Why are the poor, poor?

[serious crayons]

It would be interesting if giving to churches could be parsed out of this. Certainly money given to churches counts as charitable giving for tax purposes. This is not to deny that churches do charitable work--my own runs a sort of drop-in center for people affected by AIDS and H.I.V.--individually and collectively as part of a denomination, but it's also true that money given to churches goes for lots of things that aren't "charity," like upkeep of the church building, utilities, and clergy salaries, just to name three examples. I can't help but wonder what the figures would look like if it were possible first of all to parse out the church giving altogether, and then to parse out what part of the church giving goes to overhead.

Yes, somewhere I read that more charitable donations go to churches than anything else.

Some would argue that the money that goes to keeping up the church, paying the clergy, etc., directly benefits the poor and infirm and needy just as much as church-sponsored charitable programs, in that the church provides spiritual comfort and healing. That is, the food shelf feeds bodies, and the church feeds souls.

[Artiste]

That is wonderful injest !

All that sharing are great gifts of humanity !

Au revoir,
hugs!  HAPPY NOTHER'S DAY !!

[Jeff Wrangler]

Some would argue that the money that goes to keeping up the church, paying the clergy, etc., directly benefits the poor and infirm and needy just as much as church-sponsored charitable programs, in that the church provides spiritual comfort and healing. That is, the food shelf feeds bodies, and the church feeds souls.

Yes, some would, and with the exception of one individual I know over at DCF, they would probably be Republicans. The trouble with that reasoning is that the poor and needy aren't filling the pews on Sundays in the churches getting in the big bucks. You don't see the poor and needy in those football stadium-sized megachurches that have more money than God. The poor and needy are either in Victorian Gothic buildings in inner cities that are often literally falling down because there is no money to keep up these buildings any more, or they might be in store front-type churches where, like as not, the pastor supports himself with a full-time job (like St. Paul himself) in addition to his church responsibilities.

There are always exceptions, of course. Trinity U.C.C. in Chicago might be one of them. 

[Jeff Wrangler]

Actually that is the term that Rush Limbaugh listeners call themselves (like fans of Star Trek call themselves "Trekkie")

That's where Dittohead comes from?      

Learn somethin' new every day. ... 

[optom3]

I have only been in the States for 2 years. But one thing that blew me away was the generosity of the poor.
We have a supermarket in an extremely poor area, lots of food stamps and people really struggling to make a living.
It never ceases to amaze me when if they are a little short at the register,someone else in the queue will make up the shortfall or one of the cashiers will.
When it is another customer we always give them an item free to thank them for their kindness, the cashiers will never take anything.
 In terms of amounts it is not very much,as said we are really talking about exceptionally poor people here.In terms of the number of times it happens,too numerous to count,but on a daily basis.
Things like that do renew your faith in mankind.

[serious crayons]

That's really interesting, Fiona.

I was wondering earlier what reasons might explain why the rich and poor give the most and the middle-class gives the least. The best I could come up with is that the rich have the money to spare (duh), and the poor constantly see firsthand what it's like to be in need.

People in the middle-class, in contrast, are removed from poverty and so it's more of an abstraction to them. Many of them probably reason that the poor are poor because of their own actions or lack thereof. And meanwhile, many middle-class people feel enough financial insecurity themselves -- desperate to climb higher on the ladder or even just to cling to the rung they're on in an uncertain economy -- that they don't feel they can spare the money.

[Jeff Wrangler]

I was wondering earlier what reasons might explain why the rich and poor give the most and the middle-class gives the least. The best I could come up with is that the rich have the money to spare (duh), and the poor constantly see firsthand what it's like to be in need.

People in the middle-class, in contrast, are removed from poverty and so it's more of an abstraction to them. Many of them probably reason that the poor are poor because of their own actions or lack thereof. And meanwhile, many middle-class people feel enough financial insecurity themselves -- desperate to climb higher on the ladder or even just to cling to the rung they're on in an uncertain economy -- that they don't feel they can spare the money.

I think this is important, especially in times like the current financial unease.

[Kelda]

thought this was interesting...

 Mentally ill 'go without food'

Almost three-quarters of people with mental health problems run out of money at the end of each week, a study says.

The charity Mind said its poll of 1,800 people showed half had gone without food because of money worries.

And virtually all those questioned - 91% - said debt had made their health problems worse.

Mind called on banks and other creditors not to hound those with mental health problems and to find ways to help them.

People with mental health problems are three times more likely to be in debt than the general population.

Two-thirds of those surveyed by Mind had felt unable to tell creditors about any mental health problems.

But of the remainder who did, 83% had been harassed about debt repayments despite the organisation knowing of their issues.

Mind says the issue is particularly pertinent as all kinds of households face rising fuel and food prices.

'Astronomical interest rates'

Half of people in the survey had been contacted by bailiffs, some of whom issued threats saying they could "break in and take my stuff " or "get me sent to prison".

   Bank staff are not health practitioners and cannot diagnose mental health problems
British Bankers' Association spokeswoman

Paul Farmer, chief executive of Mind, said: "People living with mental health problems are particularly vulnerable to being trapped in a cycle of debt and poverty.

"With many unable to work due to ill health, Mind has found that people are becoming dependent on credit to pay for everyday essentials.

"Those on lower incomes are also more likely to only be able to get credit from lenders who charge astronomical interest rates.

"This is a worrying trend as people are left facing a debt mountain that they have no means to repay."

The charity is launching a section on its website to help people with financial problems.

'More sympathetic'

Mr Farmer called on banks and other creditors to help people with mental health problems who are struggling.

"Changes in practice - such as waiving fees when a customer has been too unwell to manage their finances and introducing mental health awareness training for bank staff - will make all the difference.

"Creditors have a duty to help not hound their customers, especially when they are coping with serious health problems."

But a spokeswoman for the British Bankers' Association said help was available.

"Banks will have staff who are specifically able to help with mental health issues, and we try to help people before they get into really difficult situations.

"However, bank staff are not health practitioners and cannot diagnose mental health problems or assess the likely impact these problems may cause their customers."

She added: "Customers who no longer have the ability to look after their own affairs have their banking needs looked after for them, but less serious health issues can be a silent problem - unless the customer wishes to let their bank know.

"Then the bank can flag accounts and will be able to factor this into any debt help required."

Susan Kramer, Liberal Democrat families spokeswoman, said: "Mental health problems can make the challenge of handling money and debt far harder.

"For others, the depressing realities of living with debt can lead to a downward spiral into hopelessness and despair.

"Financial organisations must train staff to support clients with mental health issues, and mental health workers need training to advise on issues of debt."

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/health/7391744.stm

Published: 2008/05/11 23:06:21 GMT

© BBC MMVIII

[Jeff Wrangler]

Let's not forget, the wealthy can use the tax deductions from their gifts.  Not that this is the reason they give, but a side benefit that definitely works as an incentive.

It sure does act as an incentive.

A little story: Many years ago, early in the AIDS epidemic, a local church founded a program, sort of like Meals on Wheels, to provide nourishing meals to people living with AIDS/H.I.V. Often they would stand outside our local bars on a Saturday night to ask for donations. I always put in a couple of bucks. A friend of mine, now deceased, would never contribute so much as the price of one drink because he couldn't get a receipt for his taxes. I used to get so mad at him.  Embarrassed the hell out of me when I was with him and would do that.

[serious crayons]

I wonder if there isn't a bit of racism involved with the giving to their churches that the wealthy do....they know they can control who gets the charity and prevent certain people or groups from getting it.

That may be the case occasionally, but I'd give them the benefit of the doubt and say race isn't a big factor in their decision. I don't think of wealthy people as any more racist, on average, than people in other income groups.