Author Topic: Discrimination  (Read 18137 times)

Offline Wishes

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #30 on: September 26, 2007, 12:47:40 pm »
Rayn, I'll have to disagree. I'm listening to KGO Newstalk in San Francisco right now and they are saying that any negative publicity this guy is getting here in the U.S. is actually uniting Iranians in his favor at this point. Eventhough he is considered rather unstable even in Iran.

The reputation of the U.S. is rather pathetic around the world. It would take quite a lot to change that.

There are two immigrants in my family. My brother actually had a hard time getting his wife here. And this guy floats in. I know he was just here for a "visit" but I don't like it.

Anyway, I don't get much interaction on this board and I don't want any to just be negative so I'll stop with this subject right here.

Offline Rayn

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #31 on: September 26, 2007, 09:22:14 pm »
Rayn, I'll have to disagree. I'm listening to KGO Newstalk in San Francisco right now and they are saying that any negative publicity this guy is getting here in the U.S. is actually uniting Iranians in his favor at this point. Eventhough he is considered rather unstable even in Iran. The reputation of the U.S. is rather pathetic around the world. It would take quite a lot to change that.  There are two immigrants in my family. My brother actually had a hard time getting his wife here. And this guy floats in. I know he was just here for a "visit" but I don't like it.  Anyway, I don't get much interaction on this board and I don't want any to just be negative so I'll stop with this subject right here.

Perhaps it's best, as you say, to end it here, unless there is someone else who would like to say something about it, but if it ends here we could end it noting what we have and need to continue in the United States of America and that is, FREEDOM of SPEECH.

The man was invited to the US by Americans to speak

     It would be against the constitution and everything that is truly American if he were silenced because some people didn't like what he was saying and anyone who doesn't like what he's saying can exercise his or her right, as you did Wishes, to turn the TV or Radio to a different channel, there are however, as evidenced by the many who listened to him at Columbia University, many people who want to talk to him and hear what he has to say.  Dialogue, change happens when there is dialogue, a very American activity, isn't it?  

     What I'm also getting at here, Wishes, is that in your one entry about him, you insult the President of Iran and then say how against discrimination and slurs you are!  What's going on with that picture?   You may not agree with him, you may dislike him, you may even think it's an insult to Americans that he was invited to speak in America, but the President of Iran is deserving of respect just as all human beings are deserving of respect.  He is like me and you and everyone else.  He just wants to be happy in his life and be free to speak the truth as he sees it.  As an American, I believe he is entitled to do that and so when I read your slur against him "the so called president of Iran", I felt the need to respond to that.

     And in parting, the negative publicity he's getting is helping his ratings in Iran, you say?  Again, that proves the point I am making.  Insults and mean spirited slurs against the President of Iran while he is a guest in our country will work against the United States and make its reputation even worse than it is.   When a leader is attacked by strangers in an unpopular country, it usually increases the support of his own people for him out of sympathy.  Surely that is something, Wishes, you can understand.

Honest dialogue doesn't have to be filled with insults and negative energy.  It can be respectful even while it is truthful. 
   
« Last Edit: September 27, 2007, 07:08:05 am by Rayn »

Offline Kelda

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #32 on: September 28, 2007, 11:27:57 am »
I don't think Wishes was insulting him or being discriminatory - just stating an opinion - as you both say, its lucky we have a freedom of speech iin our countries. Each day we should be thankful for the lives we have - I often forget how lucky I am and moan about my day. It pales into insignificance compared to others. 
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Offline Rayn

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #33 on: September 28, 2007, 01:36:15 pm »
I don't think Wishes was insulting him or being discriminatory -

  Kelda....  Let's look at language noting that when a person calls the legitimate postion of a president of any nation into question by calling him "the so called president" of Iran, that is an insult, plain and simple.  She might as well have called him "a fake".  That's not an opinion. 

The President of Iran was elected by his own people.  He isn't the "so called president"; he's the duly elected president of Iran.  That Wishes dislikes the man is clear in her insult.

And why not allow Wishes to answer for her own statement?  Perhaps if there were some reflection on language used there might also be some learning about how to write about someone she dislikes in a more respectful manner. 

Learning respect for people we don't like ... hmmmm... now that is something that could help us all! 

Offline Rayn

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Re: Discrimination is a form of Hatred
« Reply #34 on: September 28, 2007, 01:52:33 pm »
I couldn't believe it when he said there were no homosexuals in Iran.

The audience openly laughed in his face for making that ludicrous observation. He deserves to be laughed at for making such a fallaciously vacuous remark.




Of course they laughed, because they reacted instead of giving it some thought first.

He didn't say there were NO Homosexuals in Iran, He said there were no homosexuals in Iran LIKE THERE ARE IN AMERICA....That is what I heard the translator say.   And if that's what he said, then he's right.   Iran is a completely different culture , not like American culture at all. 

There are several ways to understand the man if you can look and hear him from an unbiased point of view.  Also, was anything lost in translation?  Think about it.   

And perhaps ask why we are whipping up so much hatred of this guest that we invited to visit with us and speak to us.


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Offline David In Indy

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Re: Discrimination is a form of Hatred
« Reply #35 on: September 28, 2007, 02:49:12 pm »
  Kelda....  Let's look at language noting that when a person calls the legitimate postion of a president of any nation into question by calling him "the so called president" of Iran, that is an insult, plain and simple.  She might as well have called him "a fake".  That's not an opinion. 

The President of Iran was elected by his own people.  He isn't the "so called president"; he's the duly elected president of Iran.  That Wishes dislikes the man is clear in her insult.

And why not allow Wishes to answer for her own statement?  Perhaps if there were some reflection on language used there might also be some learning about how to write about someone she dislikes in a more respectful manner. 

Learning respect for people we don't like ... hmmmm... now that is something that could help us all! 

I don't think it's quite that cut and dry. He is the elected leader of Iran. However, the candidates are hand picked by the mullahs before an election takes place in Iran. The Iranian people then elect their president from this group of pre-screened, mullah approved candidates. This is like saying to someone they can purchase any make, model and color of car they wish, but all the cars on the lot are blue Ford Tauruses. Not exactly a democratic process, is it? The mullahs are the true leaders in Iran. The Iranian President is basically their puppet, saying and doing exactly what they tell him.

Having said that, the Iranian President IS the visible head of state for Iran, and he should be treated with absolute and total respect when he is in the United States. I was shocked, angry and disappointed by the way he was treated at Columbia University. They invited him into their "house" and then treated him like crap while he was there. I've always believed Americans to be a warm and kind hearted people; at least for the most part. We certainly didn't live up to those qualities last Monday at Columbia University. It disappoints me.
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Offline loneleeb3

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #36 on: September 28, 2007, 04:11:48 pm »
Quote
Having said that, the Iranian President IS the visible head of state for Iran, and he should be treated with absolute and total respect when he is in the United States. I was shocked, angry and disappointed by the way he was treated at Columbia University. They invited him into their "house" and then treated him like crap while he was there. I've always believed Americans to be a warm and kind hearted people; at least for the most part. We certainly didn't live up to those qualities last Monday at Columbia University. It disappoints me.
he is a despot and a dictator He doesn't deserve any respect. I am glad the Prsident of the univerity challanged him.No one has yet. He can spew his propoganda to Diane Sawyer, say what he wants on all the major news channels and no one challenges him at all!
 My Grandfather was part of the allied forces that liberated the concentration camps. He went into Nordhausen.
After the people were liberated he was in charge of documenting the atrocities for the Nuremburg war tribunals.
My Grandfather still has nightmares today. Anyone who denies the holocost, calls for Isreal and the US to be wiped off the map, murders homosexuals and sponsors terrorists does not deserve any respect. respect is somthing that is earned and in my book he hasn't earned any. If Hitler came to speak would you give him your rspect? What about Pol Pot or  Stalin? He is an evil man not worthy ofmy time or respect!
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Offline ifyoucantfixit

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #37 on: September 28, 2007, 04:30:31 pm »




         I would think you should then not attend his meetings.  That would to me be the highest form of disrespect, and at the same time preserving your own respectful way of behaving.



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Offline loneleeb3

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #38 on: September 28, 2007, 04:36:44 pm »



         I would think you should then not attend his meetings.  That would to me be the highest form of disrespect, and at the same time preserving your own respectful way of behaving.
Amen!
I wouldn't. I can't believe they even let him talk.
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Offline David In Indy

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Re: Discrimination
« Reply #39 on: September 28, 2007, 04:55:39 pm »
he is a despot and a dictator He doesn't deserve any respect. I am glad the Prsident of the univerity challanged him.No one has yet. He can spew his propoganda to Diane Sawyer, say what he wants on all the major news channels and no one challenges him at all!
 My Grandfather was part of the allied forces that liberated the concentration camps. He went into Nordhausen.
After the people were liberated he was in charge of documenting the atrocities for the Nuremburg war tribunals.
My Grandfather still has nightmares today. Anyone who denies the holocost, calls for Isreal and the US to be wiped off the map, murders homosexuals and sponsors terrorists does not deserve any respect. respect is somthing that is earned and in my book he hasn't earned any. If Hitler came to speak would you give him your rspect? What about Pol Pot or  Stalin? He is an evil man not worthy ofmy time or respect!

Then why invite him in the first place? What do you think this accomplished? And what do you think he'll do? He'll go back to Iran and inform his people how badly he was treated by the Americans. Remember most Iranians HATE this man, and many are looking for a regime change, much like what is currently happening in Myanmar. Most Iranians are pro West. But I'm scared of what happened at CU last Monday may cause the Iranian people to rally around him rather than against him.

It's important to remember Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is a HEAD OF STATE. If this guy was some Iranian version of Rush Limbaugh, I'd feel different about it. But he's the Iranian President. And whether or not the man actually deserves it, he is the president of a nation, and this alone demands our respect.

Lee, I totally agree with you. The man is a dictator, a terrorist, a liar and a madman. He'd love to kill me. If I traveled to Iran, I'd probably be executed, and he'd rejoice about it. He's a horrible person. But I just feel that since he IS a head of state, we should treat him with the same respect we would show any other visiting dignitary such as Gordon Brown, Queen Elizabeth, Queen Beatrix, Nicolas Sarközy, etc...





         I would think you should then not attend his meetings.  That would to me be the highest form of disrespect, and at the same time preserving your own respectful way of behaving.

I agree Janice. That would be the ULTIMATE slap in the face! If Columbia University wanted to express their hatred for this man, an empty auditorium would certainly do it!


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