby · « **Reply #65 on:** May 08, 2006, 09:34:20 am »

I don't mean to be a provocateur, here, and I hope no one will take this as being somehow disrespectful or unpatriotic, but a question keeps knocking around in my brain about this. I admit, I haven't seen the movie and only know as much about what happened on that specific flight as was reported in the media in and around the time. But... Is it possible that the innate, primal urge you speak of, RT, is the drive to survive? When my husband and I have talked about this, his being a pilot and all especially, he's said that if he were on that flight as a passenger, sure as shit he'd try to take over the flight, not specifically to try to save people on the ground, but to try to save everyone on that plane. I've always looked at it like they knew from people on their cell phones what had already happened, and so they knew they were going to crash. My innate drive, I think, would have been first and foremost not to.

Again, I don't mean to take away from their heroism - in fact I mean to add to it, because I think it's still incredibly brave to take that chance rather than to just sit there and cry and let someone else determine your fate.

rtprod · « **Reply #66 on:** May 08, 2006, 10:52:04 am »

Hi Barb,

Never anything wrong with being a provocateur, is there?

You are right on target and that is what I was referring to when I spoke of that primal urge --- in the film, it is to survive and not depicted as anything heroic or patriotic. It is simply to take over the plane and land safely.

rt

ednbarby · « **Reply #67 on:** May 08, 2006, 01:14:45 pm »

Quote from: rtprod on May 08, 2006, 10:52:04 am

Hi Barb,

Never anything wrong with being a provocateur, is there?

You are right on target and that is what I was referring to when I spoke of that primal urge --- in the film, it is to survive and not depicted as anything heroic or patriotic. It is simply to take over the plane and land safely.

Excellent. And that just sold me on it - completely. I will absolutely see it now - hopefully this weekend.

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