Author Topic: BBM and the sin of Sodom  (Read 14177 times)

Offline YaadPyar

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BBM and the sin of Sodom
« on: May 01, 2006, 05:51:05 pm »
This is from TOB/IMDb - I thought it was pretty intersting.  I've copied the OP.  Check out the link if you want to see the rest.


http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0388795/board/flat/42206750

BBM and the sin of Sodom   
 
 by - pastorfred 1 day ago (Sun Apr 30 2006 08:15:36 )  Ignore this User | Report Abuse 
 

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The Biblical theme of the sin of Sodom figures largely through the movie, but it's not what you think, and its meaning to the story is surprising.

The Bible story is told in the 19th chapter of Genesis, and it is widely misinterpreted as a condemnation of anal sex. Even the word, "sodomy," is used to signify anal sex. That interpretation is totally wrong, however, as told in Ezekiel 16:49: "Neither did she (Sodom) strengthen the hand of the poor and the needy." The sin of Sodom was a lack of hospitality, the victimization of the vulnerable. It was a capital crime in ancient Sodom to give aid to the needy or the stranger. The men of Sodom thought they could do as they pleased to God's messengers (angels) because they were outsiders.

In Brokeback Mountain, the sin of Sodom was committed by the murderers of the rancher, Earl, and by Ennis's father in laughing about it and insisting that his sons see the tortured and murdered body. The consequence of that dreadful sin was the tragic flaw in Ennis, his own internalized homophobia and his inability to integrate his love for Jack into the rest of his life.

One of my pet peeves is the misuse of the story of Sodom to mislead people into believing that homosexual acts are particularly offensive to God, that He destroyed ancient Sodom because of them. The offense, explicitly spelled out in Ezekiel 16:49, was not sexual. Scripture interprets scripture, and I feel that it is past high time to set the record straight. Maybe Brokeback Mountain can help.
 
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Offline Aussie Chris

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2006, 06:04:24 pm »
Great, thanks for posting Celeste.  I've learnt something important today, err, or at least worth remembering.
Nothing is as common as the wish to be remarkable - William Shakespeare

Offline JennyC

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2006, 06:20:50 pm »
Thanks Celesta!  It’s definitely a new take that I have not heard.

I don’t know much about Christianity.  Part of my confusion comes from depending on who you talk to you get a totally different interpretation of the Bible.  I am aware of why Christian (or at least part of them) is against homosexuality and Sodomy.  I have also heard people referring oral sex as Sodomy, hence the argument that a lot of heterosexual couples engage in Sodomy.  Is that right, I mean that oral sex is also considered Sodomy?

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2006, 06:26:11 pm »
Oh, as an independent Pentecostal evangelist who has done graduate study in the Bible when I worked on a 2nd Master's degree at Oral Roberts University, I can even get into a more detailed discussion about what the sin of Sodom really was.

If one does a word search for "Sodom" in an English version Bible or even one for "Sodom" in a Hebrew Text Old Testament and in a Greek Language Bible, he will only come across one time where the sin of Sodom had any connection whatsoever with sex and that is in the 7th verse of the "One-Chapter" Epistle of Jude.

A somewhat literal translation (with added interpretation without changing the meaning) of Jude 7 is "Like the angels who rebelled against God, the (people) of Sodom and Gomorrah and surrounding cities chose to have sex with prostitute of the opposite sex." "Fornication" is the translation of the Greek word, "porneia," which is "sexual activity done by prostitutes." And, the text more or less says they did it by "going after strange flesh." Well, "strange" is the translation of "heteras" which is a Greek contextural spelling of "hetero." And "flesh" is the translation of the Greek word, "sarx" which in turn, is the Greek translation of "basar." "Basar" (literally "shame") is a Hebrew euphemism of genitals and politely means "gender."

The Hebrew language did not have vowel points added to it until well after the time of Jesus. If you read the Hebrew Bible text where the word "Sodomite" appears in English Bible translations, you will see that the actual word refers to a "holy (person)" involved in a religion which is not Jewish. When the very same word, kodesh (actually spelled with 3 Hebrew consonants, K, D, and Sh and no vowels), is used in other locations, it is either a verb, to "be or make holy," or a noun, referring to a "holy" person, place, or thing. In each of those situations where the context has no connection with the worship of YHWH Elohim, the "holy" person, place, or thing is connected with Canaanite worship. AND, in each of those places, nothing is even mentioned about the holy person having sex.

Offline JennyC

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2006, 06:51:38 pm »
I did a quick google search on “Sodomy”.  Found some interesting reading on wikipedia.org (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodomy).  It does mention that “According to recent critiques by some liberal Christians, the sins of Sodom were related more to violation of hospitality laws than sexual sins.”

What’s more interesting is “in the 1950s, all states had some form of law criminalizing sodomy… in 2003, only 10 states had laws prohibiting all sodomy, with penalties ranging from 1 to 15 years imprisonment.”   What happens to the separation of church and state?  Why states need to regulate what two consenting adults want to engage in?
« Last Edit: May 01, 2006, 06:53:41 pm by JennyC »

Offline Flashframe777

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2006, 07:09:34 pm »
But if it were against the law to extend help, then who is to blame?
"yet he is suffused with a sense of pleasure because Jack Twist was in his dream"


Offline delalluvia

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2006, 07:24:14 pm »
Genesis 13:13) "The men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the Lord exceedingly."
This verse doesn't say what the Sodomites did to make them such exceedingly great sinners, though most bible believers equate "Sodomite" with homosexual. (But see Ezekiel 16:49, which claims the sins of Sodom were pride, gluttony, sloth, greed, and failure to help the poor.)

-Skeptics Annotated Bible

Reason lot of people go for the homosexuality angle, is that later in the story, the bible talks about the lewdness of the town and when people tie that in with the idea that Lot offered his virgin daughters, but the crowd refused them and wanted the men instead...[shrug]

Offline Flashframe777

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2006, 07:31:18 pm »
Lot offered his virgin daughters, but the crowd refused them and wanted the men instead...
___________________________________________________________

How many times have I myself been subjected to this very same situation?
"yet he is suffused with a sense of pleasure because Jack Twist was in his dream"


Offline Impish

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2006, 07:33:48 pm »
Interesting, but as I don't believe in "sin" itself, it makes little difference to me how sodomy is defined by the religious.

How our legal code defines it does affect me, you, and everyone living under a given legal code, regardless of our religious beliefs.  Legally speaking, sodomy is used to mean "any act of oral or anal copulation," which is seen as a "bad" thing (and that comes from the fact that most of our laws were written by believers in sin).

Fortunately, constitutional challenges to "anti-sodomy" laws have struck down most of them.  Every year, the number of times the word is used in the US legal code drops significantly.  Yippee!   ;D

I believe (hope?) the same trend is occuring for the legal codes of other countries, but many of them never had anti-sodomy laws to begin with.  Kudos to them!   ;D
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Offline delalluvia

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Re: BBM and the sin of Sodom
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2006, 07:35:57 pm »
Lot offered his virgin daughters, but the crowd refused them and wanted the men instead...
___________________________________________________________

How many times have I myself been subjected to this very same situation?

 :D :laugh: :D :laugh: :D :laugh: