Author Topic: Atheists: Come out, come out, wherever you are  (Read 69085 times)

Offline serious crayons

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Re: Atheists: Come out, come out, wherever you are
« Reply #170 on: September 21, 2010, 12:44:39 pm »
The contradictions and limitations that fundamentalists grapple with as articles of faith are caused entirely by their view that God is some sort of super-guy, and supernatural, and in actual fact there IS nothing outside of nature.  God is the sum total of all nature.

OK, but then how does this belief differ from atheism? Atheists don't deny the existence of nature. They deny the existence of a supernatural consciousness who created/controls the universe. Remove that supernatural being from the equation, and it seems to me you're pretty much left with atheism.

Or am I missing something?




Offline louisev

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Re: Atheists: Come out, come out, wherever you are
« Reply #171 on: September 21, 2010, 12:53:32 pm »
OK, but then how does this belief differ from atheism? Atheists don't deny the existence of nature. They deny the existence of a supernatural consciousness who created/controls the universe. Remove that supernatural being from the equation, and it seems to me you're pretty much left with atheism.

Or am I missing something?

Two huge differences between pantheism and atheism

a) Pantheists believe that the universe is ordered, orderly, and also conscious, and therefore we are evolving spiritually as part of that all-conscious beingness that is known as God.  The consensus among atheists is that the universe is accidental or random, and that natural laws occur outside of any controlling force

b) Atheists  deny that we have a spiritual nature; because along with the pantheistic view of God as immanent is another belief that the human soul is immortal - therefore most pantheists believe also in reincarnation.  Atheists do not believe in a human spiritual nature or "essence"  - the most famous statement of atheistic philosophy being "existence precedes essence"  or Rand's objectivist claim " existence is."   

So there are two huge differences between atheism and pantheism.
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Offline serious crayons

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Re: Atheists: Come out, come out, wherever you are
« Reply #172 on: September 21, 2010, 01:46:17 pm »
So there are two huge differences between atheism and pantheism.

Thanks for clarifying!  :)


Marge_Innavera

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Re: Atheists: Come out, come out, wherever you are
« Reply #173 on: September 28, 2010, 10:40:09 am »
Two huge differences between pantheism and atheism

a) Pantheists believe that the universe is ordered, orderly, and also conscious, and therefore we are evolving spiritually as part of that all-conscious beingness that is known as God.  The consensus among atheists is that the universe is accidental or random, and that natural laws occur outside of any controlling force

b) Atheists  deny that we have a spiritual nature; because along with the pantheistic view of God as immanent is another belief that the human soul is immortal - therefore most pantheists believe also in reincarnation.  Atheists do not believe in a human spiritual nature or "essence"  - the most famous statement of atheistic philosophy being "existence precedes essence"  or Rand's objectivist claim " existence is."   

So there are two huge differences between atheism and pantheism.

Pantheism is a first cousin to panentheism, which also believes in a non-theistic Deity:


Reality exists.

We, you and I, exist within reality.

Reality had a beginning.

The beginning was initiated by a creative force.

Reality exists within the force that created reality.

Reality coexists with its creative force for a reason.
Reality depends on its creative force for continuation.

The creative force depends upon the reality it created as a place to travel, to learn, to create, to expand upon its omnipotence, omnipresence, and omniscience.

The creative force travels reality in many forms, one of which is within you as the soul.

You are a piece of God and deserve, must demand, to be treated with the appropriate respect as you travel reality, life.

Everyone is a piece of God and deserves, must demand, to be treated with the appropriate respect as they travel reality.

You must treat everyone with the appropriate respect as they travel reality for they are a piece of God.

You must demand everyone around you be treated with appro-priate respect as they travel reality.

You will return from whence you came carrying with you the results of your travels.

You will experience for eternity the pleasant warmth or painful fire of the knowledge and worse yet, the full empathy, of the direct and indirect results of your travels through reality or what is called the ripple effect of your life.

Lots more about panentheism via Google, but that's a pretty good list of principles.