Ashamed of being straight?

[dmmb_Mandy]

I understand, David. People love to fit individuals into convenient categories. It's unfortunate, really. In high school, my own friends mocked me and my *slight* obsession for Angelina Jolie. They ignored the fact that I had a boyfriend whom I adored and were fixated on the big Angelina poster on my wall, and I was thus a "dyke". Hell, I question myself and my sexuality from time to time but that doesn't give anyone the right to tell me what or who I am. David, you certainly don't need to fit any societal male ideal, just be yourself; be whatever-the-fuck you want. 

[opinionista]

I have a little bit different take on this topic - or maybe I'm going totally off topic.  

I'd never thought anyone would consider me gay cause I am not.  I think people may be wondering now because of my obsession w/ Brokeback Mtn & my recent trip to SF to meet everyone.  That matters not at all to me.

But, being straight in a mindset that is not typical of your sex is a different thing.  When I was a very little girl, I wanted to be a cowBOY (got pictures to prove it).  If I was dressed in a dress, I put pants on under it.  I have ALWAYS wanted to be with the boys playing - not the girls.  I thought girls were boring & boys got to do all the great, exciting things in life like tramping through the woods & catching snakes (which scare me now.  I did love playing w/ dolls tho')  In band, I played trumpet (1st chair).

My career choice was a decidedly male occupation, one that women were just breaking into & carried a lot of controversy with it.  Consequently I was primarily around men and loved it - felt perfectly at home & comfortable with them.  (I had been a typist/secretary for a short period of time & simply did not/could not bond with any of the women.  In fact I have not bonded with women in general).

I LOVE men.  I'd still rather be with men at any given time.  I love everything about them.  Their faces, their bodies, their way of bonding, the way I never feel there is some underlying fakeness to them.  The latter implies I think women are fake.  This is my problem.   I remember always thinking that women were not being true to themselves when they spoke - probably because my opinions, interests, etc were so different.  Now I think it is simply me.

I love sports, I hate talking about babies.  I wanted to play the drums.  I never wear a dress unless it is formal (and then I love dressing up!)  I love make-up & loved (awhile back) being slim, sexy & attracting men.

I have never felt I was "in the wrong body."  I am completely comfortable as a female.  I have been physically attracted to the beauty of some women but never sexually attracted to a woman.  And very, very rarely emotionally.

SO, where the hell do I fit?  Like you said David, so many shades...

EDIT - Should have said, I love WATCHING sports - must be because I get to look at men!  Actually, I enjoy the sport but do watch only men playing... HMMMMMMM.

I think that makes you tomboy not a lesbian. I have two lesbian friends that are very very femenine. And they're always pestering me because I hate wearing lipstick.

My sister is exactly like you. She hates talking about babies, pink stuff, wearing make up or dresses. As a kid she used to get into fist fight with other boys and sometimes beat the shit out of them. Her career choice is also male occupation. She's not gay.

I'm more femenine than she is but like you when I was a kid I thought girls were boring and  boys got to do all the great, exciting things. But I also loved playing with dolls, and had huge fights with my brother because he used to destroy them all!

[delalluvia]

I have a little bit different take on this topic - or maybe I'm going totally off topic. 

I'd never thought anyone would consider me gay cause I am not.  I think people may be wondering now because of my obsession w/ Brokeback Mtn & my recent trip to SF to meet everyone.  That matters not at all to me.

But, being straight in a mindset that is not typical of your sex is a different thing.  When I was a very little girl, I wanted to be a cowBOY (got pictures to prove it).  If I was dressed in a dress, I put pants on under it.  I have ALWAYS wanted to be with the boys playing - not the girls.  I thought girls were boring & boys got to do all the great, exciting things in life like tramping through the woods & catching snakes (which scare me now.  I did love playing w/ dolls tho')  In band, I played trumpet (1st chair).

My career choice was a decidedly male occupation, one that women were just breaking into & carried a lot of controversy with it.  Consequently I was primarily around men and loved it - felt perfectly at home & comfortable with them.  (I had been a typist/secretary for a short period of time & simply did not/could not bond with any of the women.  In fact I have not bonded with women in general).

I LOVE men.  I'd still rather be with men at any given time.  I love everything about them.  Their faces, their bodies, their way of bonding, the way I never feel there is some underlying fakeness to them.  The latter implies I think women are fake.  This is my problem.   I remember always thinking that women were not being true to themselves when they spoke - probably because my opinions, interests, etc were so different.  Now I think it is simply me.

I love sports, I hate talking about babies.  I wanted to play the drums.  I never wear a dress unless it is formal (and then I love dressing up!)  I love make-up & loved (awhile back) being slim, sexy & attracting men.

I'm with you silk.  I was raised with a male cousin and got to love doing 'guy' things as a child.  Never liked playing with dolls, when I was a child I wanted to be a cowboy, then an astronaut.  I always liked being around guys because they were allowed to do all the fun things that girls were not.

I played flute in band only because my first choice - French horn - was vetoed by my parents as needing a 'big' - meaning guy - person to play it.  Turns out that flute players use more 'air' than any players.

I graduated college in a 'traditionally' male field and never really bonded with any of the femalies at my place of employment as I was not interested much in marriage or children.  I drive a 4X4 that I can work on myself, do home repairs, etc.

I do have some female friends but we keep each other at arms length, as I'm not willing to always be 'understanding'.  My girlfriends have come to me for comfort and reassurance and eventually get offended when I suggest resolutions to their problems and finally lose patience with them.  I'm not much of a commiserating person.  You got a problem?  Here's a solution.  You don't want to take the solution, then put up and shut up about it.  I don't want to hear constant whining about a problem they have no interest in resolving.  Life's too short to put up with constant complainers.

Guess I'm not too 'womanly' there. 

And while I find women attractive and can see the sexual interest, I've no real interest in pursuing females like I do men.

But since I LOOK very womanly, keep myself attractive, wear spike heels, short skirts, long hair, makeup etc., I'm expected to ACT womanly like 'society' expects and have dismayed many (including my parents) when I have not.

[shrugs]

You gotta be who you are.

[ednbarby]

LJ, it's almost frightening how much we have in common. 

Like you, when I was little I wanted to be a boy.  I grew up with two older brothers who essentially raised me once my Mom got to drinking.  And they did that with no help from a father figure - he was long gone.  One of my brothers taught me how to play basketball and to ice skate, the other taught me how to tie my shoelaces and ride a bike.  I climbed trees like a monkey, just like them.  And I hated wearing dresses and skirts - still do.  When I watched Westerns, I wanted to be the cowboys, too, and definitely *not* the women in their long dresses in the saloons.  I didn't even want to be Annie Oakley - I wanted to be Billy the Kid or Jesse James.

And I love hanging out with men.  I grew up hanging out with my older brothers and their friends.  They always treated me like an equal, and not like someone's "little sister."  My first crush, in fact, was one of my brothers' best friends.  It wasn't a sexual thing - I was eight or nine and he was fifteen.  I just liked hanging out with him and talking to him about music and movies we liked.  It was strange when my brothers started having girlfriends.  I had no idea how to act around them.  They were always very nice, but they wanted to put make-up on me or help me paint my nails, and I just wasn't into any of that.

To this day, I feel very comfortable in the company of men.  I'd rather be in a room full of them than a room full of women any day.  Partly because I love the way they look and sound and smell, but mostly because I just feel like I belong amongst them.  And like you, too, I love watching sports.  Especially hockey (and I must say these Oilers and Hurricanes are driving me crazy - they all look like a bunch of Jake clones skating around) and pro football.  My brothers and father taught me all the rules of both, so I know more than most women and some men about both of them.  Baseball is fun, too, but a little too slow for my taste.  And I'd rather play basketball than watch it, but I do enjoy that when it's on - especially college - too.

Of course misogynistic men piss me off - I grew up feeling equal to boys and men, and so when one treats me as subservient in any way, it just leaves me reeling.  There are some in every crowd, but fortunately these days it's no longer socially acceptable to be obviously chauvenistic.

[ednbarby]

I do have some female friends but we keep each other at arms length, as I'm not willing to always be 'understanding'.  My girlfriends have come to me for comfort and reassurance and eventually get offended when I suggest resolutions to their problems and finally lose patience with them.  I'm not much of a commiserating person.  You got a problem?  Here's a solution.  You don't want to take the solution, then put up and shut up about it.  I don't want to hear constant whining about a problem they have no interest in resolving.  Life's too short to put up with constant complainers.

Oh, my, Del.  You and I were cut from the same cloth as well, it would seem.  I cannot stand professional victims, as I call them.  The few woman friends I've been able to keep over the long term are either just like me in this way, or actually appreciate my suggestions (which I only give when asked for - honest!), put them to use, and come back for more.  I do have one woman friend who is never satisfied - it's like she keeps looking for that one thing that will finally "make" her happy.  I keep telling her it isn't a destination - it's a mode of travel.  I don't know - maybe my profoundly screwed up childhood has just helped me better appreciate how really easy life can be if you just let it be.  But I know that's much easier said than done for a lot of folks.

[opinionista]

I cannot stand professional victims, as I call them.

LOL. I have a friend, a male friend who's a professional victim! I like the term. I'm going to tell him that. I stand him because otherwise he's sweet but sometimes I get sick of his constant whining.

[dmmb_Mandy]

I grew up with two older brothers who essentially raised me once my Mom got to drinking.  And they did that with no help from a father figure - he was long gone.  One of my brothers taught me how to play basketball and to ice skate, the other taught me how to tie my shoelaces and ride a bike.  I climbed trees like a monkey, just like them.  And I hated wearing dresses and skirts - still do.  When I watched Westerns, I wanted to be the cowboys, too, and definitely *not* the women in their long dresses in the saloons.  I didn't even want to be Annie Oakley - I wanted to be Billy the Kid or Jesse James.

Barb, I know exactly what you mean. I grew up with 3 older brothers so I was the baby and the only girl, and my childhood was anything but girly. We played baseball, fished, played hide-and-seek and spotlight and laughed at those little girls at school in funny, little poofy dresses. When I fell, I had to take a deep breath and just shake it off. Men were my life. Oh, and I always wanted to be Batman.

[silkncense]

I think that makes you tomboy not a lesbian.

I have never wondered if I were a lesbian.  Funny tho' I don't think of myself as a tomboy either.  I think it's simply my mind is more hardwired masculine.  

This has made it very difficult for me to maintain friendships w/ other women & outside of the work environment most men at this age are w/ their families.  

You gotta be who you are.

Agreed.  It's just one of those interesting challenges in personal relationships.

Barb & Del - Glad to know ya!

[cmr107]

When I was little I wanted to be just like my big brother. He played hockey, so I liked hockey, went to all his games, watched games with him on TV. He sort of liked video games, so I would play with him (and I liked it). I loved all the superhero movies and shows that he watched. Like someone else said (Barb I think?), my first crush was one of his friends. All my cousins (except one that I have met twice because she lives in California) are male also.

What's interesting to me is that a lot of the women who have posted here about being tomboys or whatever is that they mostly seem to prefer the company of men. I love men, but my closest friends have always been girls.

I guess it is easier for women. I like being female, but I'm sooo not girly. I wear jeans and T shirts everyday, hate wearing skirts and dresses, don't like shopping. I do wear makeup, but only the teensiest amount possible. One of my very favorite things is volunteering at Habitat for Humanity in the summers, working with tools (I LOVE power tools!) and getting all dirty. One of the things I hate most is when a man comes over to try to help me when I don't need it. I work in the scene shop of our theatre on campus, mostly building sets, again using tools. I was first chair trumpet in band too, LJ! I have had many conversations with friends about which women we find attractive, both famous women or people we know. No one has ever said I was a lesbian. I think it's stupid that women are allowed to not conform to the traditional female stereotype, but men must conform to the stereotype or they are automatically gay. We should all just be able to be who we are without concern for what other people think. David, I can see how that would get annoying after so many years, but don't change who you are just for them.

[nakymaton]

You know those gazillion on-line quizzes that you can take? Well, apparently there was one making the rounds about "are you gay" -- and all the questions had to do with things like "do you know the names of more than six colors?" My husband ran across it on a message board that he reads, and read me some of the questions. And, you know, I thought the characteristics that got a guy labeled as gay were pretty appealing.

None of the questions asked whether you were attracted to other men or anything like that.

And the quiz bothers me for a couple reasons. First, there's an underlying homophobia... because, OMG, you wouldn't want to be gay or anything.  And second, because it tries to enforce a ridiculously limited stereotype of what it means to be a straight man. (I mean, according to the quiz, straight men don't exercise after age 35. Or know "ROY G. BIV". Or... well, I don't remember the entire list, but I think that being a moderately pleasant human being meant that you couldn't possibly be straight. Which, if it were true, would really really suck for straight women.)

(Fortunately for me, my husband tested as "obviously gay." Which is good, because I think he's a generally pleasant human being, and I wouldn't want to discover that he's secretly a jerk.)

cmr107 -- you're right. The rules for what women can like or be interested in are much looser than they are for men. (Though they've loosened considerably in my lifetime -- when I was a little girl, I was told to wear a dress to be "lady-like," and told that girls couldn't become astronauts or do math. People still make assumptions about what I'm capable of, but the roles for women are not nearly as rigid as they used to be.) It's too bad that men don't have that kind of freedom. Because I think that, no matter what kinds of biological differences there may be between men and women, there's a lot more natural variation in interests and behaviors than the stereotypes acknowledge. And it would be nice if people could be who they are, rather than the stereotypes they are expected to be.