Author Topic: Stay Home.  (Read 40520 times)

Offline JennyC

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #30 on: May 03, 2006, 04:07:45 pm »
starboard,

I agree that the current H1-B process is not very accessible for most of the illegal immigrants here today.  I certainly hope now that people recognize the need for low skilled worker to fill jobs that are not very appealing to normal US work force, whatever new “Guess Worker” program that are in the work should be designed to meet the needs of the targeted audience, both from the employer and the potential employee perspectives.  They should not be held at the same H1-B standard.

Illegal immigrants issue is not unique in US.  Many counties are facing the same issue, just at different magnitude.  US certainly have the worst illegal immigrants issue in terms of the no. of illegal immigrants.  I have to say that if you look around the world, US actually has one of the most open immigration policy than most of the counties.  It’s much harder to immigrate to most of the European counties, skilled or not.   

Offline starboardlight

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #31 on: May 03, 2006, 07:33:10 pm »
I'm curious Jenny, are you going through the H1-B process, yourself?
"To do is to be." Socrates. - "To be is to do." Plato. - "Do be do be do" Sinatra.

Offline JennyC

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #32 on: May 03, 2006, 08:16:15 pm »
I'm curious Jenny, are you going through the H1-B process, yourself?

I have gone throug H1-B and greencard process.  I am out of that woods for a few years now. :)
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 08:19:34 pm by JennyC »

Offline starboardlight

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #33 on: May 03, 2006, 08:21:45 pm »
I have gone throug H1-B and greencard process.  I am out of that woods for a few years now. :)

that's good to hear. congrats. some of my college friends are coming up on the last years of their H1-B and have to serious consider doing the Green card process. It's really require quite a bit of forethought. a delay on the DOJ's part and there could be a gap between H1-B status and green card, putting them in illegal status.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 08:23:34 pm by starboardlight »
"To do is to be." Socrates. - "To be is to do." Plato. - "Do be do be do" Sinatra.

Offline opinionista

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #34 on: May 03, 2006, 08:26:49 pm »
Quote
I wasn't exactly talking about those people in particular.  I have relatives in Mexico.  I saw dirt dirt dirt poor people and I wondered - even as a kid - why the frick did they have so many chlldren?  Unfortunately that ties into Catholicism and the 'be fruitful and multiply' thing.

Actually that's not quite true. While Catholic church does encourage married couples to have children, in countries like Mexico, Ecuador and others, the great majorities of women who have children are single mothers. Some are raped, others had a boyfriend who got them pregnant and dumped them after finding out about it. Saddly safe sex is not an option for most of them. Most of these women have no access to anticonceptives and let alone to sexual education.

Quote
I have to say that if you look around the world, US actually has one of the most open immigration policy than most of the counties.

Do you know this for a fact? Because I have heard quite the contrary. It's way harder to get a working permit in the US than it is in other countries such like Spain. I am an immigrant myself. I was born an American Citizen and moved to Spain seven years ago. I didn't have much trouble getting a permit. And Spain is a country with heavy immigration issues. It's as bad here as it is there. This country receives over 1000 of illegal immigrants a day coming mostly from African countries. Spain cannot deport them because it has no agreements with the countries these people come from. It's a terrible situation.

« Last Edit: May 03, 2006, 08:41:14 pm by opinionista »
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.

Offline JennyC

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #35 on: May 03, 2006, 08:43:19 pm »
that's good to hear. congrats. some of my college friends are coming up on the last years of their H1-B and have to serious consider doing the Green card process. It's really require quite a bit of forethought. a delay on the DOJ's part and there could be a gap between H1-B status and green card, putting them in illegal status.

Thanks. We just did what a lot of people did at the time without giving that much of thoughts.  And we got pretty lucky with the whole process before things get really frustrating.  Whether or not we want to move forward with the next step, that's something we really need to think through.  There are many things I really like here, some I don't, but I still don't feel quite at home here.  I appreciate my life experience here very much, it changed me in many different ways (including my view on homosexuality), but there is still part of me that really miss the Chinese culture.  I always joke about how I fall into the crack of two completely different cultures, but that’s what I am, not quite American, not quite Chinese.   :)

Offline opinionista

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #36 on: May 03, 2006, 08:49:44 pm »
lol!  so much to respond to, i don't know where to begin.

del, that makes perfect sense, and i totally agree with it, but things don't always work out that way.  some people get married, buy a house, have kids, and then lose their jobs.  or run themselves up with debt and file for bankruptcy.  or one of the parents goes crazy and kills someone.  or one of the parents gets eaten by a shark.  i mean we can plan as much as possible, and most people probably don't plan, things just happen and they work with what they have.  people should not be punished for things that happen that are out of their control. 

as far as illegal immigrants being, well, illegal, if we enforced every law, this country would not be in the state it is now.  but instead CEOs run companies to the ground and make out like bandits, corporations outsource illegally do avoid paying taxes, there's fraud, embezzelment, you name it corporate america has done it.  but thanks to lobbyists and no-bid contracts and so on it usually ends up going under the radar, unless you're a woman (see: martha stewart). 

and we are talking billions up here.  BILLIONS.  but people don't care about that.  they care about the mothers on welfare, and the immigrants getting healthcare on their dime.  if we had any say of where out tax dollars went, then maybe an argument about taxpayers money would hold up, but we don't.  i'd rather have my tax dollars going to schools, immigrants, and welfare than war-mongering, churches, and paying right-wingers paychecks.  but what do i do?  quit my job?  live on the street?  as a form of protest?  props to anyone who can do that, but i can't.

nipith got everything right.  i used to wonder the same thing myself when i was younger, why not just come legally.  but when you've been around enough immigrants, you begin to see how hard it is. 

i don't even want to TRAVEL to a non-english speaking country before knowing at least the basics of the language.   but that's just me, and some countries do require you to speak the fluent language, but we can not force people to learn english.  that's what translators are for.  if someone doesn't want to learn, or have the resources to learn english, they should have a say in the matter.  would learning the national language enhance your experience?  yes.  we have to remember that most illegal immigrants come here without high school education, let alone college education.  again, we don't know WHY, every person is different.  i dropped out of high school because i hated it.  i couldn't afford to go to college, and i was born here! 

anyway, back to the argument of "just don't do it".  if i had a dollar for every pregnant teenage american i've met i'd be rich.  so few people plan families, they just happen.  it's the middle class american way.  someone brought up native americans, i mean come on!  by these standards we should all be speaking the dialects for our regions.  and the vietnamese immigrants!  my second family immigrated from vietnam illegally, it took them years, but they finally became legal.  but shit!  if we lived in vietnam after what we did to that country, getting papers would be the last thing on my mind. 

there are SO many issues with this that will take forever to correct.  we just have to remember that we are all human, and as long as we ain't hurtin' nobody, there's no reason to hate eachother.  the land doesn't belong to any one person more than the next, regardless of where they're from. 

sorry, i feel bad.  you all articulate responses, i rant  >:(

I agree with you, littledarling.
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.

Offline JennyC

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #37 on: May 03, 2006, 08:58:05 pm »
Do you know this for a fact? Because I have heard quite the contrary. It's way harder to get a working permit in the US than it is in other countries such like Spain.

Honestly, I don’t know about Spain.  I think if you compare US’s immigration policy with that of UK, France, Germany, China, Japan, it’s more open.  Not to mention all the oil rich gulf counties, there is no way they will let a foreigner to become their citizen.  

Also whether or not it’s hard to come to US is all relative to people’s perception.  If more people want to come to US, and US can only accommodate so many, I am sure people will say it’s way harder to come to US than some of counties.  If you ask the people in line to obtain a student visa or visiting visa in front of US embassy in China, they will tell you it’s the hardest thing in the world. But the fact is US allows more foreigners to come here study/work than most of the counties.  It also provide a roadmap to contain permanent residency here (whatever flawed the system is, at least there is one).  I know in many counties, this simply is not an option.  

Offline opinionista

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #38 on: May 04, 2006, 09:17:07 am »
Honestly, I don’t know about Spain.  I think if you compare US’s immigration policy with that of UK, France, Germany, China, Japan, it’s more open.  Not to mention all the oil rich gulf counties, there is no way they will let a foreigner to become their citizen.  

Also whether or not it’s hard to come to US is all relative to people’s perception.  If more people want to come to US, and US can only accommodate so many, I am sure people will say it’s way harder to come to US than some of counties.  If you ask the people in line to obtain a student visa or visiting visa in front of US embassy in China, they will tell you it’s the hardest thing in the world. But the fact is US allows more foreigners to come here study/work than most of the counties.  It also provide a roadmap to contain permanent residency here (whatever flawed the system is, at least there is one).  I know in many counties, this simply is not an option.  


Well, I have met a few people from different Latin American countries who unsuccesfully tried  to obtain a student visa after being admitted to american universities. Some came from wealthy families and others even had scholarships. They ended up going to school in Spain, others went to England because there was no way they could get a visa.

Also, I remember about five years ago I went to buy a plane ticket to go home for the holidays at a Travel Agency. I have a very Spanish last name (I'm Puerto Rican) and they wouldn't let me buy the ticket until I provided them with proof that I have a permit to enter the States. I didn't have that problem when I came to Spain the first time, nor when I went to England, France or Greece. I have heard terrible stories about obtaining a visa to go to US. I invited a few friends to come to Puerto Rico with me and they couldn't go because US immigration wouldn't give them a tourist visa because they're velezuelan and chilean. Perhaps chinese people have it easier for other reasons, but it's tough.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2006, 02:35:01 pm by opinionista »
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.

Offline starboardlight

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Re: Stay Home.
« Reply #39 on: May 04, 2006, 10:31:39 am »
Thanks. We just did what a lot of people did at the time without giving that much of thoughts.  And we got pretty lucky with the whole process before things get really frustrating.  Whether or not we want to move forward with the next step, that's something we really need to think through.  There are many things I really like here, some I don't, but I still don't feel quite at home here.  I appreciate my life experience here very much, it changed me in many different ways (including my view on homosexuality), but there is still part of me that really miss the Chinese culture.  I always joke about how I fall into the crack of two completely different cultures, but that’s what I am, not quite American, not quite Chinese.   :)

oh, it's more than a joke to be sure. I was born in Thailand. My grandparents are Chinese. I grew up here in the US. I know exactly what you mean about not feeling quite belonging to either countries.
"To do is to be." Socrates. - "To be is to do." Plato. - "Do be do be do" Sinatra.