The imagined power of BBM ?

[optom3]

In the S.S, when Ennis discovers Jack and his shirts,he smells them,hoping for some scent of Jack and BBM.Apart from the fact that part makes me cry,every time I read it.It goes on to say,there was no real scent of it, "only the memory of it,the imagined power of Brokeback Mountain of which nothing was left but what he held in his hands."

That sentence has always intrigued me,does it mean that for Ennis,there was a brief time,i.e on Brokeback, where even he felt that anything was possible,hence the, imagined power phrase.
Being an incurable romantic I would love to think that.Simply because it then makes me review their time on BBM and feel that they were both truly happy there.
It does however mean that if that is the case,then BBM was the only time of pure 100% undiluted happiness.So the subsequent meetings, were all to some extent tarnished.It also fits in with the dozy embrace scene,where in the S.S Jack remembers it as the only perfect unmarred moment,from which maybe they had never advanced.
If they at least had one perfect moment,then it becomes slightly more bearable,for me anyway.

[sel]

Hi Optom3,

I've always felt that that 'imagined power' was there, and , like you say, where even Ennis felt that anything was possible. But there's another important passage in the S.S. which to me means that Ennis, although later, realises that there had been a time and a place where  they had created such happiness and where they had had  the power to   change the directions of their lives if only he/they had wanted to.

“That summer”, said Ennis, “When we split up after we got paid out I had gut cramps so bad I pulled over and tried to puke, thought I ate somethin bad at that place in Dubois. Took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights. Too late then by long, long a while.”.

But by then he had commitments, a wife and a daughter.

To me that I shouldn't a let you out of my sights , is equal to I love you, and said by Ennis, Ennis who can't bring himself to say much, is simply amazing.
I love the film, but how I wish that part of the dialogue at the Motel  had been included in it.

[Artiste]

Merci optom !!

Ennis and Jack more than one perfect moment, thank goodness !!

[optom3]

Hi Optom3,

I've always felt that that 'imagined power' was there, and , like you say, where even Ennis felt that anything was possible. But there's another important passage in the S.S. which to me means that Ennis, although later, realises that there had been a time and a place where  they had created such happiness and where they had had  the power to   change the directions of their lives if only he/they had wanted to.

“That summer”, said Ennis, “When we split up after we got paid out I had gut cramps so bad I pulled over and tried to puke, thought I ate somethin bad at that place in Dubois. Took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights. Too late then by long, long a while.”.

But by then he had commitments, a wife and a daughter

To me that I shouldn't a let you out of my sights , is equal to I love you, and said by Ennis, Ennis who can't bring himself to say much, is simply amazing.
I love the film, but how I wish that part of the dialogue at the Motel  had been included in it.

Some  of the saddest few words in the S.S "too late then"but it would always have been too late,as Ennis never came to terms with his feelings until too late as well.He knew what he felt,but was too emotionally crippled bychildhood just to go with it.
I sometimes go off into fantasy land,where anything would have been possible while they stayed on BBM, but as son as they left to come down,they descended not only the mountain phsically, they also had to descend or come down from the emotional high they had been on,back to terra firm.

[Artiste]

Back down from their Borkeback Mountain to realism or anti-life, unfortunately, in too many some ways !!

[BlissC]

Some  of the saddest few words in the S.S "too late then"but it would always have been too late,as Ennis never came to terms with his feelings until too late as well.He knew what he felt,but was too emotionally crippled bychildhood just to go with it.

I don't know whether it would always have been too late. There are times in the SS and in the film where I get the sense that very occasionally, just for a split second, that Ennis is on the edge of making a life-changing decision, maybe that he's not even consciously doing, before he pulls back and retreats into the "safe" world of his life in Riverton.

Probably the two that spring to mind are the post-divorce scene when he sends Jack away, and (maybe it's just wishful thinking on my part), but he kind of steps forward at one point as though he's going to say something to Jack before the camera flashes back to Jack and that awful desolate look and he drives away, and then again in the final camping trip when he seems almost at one point by the side of the truck as though he's going to react to Jack with something more than the public "we're-just-fishing-buddies" act he puts on to the world and actually open up and say something meaningful...before again he misses the chance and Jack launches into the "I wish I knew how to quit you" speech. Like I said, possibly wishful thinking on my part, but it seems at times that he's wrestling with himself and sometimes the real Ennis seems only to be a moment away.

But there's another important passage in the S.S. which to me means that Ennis, although later, realises that there had been a time and a place where  they had created such happiness and where they had had  the power to   change the directions of their lives if only he/they had wanted to.

“That summer”, said Ennis, “When we split up after we got paid out I had gut cramps so bad I pulled over and tried to puke, thought I ate somethin bad at that place in Dubois. Took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights. Too late then by long, long a while.”.

But by then he had commitments, a wife and a daughter.

As Sel said though, I think Ennis's realisation that he shouldn't have let Jack go was a chance to change the course of their lives, but of course whether Ennis felt obligated to stick with the life he'd created in Riverton or whether his inaction and the feeling it was too late was a product of his fears and his hang-ups, ultimately he chose not to use that power. The important thing though for me is that Ennis recognised that he made a mistake in letting Jack go, and so early in the story, and for me that suggests that the power of the mountain and the effect it had on both of them wasn't imagined.

In the S.S, when Ennis discovers Jack and his shirts,he smells them,hoping for some scent of Jack and BBM.Apart from the fact that part makes me cry,every time I read it.It goes on to say,there was no real scent of it, "only the memory of it,the imagined power of Brokeback Mountain of which nothing was left but what he held in his hands."

That sentence has always intrigued me,does it mean that for Ennis,there was a brief time,i.e on Brokeback, where even he felt that anything was possible,hence the, imagined power phrase.
Being an incurable romantic I would love to think that.Simply because it then makes me review their time on BBM and feel that they were both truly happy there.
It does however mean that if that is the case,then BBM was the only time of pure 100% undiluted happiness.So the subsequent meetings, were all to some extent tarnished.It also fits in with the dozy embrace scene,where in the S.S Jack remembers it as the only perfect unmarred moment,from which maybe they had never advanced.
If they at least had one perfect moment,then it becomes slightly more bearable,for me anyway.

For me, that "imagined" in that sentence is an odd word, because as AP always said, the choice of every word in the SS is vital, but to me, the power of Brokeback Mountain isn't imagined, because it's that memory of their time on the mountain and the perfection they had there that in a large part carries them through the 20 years. I guess you could explain it by the feeling that he imagined on the mountain that everything was possible. If you take the phrase at face value though, the only imagined part is the scent of the shirts, but there's also something about that phrase and the wording, "the imagined power of Brokeback Mountain of which nothing was left but what he held in his hands", that to me suggests that with Jack gone, the shirts are the only physical proof of the time on the mountain, and after the pain and unfairness of it all Ennis seems almost to be doubting that it really happened, almost in a dream-like state (which I guess fits in with the 'panels of the dream' idea) - maybe that's where the "imagined" comes in?

[Artiste]

At least, Ennis and Jack's love as a couple of men, was concrete and real up on Brokeback Mountain !!

Does that mean that gay coupling or individual gay life, can ONLY be imagined ? ?

[Artiste]

There, on that like-magic mountain, they could be lovers, like it was hanging out, to use the current expression, without not having too much harm be done to them because of their love !!

Is that so to-day too ??

[optom3]

I don't know whether it would always have been too late. There are times in the SS and in the film where I get the sense that very occasionally, just for a split second, that Ennis is on the edge of making a life-changing decision, maybe that he's not even consciously doing, before he pulls back and retreats into the "safe" world of his life in Riverton.

Probably the two that spring to mind are the post-divorce scene when he sends Jack away, and (maybe it's just wishful thinking on my part), but he kind of steps forward at one point as though he's going to say something to Jack before the camera flashes back to Jack and that awful desolate look and he drives away, and then again in the final camping trip when he seems almost at one point by the side of the truck as though he's going to react to Jack with something more than the public "we're-just-fishing-buddies" act he puts on to the world and actually open up and say something meaningful...before again he misses the chance and Jack launches into the "I wish I knew how to quit you" speech. Like I said, possibly wishful thinking on my part, but it seems at times that he's wrestling with himself and sometimes the real Ennis seems only to be a moment away.

As Sel said though, I think Ennis's realisation that he shouldn't have let Jack go was a chance to change the course of their lives, but of course whether Ennis felt obligated to stick with the life he'd created in Riverton or whether his inaction and the feeling it was too late was a product of his fears and his hang-ups, ultimately he chose not to use that power. The important thing though for me is that Ennis recognised that he made a mistake in letting Jack go, and so early in the story, and for me that suggests that the power of the mountain and the effect it had on both of them wasn't imagined.
 

For me, that "imagined" in that sentence is an odd word, because as AP always said, the choice of every word in the SS is vital, but to me, the power of Brokeback Mountain isn't imagined, because it's that memory of their time on the mountain and the perfection they had there that in a large part carries them through the 20 years. I guess you could explain it by the feeling that he imagined on the mountain that everything was possible. If you take the phrase at face value though, the only imagined part is the scent of the shirts, but there's also something about that phrase and the wording, "the imagined power of Brokeback Mountain of which nothing was left but what he held in his hands", that to me suggests that with Jack gone, the shirts are the only physical proof of the time on the mountain, and after the pain and unfairness of it all Ennis seems almost to be doubting that it really happened, almost in a dream-like state (which I guess fits in with the 'panels of the dream' idea) - maybe that's where the "imagined" comes in?

I cannot quite put my finger on it yet,there is definitely something about the "imagined power" that I feel is eluding me.Did Ennis really commit himself on BBM, more than we realise,which is why he was physically sick once down again.I keep thinking that maybe for a split second on BBM Ennis actually believed they could have it all.Now as he looks back, he wonders if it was all a dream and what he thought was the magic of BBM was just imagination,almost like looking back at something with rose coloured specs on.
I am not sure.I will have to go and think about it again.It drives me nuts when I feel I am just grappling with somethng and not quite comming to grips with it.

[sel]

The important thing though for me is that Ennis recognised that he made a mistake in letting Jack go, and so early in the story, and for me that suggests that the power of the mountain and the effect it had on both of them wasn't imagined.
 

That's exactly how I feel.