Author Topic: Importance of the Jimbo Scene  (Read 48190 times)

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2008, 09:35:52 pm »
Maybe its just an explanation showing, that he was not having much luck with the boys, and why he finally ended up with a woman.

He had probably taken the Jimbo thing as how it was always gonna be, if he wanted a man.....it was all too hard..(excuse the pun)....so when Laureen started flirting, and it was so much easier, he fell into it.

Two such different nights....one of rejection and almost humiiliation with Jimbo.......the next night, handed to him on a platter.

As he danced with Laureen, and the song was playing "No ones gonna love you like me".....Jack was daydreaming about someone else, another time, another place, but realized that in the real world, this is what was expected and this was how it was gonna have to be.....


Yes, that's what I mean about part of the significance of the Jimbo scene... illustrating how hard it can be to find a same-sex partner outside of the context of any kind of real gay community.  Even someone as charming and attractive as Jack was finding it both frustrating and threatening to make the kind of advances necessary to seek out a partner in his rural/ rodeo community. 

I think the scene with Lureen does illustrate how relatively easy it was to find a partner in a heterosexual context.  He could directly ask the bartender for advice about the woman of interest, he could dance in public with her and their flirty banter didn't need to be coded or clandestine.

Also, part of the reason there's such a point made with the bartender about the wealth of Lureen's family seems to be suggesting that Jack really was calculating a level of financial comfort for himself there.  I think he was truly weighing the idea of at least the notion of material comfort if he knew he wouldn't be happy with the partner involved.

Anne Hathaway described her interpretation of the Jack/Lureen relationship as a "marriage of convenience" and I think it was just that right from this very first moment when Jack is thinking things over prior to her advances.  I think L.D. is hostile towards Jack for many reasons, and one of them surely is that he probably perceived Jack to be a gold-digger.

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2008, 09:37:40 pm »
Great thread subject Atz !

To me, that scene is many things !

Jimbo represents maybe danger, which is unwanted by Jack!!

Isn't Jimbo dangerous ?

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2008, 09:47:14 pm »

No, I don't think Jimbo is dangerous. 

Sometimes I even wonder if Jack was right about Jimbo.  Jack very well may have known more about Jimbo to encourage him to approach him at the bar.  And, there's a moment when Jack and Jimbo lock eyes for a second where there's something interesting in Jimbo's eyes.  It seems possible that Jimbo rejects Jack because the bartender is hovering so close and watching so close.  And, he may have also been nervous because there were so many other people around (again my point about how hard it can be to find and connect with a partner as a single gay person).

Jimbo may genuinely have been rejecting Jack because he was straight... but he may also have just been another scared gay man.

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2008, 10:01:07 pm »
Atz, may I disagree!

Jimbo is obviously straight and dangerous since he tells the others that Jack is gay ?

That is the way I see it: danger !

Au revoir,
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Offline Katie77

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2008, 10:01:51 pm »
No, I don't think Jimbo is dangerous. 

Sometimes I even wonder if Jack was right about Jimbo.  Jack very well may have known more about Jimbo to encourage him to approach him at the bar.  And, there's a moment when Jack and Jimbo lock eyes for a second where there's something interesting in Jimbo's eyes.  It seems possible that Jimbo rejects Jack because the bartender is hovering so close and watching so close.  And, he may have also been nervous because there were so many other people around (again my point about how hard it can be to find and connect with a partner as a single gay person).

Jimbo may genuinely have been rejecting Jack because he was straight... but he may also have just been another scared gay man.



I think you hit the nail on the head there Atz..........surely back then there would be some talk or curiosity about some of the men at those rodeos, and if Jack had heard something about Jimbo, he thought he would try to chat him up, but Jimbo certainly did not want to take up with Jack in front of all his pool playin mates.

When Jimbo says...."if I took a drink of every cowboy who wanted to buy me a drink....."...was he maybe telling Jack, that others have hit on him before with no luck......

Being happy doesn't mean everything is perfect.

It means you've decided to see beyond the imperfection

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #15 on: August 19, 2008, 10:05:35 pm »
May I add that you gals are not gay men!

I am a gay man and find that Jimbo is making an afront... by talking to the others there; and, is therefore sending out dangerous talk about Jack !!

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Offline optom3

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2008, 10:04:04 am »
No, I don't think Jimbo is dangerous. 

Sometimes I even wonder if Jack was right about Jimbo.  Jack very well may have known more about Jimbo to encourage him to approach him at the bar.  And, there's a moment when Jack and Jimbo lock eyes for a second where there's something interesting in Jimbo's eyes.  It seems possible that Jimbo rejects Jack because the bartender is hovering so close and watching so close.  And, he may have also been nervous because there were so many other people around (again my point about how hard it can be to find and connect with a partner as a single gay person).

Jimbo may genuinely have been rejecting Jack because he was straight... but he may also have just been another scared gay man.



That is exactly what I have always thought.Jack picked the right man, but in completely the wrong circumstances.To try and pick up a man in a bar full of macho type men
right under the eye of a very suspicious barman, was reckless.But then Jack's character is reckless.

I suspect to cover his own tracks/sexuality, Jimbo goes back to the men and is undoubtedly less than pleasant about Jack, to allay any suspicion, we already know it was a very hard time and place to be gay.

I assume that a lot of men were like Ennis terrified of the consequences, Proulx herself said that the idea 1st came to her by seeing a man in a bar, totally on his own.

I sense no danger, just the humiliation of Jack, by Jimbo to cover himself. Jack  subjects himself to humiliation on many an occassion by going to Mexico and paying for sex.
That too is a big difference between him and Ennis, Jack seems to have a much higher libido, but after the reunion scene, I think for Jack the sex with other men is just that.He can separate sex from love, in the way a lot of men, gay or straight can.

I often find myself wondering, had they got together permanantly, would Jack have remained sexually faithful. He seems character wise, to need the extra edge.
Jack's gaydar for want of a better word seems prety accurate, he sees what lies beneath with Ennis and even with Randal. I see no reason why a gay man should be any less astute than a straight man or woman. Most people know from subtle gestures etc, when soemone is interested in them.
So probably right call, but foolhardy place to attempt it.
If Jack can spot the sexuality, in someone as closed as Ennis, I suspect he can spot a less closed gay man at 50 paces.But as always with Jack, there is that need to be reckless.

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2008, 10:09:51 am »
Merci optom !

Since you finish with Jack as being reckless by asking Jimbo, isn't Jimbo more reckless by talking to the others about what Jack was after ?

Jimbo, surely puts Jack in danger ?

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Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2008, 10:19:34 am »
Thanks for the great post Fiona. :)

I do think that Jack had really good gaydar (demonstrated at least twice with Ennis and Randall).  So, I think it remains an open question what he knew or perceived about Jimbo.

If Jack and Ennis had gotten together on a permanent basis, I do think Jack would have been capable of being faithful.  I think his wanderings (Mexico and Randall) that we see later in his relationship with Ennis were purely out of desparation.  And, I get the sense that those experiences were making Jack quite bitter... on top of his frustrations about Ennis.  My sense is that Jack was such a romantic about Ennis that a permanent relationship with him would have been very satisfying for Jack.  I think his affair with Randall and obviously the encounter(s) with prostitutes were purely to scratch a physical itch.  I don't think he would have probably had to worry about that issue if he was actually living with Ennis.


I agree that the original idea that Proulx had for BBM - the old man alone in the bar - might have really interesting relevance to all the bar scenes we see in the film.


And, as for the Jimbo scene and "danger"... I think we may be encouraged to wonder and worry a little bit about what the people around the pool table are saying.  I think we are supposed to not really know if they're a threat or not.  They don't really do anything other than glance Jack's way... and depending on one's point of view that can be seen as threatening or just idle curiosity on their part.  This movie is so much about ambiguous perception.  I'm sure someone of Ennis's mindset would immediately perceive a threat, while others wouldn't be so inclined to worry.

We don't know what Jimbo said to the people at the pool table.  It could have been something very innocent.

May I add that you gals are not gay men!

I am a gay man and find that Jimbo is making an afront... by talking to the others there; and, is therefore sending out dangerous talk about Jack !!

Artiste, I am a gay woman.  

That's one of the reasons I started this thread... because I understand a bit of the difficulty that Jack encounters in locating a partner when he wants one in the context of his everyday life and in the context of the opportunities that exist for him.  To me the most interesting thing about the Jimbo scene, is that this is one moment where we see him in a social context while he's essentially a single gay man.  This scene seems to acknowledge a sometimes difficult aspect of gay life that Jack and Ennis don't experience in the context of their relationship.  They have no trouble finding one another intitially.  While the basic issue of finding a partner can be so difficult in other contexts.


And, as for the issue of recklessness... I would call it more a fearlessness. 

Jack's a bull rider.  That means he's willing to put his life in danger to do what he loves.  To be a bull rider you need to know you could be killed everytime you get on the back of a bull... and still be enthusiastic about doing it anyway.




the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Artiste

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Re: Importance of the Jimbo Scene
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2008, 10:34:27 am »
Merci atz!

Your post is well versed now and also appreciated !!

You say:
         Artiste, I am a gay woman. 

         

.........

Atz: yes, I know and I am glad that you are a gay woman!

And may I ask: Doesn't the gay women cruise differently from straight women?

And find that maybe a gay woman having cruised a straight woman, that that could be dangerous ?
.........

Atz, and may I add: I am a gay man, and wish to cruise again as I did in the past, but I now know that if I happen to cruise a straight man, that that could be indeed dangerous !! I have seen straight with knives !!

Jimbo here is, to me, obviously, a straight man or a con artist ?? A straight man would not talk to other men, about being cruised by a gay guy ? - Not unless, that straight man is bad, I say!

Au revoir,
hugs!