Author Topic: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!  (Read 20775 times)

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2008, 09:35:33 pm »
Thanks broketrash.  Yep, there are certainly hosts of significant Brokie dates and dates surrounding the production of the film, publication of the story, etc. that are very important to note.

In this case, the dilemma is figuring out the dates and chronology (as precisely as possible) within the narrative of Brokeback Mountain (using all the tools that we have, including story, screenplay and film clues... including visual clues in the film).  There are inconsistencies and odd things that come up in the time line of the story as it progresses... and we can try to untangle all of that as we move through the story.

For now, the question is 1963... and figuring out the dates of key events. 

To re-cap... Here's what we seem to know so far...

April 10, 1963 - Thresher sinks
June 5, 1963- Jack and Ennis meet at Aguirre's trailer
June 7, 1963 (full moon)- Jack and Ennis's first night on Brokeback
July 6-7, 1963 (full moon)- TS1
August 13, 1963- first snow/ Ennis wakes up in the snow


Two of the most interesting questions at the moment seem to be how to figure out TS2 and the happy tussle.  Is there anyway to resolve these questions?

About the question of TS1 and the full moon... beyond the visual representation of what appears to be the full moon being revealed from behind moving clowds...  the screenplay also says, "the moon is full up, notched past two in the morning". 

It really is interesting to think about how many of the really significant moments seem to cluster around the beginnings of months and the particular sequence of dates, 4,5,6,7 lining up as important both in the '63 summer and later down the line in the story.




the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #21 on: June 05, 2008, 01:22:15 pm »


Bump 8)

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline southendmd

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #22 on: June 05, 2008, 01:59:53 pm »
Happy June 5th, Brokies!

Jack-and-Ennis Meet Day!

With great thanks to JudgeHolden.

(Something was nagging at me this morning, but I couldn't think what it was.  Was it someone's birthday?  No.  Now I know...)


Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #23 on: June 05, 2008, 02:30:05 pm »
Happy June 5th, Brokies!

Jack-and-Ennis Meet Day!

With great thanks to JudgeHolden.

(Something was nagging at me this morning, but I couldn't think what it was.  Was it someone's birthday?  No.  Now I know...)




Yeehaw Paul!! :) :)

That's such a great picture.

And, the whole topic of June 5th is amazing indicating the tremendous bookend pair of this trailer scene with Ennis, Jack and Aguirre (and the negated "wedding ceremony" with Aguirre's "no, no, no") and the final trailer scene with Junior and the discussion of her wedding.

It's such a great explanation of the chosen date of her wedding, June 5th.


« Last Edit: June 05, 2008, 07:14:31 pm by atz75 »
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Shakesthecoffecan

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #24 on: June 05, 2008, 02:38:27 pm »

It's such a great explanation of the chosen date of her wedding, June 5th.




That is amazing, sent a shudder down me spine!
"It was only you in my life, and it will always be only you, Jack, I swear."

Offline optom3

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #25 on: June 05, 2008, 06:27:06 pm »
That is amazing, sent a shudder down me spine!

I love the fact that we clebrating June 5th, canwe celebrate July 6/7 s well. In fact we could do the whole July 4th thing then without a pause continue on through July 5th hangover and onto July 6/7.

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #26 on: June 05, 2008, 07:30:09 pm »
JudgeHolden (earlier in this thread) really deserves the credit for figuring out the possible implication of the date June 5.

Yes, the whole sequence of days with the numbers 4, 5, 6, 7 seems significant... June 5 (day J& E meet/ Junior's wedding), 6 (preparing to go up the mountain '63), 7 (first night on Brokeback) and then July 4 (fireworks scene), July 6-7 (the night of TS1 in '63).


I think the determination that Junior's wedding day be explicitly stated as June 5 has always caused some confusion until this possible connection with the meeting between J & E was suggested.  This is because June 5, 1984 would have been a Tuesday and an odd day to pick for a wedding.  I think the explanation of that particular day being especially significant for J & E is a very strong and compelling idea.

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Shakesthecoffecan

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #27 on: June 05, 2008, 08:25:50 pm »
JudgeHolden (earlier in this thread) really deserves the credit for figuring out the possible implication of the date June 5.

Yes, the whole sequence of days with the numbers 4, 5, 6, 7 seems significant... June 5 (day J& E meet/ Junior's wedding), 6 (preparing to go up the mountain '63), 7 (first night on Brokeback) and then July 4 (fireworks scene), July 6-7 (the night of TS1 in '63).


I think the determination that Junior's wedding day be explicitly stated as June 5 has always caused some confusion until this possible connection with the meeting between J & E was suggested.  This is because June 5, 1984 would have been a Tuesday and an odd day to pick for a wedding.  I think the explanation of that particular day being especially significant for J & E is a very strong and compelling idea.



So next year will be Alma and Kurt's silver wedding anniversary. They are probably grandparents by now.
"It was only you in my life, and it will always be only you, Jack, I swear."

Offline Ellemeno

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #28 on: June 05, 2008, 09:30:40 pm »
Ennis a great-grandfather.

Offline chowhound

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Re: An Accurate Time Line of BBM - Let's Figure It Out Together!!
« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2008, 05:14:05 pm »
The following is a timeline i posted on another board some while ago. I htought peole might like to take a look at it on this board:

Aha! I think I found it!
________________________________________
Revised timeline for Brokeback Mountain
by chowhound (Sun Nov 18 2007 12:16:52)

This is a  further revision of the timeline I  reposted a few days ago. The main revision is to do with Ennis’s divorce and when the meetings between Jack and  Ennis took place after that divorce. See footnote *2. As before, ss=short story and sp=screen play.

1941 K.E. del Mar born

1943 Jack and Ennis born (Sept.-Dec.)

1952. Ennis and K.E. forced to look at Earl's mutilated body by their father

1957 ? Ennis's parents killed

1963:

May 7 Jack and Ennis meet

May 8 Full moon

May 24 Elk and potato dinner

June 7 TSN1. Full moon

June 8 TSN2

June. Ennis and Jack switch routines

June. Ennis and Jack move the sheep further up the mountains

July. Aguirre spying

July. Hailstorm and sheep tangle

August. Snow. Forced to leave Brokeback. *1.

Nov. Ennis marries Alma Beers

1964:

Jan. Alma pregnant

spring: Ennis employed shovelling asphalt

spring: Ennis and Alma see "Surf Party" (1964)

spring: Jack returns to Brokeback

autumn: Alma jr. born

1965:

winter: Jenny born

1966:

July 4. Alma, Ennis and the two children attend Independence Day celebrations.

August. Jack meets Lureen at rodeo

1967:

Jan. ?Bobby born.

Sept 27 Jack and Ennis re-unite in Riverton

Sept 28-? Wyoming campsite

[1967-83:
"Years on years they worked their way through the high meadows and mountain drainages, horse-packing into the Big Horns, Medicine Bows, south end of the Gallatins, Absarokas, Granites, Owl Creeks, the Bridger-Teton Range, the Freezeouts and the Shirleys, Ferisses and the Rattlesnakes, Salt River Range, into the Wind Rivers over and again, the Sierra Madres, Gros Ventres, the Washakies, Laramies, but never returning to Brokeback." ss. p.17]

1971:

Girls on swing scene

Jack driving tractor scene.

1972:

July Ennis receives postcard from Jack ("See you in a couple of weeks") [postmark: July, 1972.]

July/August Blue parka scene. 14 hour drive for Jack.

July/August Ennis leaves for Big Horn mountains. Almost forgets his tackle box.

July/August Jack and Ennis meet up in the Big Horn Mountains. ["Jack comes out of the tent, the intense pleasure of being with Ennis all over his face." sp. p.58]

August/September Jack with Bobby probably driving one of the "new models" Lureen mentions to Jack before he leaves for the Big Horns.

1973:

Alma: "We could still smarten up, head over to the church social" (sp. p.60).An episode from "Kojack" is playing on the TV.
-

Ennis: "If you don't want no more of my kids, I'll be happy to leave you alone." (sp. p.60)

1975:

Nov. 6 Alma and Ennis divorce. *2.

Nov. Jack drives up to be with Ennis. Rejected.

Nov. Jack goes to Mexico.

Dec. Jack meets up with Ennis? Jack says "see you next month, then..." (sp. p.63) in the "rejection" scene. *2.

1976

April. Jack receives the “divorce” postcard. Drives up to be with Ennis.  Rejected.

April. Jack goes to Mexico.

May. Jack meets up with Ennis? Jack says “see you next month, then…”(sp.p.63) in the “rejection” scene.*2.

1977:

Nov. Thanksgiving weekend. The two Thanksgiving dinners.

1978:

Mountain scene. Jack suggests that Ennis might move to Texas.
-
Ennis meets Cassie.
-
Jack and Lureen have dinner with the Malones. [Banner behind bar reads "Welcome to the 1978 Benefit Dinner, The Childress County Children's Home"]

1979:

Bar scene where Cassie asks Alma Jr. "...your daddy ever gonna see fit to settle down again?" (sp. p.77) [sp. notes that Alma is 15]

1983:

May. Hail Strew River Drainage. Final time together:

(a) Jack: "tell you what...truth is, sometimes I miss you so bad I can hardly stand it." (sp. p.80)
(b) Asleep in tent, Ennis curled around Jack.
(c) The quarrel. Jack: "come here...it's alright, it's all right...damn you Ennis". (sp. p.83)
(d) Flashback to Brokeback, 1963. The Dozy Embrace.
(e) Jack watches Ennis's truck as it drives away.

July. ? Final scene with Cassie

August/Sept. ? Jack dies.*3.

October/early Nov. Ennis phone call to Lureen [Ennis's postcard to Jack had proposed they meet at Pine Creek on Nov 7] *4.

Nov. ?Ennis visits the Twists

1984

spring: Alma Jr. visits Ennis. [Alma is 19]

June 5 Alma presumably marries Kurt.

NOTES:

*1 I prefer these dates with the first full moon we see occurring in May and TSN1 taking place at the next full moon in June. I chose the May date in part because, when Jack and Ennis are first going up the mountain, the foliage has the very light green look of spring (May) rather than the somewhat darker green of full summer (June). It also gives Jack and Ennis a longer time together after TSN2 before they are forced to leave Brokeback. But making everything a month - or full moon - later also works.

*2  One possibility is that what the judge says here is an “interlocutory” decree and not a final decree. The final decree would then have been granted some months later – say, in March or April of the following year. If Ennis sent Jack that postcard shortly after receiving the final decree, then Jack would have probably driven up in April and his reference to their meeting next month would point to May.

Another possibility is that the judge’s pronouncement is final but that Ennis spends some time getting things sorted out before sending Jack that postcard. This again could result in Jack’s driving up in April.

In general, a number of Brokies feel that it is much more likely that the meeting referred to would take place in the spring and not in wintery December. There is some textual support for this. In one of the earlier scripts for Brokeback Mountain, Jack’s line reads: “I’ll see you first week in June, then.”

*3 The exact time of Jack's death is unknown. Jack has presumably gone to Lighning Flat for a few days before heading back to Texas after his May meeting with Ennis which is when he must have said to his father that he would be returning with "another fella" (sp. p.90). OMT then goes on to say "...but like most of Jack's ideas it never come to pass". (sp. p.90). Therefore, I think a fair amount of time must have passed between Jack's offer and his death. If Jack had died shortly after his return to Texas, surely OMT would have put it differently.

*4. I'm assuming here that Ennis's postcard - the one stamped "deceased" - is returned to Ennis before Nov. 7.