Author Topic: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind  (Read 90301 times)

Offline delalluvia

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2006, 08:26:39 pm »
Ummm, I think in BBM, the wind is blowing because in Wyoming the wind is always blowing.

IMO some things were done for the ambiance and reality of their locales.

I never did buy the Christ-analogy of Jack thing.

He has very little in common with Jesus.

Jack wades through water with a sheep - he doesn't 'walk on water', yes he is a shepherd, but he also wants to shoot and eat the sheep.  Hardly a 'good shepherd'.

Lee is Buddhist, IMO he imbued his movie more with eastern religious imagery than western.

Aguirre never said or implied Jack could cure pneumonia, Jack just said he couldn't do anything about it and Aguirre agreed. [shrug].

« Last Edit: May 01, 2006, 08:28:56 pm by delalluvia »

Offline EnnisLovesJack

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2006, 08:56:02 pm »
Hey atz!

The second time my sister saw the movie, she thought Jack says "The sheep got all over my ass, like I'm supposed to control the weather!" I couldn't stop laughing.

Especially 'cause she didn't believe me that it's "Aguirre got all over my ass..." till her third  viewing. She thought the sheep were afraid 'cause of the lightning, and literally piled up around/on top of Jack, like kids crawling into their parents' bed after a bad dream.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2006, 04:06:53 pm by EnnisLovesJack »
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Offline Aussie Chris

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #12 on: May 01, 2006, 09:09:03 pm »
Especially 'cause she didn't believe me that it's "Aguirre got all over my ass..." till her third  viewing. She thought the sheep were afraid 'cause of the lightning, and literally piled up around/on top of Jack, like kids crawling into their parents' bed after a bad dream.

That's too funny!  You can just see it can't you?  Jack standing there with a confused expression (a little like in the "the hell they are" scene) and there are scores of sheep all around him, clamering to get up into his protective arms.  Oh wait, that's me projecting again... ;)
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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #13 on: May 01, 2006, 10:27:04 pm »
Jesus only walked on water one time during a storm and the disciples were already in a ship out on the sea when he did that.

In the Bible, wind and spirit are the very same words in the original languages.

I don't see so much "religion" in the move as much as I see spirituality. Religion is what one does by living by a set of man-made rules. Spiritually has to do with one's relationship with one's higher power, no matter what religious persuasion, his relationship with others, his environment and how he feels about himself.

In the published in book form original story, there is only one paragraph with any connection with religion.

But, in my "Christian" mystic way of thinking at times, I do see that there is lots of spiritual undertones in the movie. I did some study of the Spanish mystic, Santa Teresa of Avila, and in some of her writings and what was written about her, I just believe that she was somewhat Pentecostal by experience. I was a Spanish major in college in the early 1960s and I read what she wrote in Spanish. I had a therapist who had been a former nun (although I did not know it until someone else told me first) and I talked to her about thinking of Teresa with my own meditation experiences.

The Annie Proulx "Water-Walking Jesus" was developed into an on-screen discussion about going to hell because of the fact that it was called a sad hymn and Jack sang it like a funerary song which one might sing on Good Friday.

Offline nakymaton

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2006, 10:41:44 pm »
She thought the sheep were afraid 'cause of the lightning, and literally piled up around/on top of Jack, like kids crawling into their parents' bed after a bad dream.

I love this image. :D
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Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #15 on: May 01, 2006, 11:17:49 pm »
Heya Friends,

:laugh: I quite enjoy the idea of the sheep crawling all over Jack too.

Anyway... TJ, I don't think there's "religion" in the movie in any conventional sense either... I do think the filmmakers play with the symbolism of religion a lot though.  To me the symbols are more allegorical or poetic than anything else.  And, as I said before, I'm not at all religious myself, but I still found some of the religious symbolism used in the film quite poignant.  This topic probably deserves its own thread or two.

But, I'd rather talk about the wind.  :D  Hey, so I re-watched the divorce scene again tonight and noticed a new wind symbol.  Above Ennis sad little shack he has a windmill! But, the whole time we see it the windmill is completely still.  It reminds me of that huge, still fan that sits right next to Alma Jr. in the last scene when she's talking to Ennis about the wedding.

I love how the symbol of the wind seems to mirror Jack's personality and role in the movie.  He's the "breathe of fresh air" so to speak and the light-hearted one (at least in the beginning).  I love the idea that the wind is in constant motion and that's how Jack has to live his life in order to facilitate the relationship with Ennis.  He's like the wind blowing back and forth across all those miles, fields, plains, etc. going back and forth between Wyoming and Texas.  And on his drive up to see Ennis right before the heartbreaking divorce scene... we can see that he enjoys this driving  and the freedom of the road (especially when he thinks Ennis is at the end of the road).
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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2006, 11:37:02 pm »
In the various discussions of the movie, I see members of the BetterMost forums and other online forums and internet email type groups using eisegesis when discussing the book and the movie.

I tried to do my best to use "exegesis" when reading Annie Proulx's Brokeback Mountain for the first time. In that, I attempted to follow the rules of literary hermeneutics and try to understand the author's own world view of what she was writing about. With exegesis, one does not attempt to read his own ideas/experiences into a story or other piece of literature, to do so is to use "eisegesis."

But, when I saw the movie several weeks after I had read the story, I had a problem with "eisegesis" when I saw the movie because I had read the story first and had some understanding of her POV.

I even feel that Larry McMurtry and Diana Ossana used eisegesis in their adaptation of the story into a screenplay. I see that they added people and things which were not even in the book and probably never thought of by Annie Proulx in the first place. And, eisegesis seems to have been used by the movie makers, too.

I consider it eisegesis when people assume "wrang it out" means Ennis masturbated and "stem the rose" meant to "have anal sex with the anus being a 'rose' and a penis being a 'stem'." But, to "wring something out" has to do with thinking of the same thing over and over trying to figure out what it means, sort of like wringing the same piece of cloth over and over trying to figure out why it won't dry. And to "stem the rose" comes from the act of cutting rose blooms off of stems for no purpose whatsoever and that is from the verb, to "stem," which means "remove the stem from a flower or a fruit." Here in Oklahoma, we call removing the stems from berries "hulling them" when we are not putting hulls (stems) on them, we are taking them off.

Offline EnnisLovesJack

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2006, 04:08:45 pm »
Quote
Oh wait, that's me projecting again... ;)
eh...potayto, potahto
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Offline starboardlight

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2006, 12:16:38 am »
let me add a haiku i wrote a while back.

Winds of the mountain
rush through me and I hear him
wispering my name.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 12:34:58 am by starboardlight »
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Offline EnnisLovesJack

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Re: "I was supposed to control the weather"... Jack and the Wind
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2006, 12:29:30 pm »
let me add a haiku i wrote a while back.

Winds of the mountain
rush through me and I hear him
wispering my name.
Very nice. I quite like that.
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