"I figured you were sore from that punch"

[serious crayons]

LOL.  I just thought you might have meant you thought of a whole new way to look at Ennis's motivations here... or had more to say about what really did spur the punch/threats.  I think it was the kind of misunderstanding that comes from typing/reading vs. actually talking.
 

Or perhaps just me finding a new way of wording an idea I've no doubt expressed in other words before! 

[Brown Eyes]

Anyway, I thought you put it very well, and that gets at what I mean. Ennis is a protector, therefore wouldn't deliberately hurt Jack. I guess the punch was technically deliberate, but it was also impulsive and later regretted -- IMO, it does not constitute a sincere desire to injure Jack.

(Not that those are excuses -- I'm sure the same could be said of many domestic abusers. In other ways, though, I don't think I'd compare this to domestic violence. What if two friends got in a fight, both young and strong and healthy and equally matched, and one punched the other? Regrettable, sure, but to me a lot less scary and serious than the term "domestic violence" implies. So does the fact that they're lovers take it into that realm?)

I think that the fact that they're lovers does at least suggest the idea of domestic violence.  They are domestic partners of a sort while on Brokeback anyway.  It is less scary than it would be with Alma (for example) because, as you've noted, Jack is very strong (and may even be stronger than Ennis).  But, it's the principle of the thing and the level emotional impact of the punch is probably quite high since they are lovers (I think the emotional impact of a punch would be much different if they truly were just friends).  I've never thought about the idea that people have raised here that Jack might be crying after the punch.  It's hard to tell... it has always seemed to me that he was just stunned.  I don't know.  I think this is a truly difficult issue.  But, I do think that Jack really was still "sore from that punch" (as in mad or upset) by the time of the difficult talk with Ennis before they part ways.

On a related note.  I think it's interesting that it's the stain of Ennis's physical injury here (his bloody nose) that remains visible and permanent through to the end on the shirts.  I think the fact that Ennis got hurt here as well as Jack also mediates the impact of the punch.  Jack is bruised but he gets over it quickly (long before the reunion certainly, but again I don't think he's over it by the time of his chat with Ennis before the part ways after the Brokeback summer), but the stain of Ennis's blood suggests maybe a more profound situation for him as he walks away from the confusing tussle.
 

[serious crayons]

But, it's the principle of the thing and the level emotional impact of the punch is probably quite high since they are lovers (I think the emotional impact of a punch would be much different if they truly were just friends).

Good point.

I've never thought about the idea that people have raised here that Jack might be crying after the punch.  It's hard to tell... it has always seemed to me that he was just stunned.  I don't know.  I think this is a truly difficult issue.  But, I do think that Jack really was still "sore from that punch" (as in mad or upset) by the time of the difficult talk with Ennis before they part ways.

I don't think he was crying. That would be out of character, IMO. Jack didn't cry as often as Ennis because he just didn't cry as easily. Stunned is more like it to me, too.

I think definitely he was still sore by the time they were back at Aguiree's. By the time of their parting? Maybe. That might explain his relatively restrained emotions as he drove away. But I'm sure he would have gotten over it in a flash, if ...

[dly64]

I don't think he was crying. That would be out of character, IMO. Jack didn't cry as often as Ennis because he just didn't cry as easily. Stunned is more like it to me, too.

Ditto.

I think definitely he was still sore by the time they were back at Aguiree's. By the time of their parting? Maybe. That might explain his relatively restrained emotions as he drove away. But I'm sure he would have gotten over it in a flash, if ...

I don't see it this way ... (what a shock! I disagree!  ) ... if Jack would have been angry or upset, I don't think he would have taken Ennis' shirt. He wanted a part of Ennis ... not just his shirt, but his blood. IMO, Jack shows devastation right before their parting. His eyes … almost pleading to Ennis … “I might be back …”  in hopes that Ennis will join him again the following summer. When driving away, Jack is still pained. He is stunned and confused by the “punch”, but his longing for Ennis is still apparent.

[Brown Eyes]

I think the confusion brought on by the punch caused Jack to behave in an uncharacteristically restrained way.  I think he truly doesn't quite know how to read Ennis here and isn't as open as he might have been otherwise.  Maybe he should have pushed Ennis a little harder here to stay with him, go off with him, or something... and maybe that's what Ennis is wanting/waiting for Jack to do... since he's still largely relying on Jack leading the way.  Still, I think the confusion that started with the "confusing tussle" caused this parting to be much more fraught than it might have been otherwise.  But, I agree, that even through this Jack's still trying to demonstrate that he wants to see Ennis again.  And, yes his love and desire to keep the shirts certainly show that he's more concerned with those things in the long-run than the passing punch incident.

[serious crayons]

if Jack would have been angry or upset, I don't think he would have taken Ennis' shirt. He wanted a part of Ennis ... not just his shirt, but his blood. IMO, Jack shows devastation right before their parting. His eyes … almost pleading to Ennis … “I might be back …”  in hopes that Ennis will join him again the following summer.

You're absolutely right! Hey, I can change my mind, too. I keep forgetting about the shirts (duh -- like they're an minor insignificant little prop). If his behavior doesn't show it, the shirts are the proof of how Jack felt on that day.

Maybe he should have pushed Ennis a little harder here to stay with him, go off with him, or something... and maybe that's what Ennis is wanting/waiting for Jack to do... since he's still largely relying on Jack leading the way. 

I agree with this, too. Ennis hopes that Jack will take some action, as he had in the past. Not necessarily that if Jack had said, "Hey Ennis, screw the wedding, let's run off together, it'd be a sweet life" there's much hope Ennis would go for it. But it might have changed things ... somehow. At the very least, maybe made their parting less fraught. Maybe led them to figure out their next time to meet. Maybe maybe maybe maybe maybe caused Ennis to rethink the ill-starred wedding idea.

[dly64]

I agree with this, too. Ennis hopes that Jack will take some action, as he had in the past. Not necessarily that if Jack had said, "Hey Ennis, screw the wedding, let's run off together, it'd be a sweet life" there's much hope Ennis would go for it. But it might have changed things ... somehow. At the very least, maybe made their parting less fraught. Maybe led them to figure out their next time to meet. Maybe maybe maybe maybe maybe caused Ennis to rethink the ill-starred wedding idea.

I wish, wish, wish ... but it never happens! Sometimes I think the outcome will change ... but as we know, it never will.

[serious crayons]

I wish, wish, wish ... but it never happens! Sometimes I think the outcome will change ... but as we know, it never will.

Don't tell me that! I'm thinking that if I keep watching it and watching it, then someday, it will end differently ...

[jpwagoneer1964]

Don't tell me that! I'm thinking that if I keep watching it and watching it, then someday, it will end differently ...

I keep wishing Jack would have gone around the block when leaving Signal and he would have been the cowboy that found Ennis on his knees in that alcove.

[jpwagoneer1964]

Don't tell me that! I'm thinking that if I keep watching it and watching it, then someday, it will end differently ...

I keep wishing Jack would have gone around the block when leaving Signal and he would have been the cowboy that found Ennis on his knees in that alcove.