Author Topic: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene  (Read 12235 times)

JudgeHolden

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2008, 04:49:00 am »
I think this is Alma's home town, where she was probably born, and the minister has probably been a family friend for most of her life, as is likely to happen in small towns back then.

His comments were that of a close family friend, any thought of a crush on her are pretty preposterous.

I think the wedding scene was no more than it was intended to be...a small family wedding on a tight budget. I dont think the bloke with the dark hair was placed in the shot on purpose nor were there any hidden meanings or interpretations, hidden in the scene.

It was there to show the next path that Ennis followed after his adventure with Jack on Brokeback Mountain. It showed that life went on as had been planned before Brokeback and that Ennis was committing to a life that was considered the normal life he should be leading.....regardless of what was going on in his head at the time.







I think your right dead-on with this. Theres no heavy symbolism, because the players are loaded enough with significance all by themselves: the townspeople that Alma has known her entire life, her folks, her sister (remember the grocery store scene where you first meet Monroe, her sayng, "Monroe, Im so sorry, Ill clean this up soon as I call mys sisiter to come get the girls") the jolly minister likely tthe very one that baptised her. These people represent Society and Public Opinion. They are the holders of the standards that Ennis must meet in positive and negative ways.

A small town like that, the other folks are your lifeline in a rural isolated community, the people you lean on. To transgress their codes is to become a man without a country, unthinkable for someone like Ennis, who if you remember is an orphan. The man standing with him is his brother KE; remember in the credits theres one for KE DelMar) and in the screenplay theres a mention of Alma's "little parents" on the bride side, and Ennis's "rawboned brother and sister" on his side. Thats perceptive to notice the shared suit, the best man is in his clean working clothes, so the groom can wear theone suit between them they can afford. I figure the other folks rounding out the groom side is the ranch foreman, maybe some friends of his from work, and his brothers wife and inlaws.

For Ennis has no other family. To lose the few other connections he has by proxy is a fearful thing to this boy, why even the possibility of being shunned for one of the worst transgressions of the code is unthinkable for him. I dont think these are conscious thoughts to him I doubt that Ennis is any more articulate in his own thoughts than he is in his words. he has vague feelings.

Alma is purely happy, a woman would be on her big day, biggest day of her life, for a girl like that back then, not too much glamor and bright lights for poor country girl in Wyoming back then. Far as she knows, everyhting in life just fell into place, and its happily ever after. They might not have money but she loves Ennis and at this point, imagines whatever life thows their way, she'll make it happy for their little family. Likely Ennis's lonely childhood, losing his folks so young, touched he heart, and she was going to fix it, build him up, give him the happy home he lost.

His thoughts...way more complicated. I wouldnt say he looks sad so much as solemn. Hes taking the next step, doing what a man does, marrying and becoming head of a household, and be seen now as  a man among men, something he would of always had secret doubts on, dating back to that first view of old Earl in that drainage, all stirred up by Jack Twist on the mountain. That wedding ring is the officila stamp of approval, but its also a symbol of his weighty new responsibilities. He is now a breadwinner, and bottom line, hes an uneducated laborer with not a lot of prospects, though hes young enough that he dont yet feel the slimness of his chance of escape from the grind of poverty. He still has that dream of a spread of his own, no sickly daughter yetand bills to put it a little further out of reach every payday.

I imagine Jack Twist crosses his mind, but not like those fanfics where Ennis is all but quoting the lines from "I Meant Every Word He Said". To Ennis, Jack and the mountain is already some neverland place, not unlike Lureens cynical description of a pretend place where bluebids sing, somewhere not real, not of the everyday world of your wife, your boss, the guy at the feed store, the people in church and all there implied judgements. It gets a little further away all the time, locked in that room in his mind he only goes to when hes drifting away to sleep or lost in his chores and all alone.

Im pretty sure on this, because I lived it myself. That was me, some twenty or so years ago in my startched uniform, the chaplain and crossed swords instead of a drafty little prairie church in November, but I have been there and I know what went thru his head, and thats why it kills me too, to see her all radiant in her princess dress smiling tenderly at him. He was hoping it would "fix" him for good and all. Yet 4 years later, a few lines from Jack on the back of a postcards brings the whole thing down on there heads, shows what a house of cards it was, a house of cards built on sand.

The wedding is also the end for Jack and Ennis, the end of the idyll. He was still up there in Lightning Flat in those months, likely thought all the time on getting in his truch and making the drive, but being around that father of his, grinding all his big plans and schemes to powdr, he was never going to have anymore nerve than he did in that parking lot outside Aguirres trailer. But in those weeks between coming down off Broke back and "I do", there was still breathing room, in theory anyways. After "I do" the walls that would keep them forever apart were set in stone

Offline Monika

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2008, 05:29:02 am »
The man standing with him is his brother KE; remember in the credits theres one for KE DelMar)

I can´t believe I´ve never noticed that in the credits. Maybe I´ve just been to busy bawling my eyes out :laugh:
Thanks for pointing it out!

Offline LauraGigs

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2008, 12:37:08 pm »
The credit "Steffen Cole Moser  -  K.E. Del Mar, Age 11" is for the boy in the flashback Earl scene. 

(In any case, I agree that the man next to Ennis must be K.E.)

Great post, JudgeHolden.

Offline chowhound

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2008, 03:15:55 pm »
I have just one question about the part of the film with the Minister in it:

1. When we hear the Lord's prayer in the voice over, is there any significance in the fact that we don't hear it from the beginning, but from the middle. This is what we get to hear from the congregation:

      ...and forgive our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. Lead us not into temptation, but
      deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory, forever. Amen.

Offline LauraGigs

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2008, 05:43:10 pm »
When we hear the Lord's prayer in the voice over, is there any significance in the fact that we don't hear it from the beginning, but from the middle.

Well yeah, of course!


Quote
  ...and forgive our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. Lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil. For thine is the kingdom, the power and the glory, forever. Amen.

The voice-over begins as Ennis is crouched prostrate in the alley, on his knees as if in prayer.  Why is he in that position?  He's wrestling with all his feelings: confusion, anger, grief, and guilt.  As JudgeHolden said, he's "transgressed the codes" of his society.  This specific part of the prayer deals with confessing our sins and asking forgiveness.

Offline Katie77

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2008, 07:08:39 pm »
Judge Holden.....only someone who has gone through it could have worded and explained the wedding scene as perfectly as you have. Thank you for your insight, and I have no doubt that your interpretation is very accurate, from the visuals we see and also what thoughts Ennis was probably thinking.

And your final paragraph, oh god yes, how true, that it spelt the beginning of 20yrs of frustration and anxiety for both Ennis and Jack. Little did we know that, as we watched that wedding scene. Little did Ennis know either what it was the beginning of.

I agree too, with Chowhound about the voice over of the Lords Prayer, starting while Ennis was still crouched in the alley way....beginning with the end of his Brokeback experience and ending with the beginning of the "normal" life he was committing himself to with Alma. It signifies the religious boundaries of one way of life against the other.
Being happy doesn't mean everything is perfect.

It means you've decided to see beyond the imperfection

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2008, 11:59:47 pm »
And your final paragraph, oh god yes, how true, that it spelt the beginning of 20yrs of frustration and anxiety for both Ennis and Jack. Little did we know that, as we watched that wedding scene. Little did Ennis know either what it was the beginning of.

I think Ennis probably had at least a little sense that getting married wasn't the best idea from the prespective of personal desires and happiness.  Yes, the wedding set into motion a lot of misery for himself and Jack, but also for Alma.  It does seem very true that Ennis is going through with this marriage out of his characteristic desire to try to have a "normal" life that won't freak out the "people on the pavement"... or to appease Society (as I believe the gathering in the church represents).  I think he knows this is all a very dicey situation even during the ceremony, which is why he looks so pained.

It's also interesting to wonder at exactly what point Ennis understands all the ramifications of his emotional breakdown in the alley.  He mentions to Jack (in the story) that it "took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights. Too late then by a long, long while."  So, by the November wedding, Ennis probably hasn't made a lot of progress in processing his emotions regarding Jack. 

the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Katie77

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #27 on: December 03, 2008, 01:29:29 am »
It's also interesting to wonder at exactly what point Ennis understands all the ramifications of his emotional breakdown in the alley.  He mentions to Jack (in the story) that it "took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights. Too late then by a long, long while."  So, by the November wedding, Ennis probably hasn't made a lot of progress in processing his emotions regarding Jack. 



Maybe he realized after a year married to Alma, that he was not getting the fullfillment or the satisfaction that he had got with Jack. Maybe he thought that once he got married, the time on Brokeback would be just a faint memory, and when it wasn't after a year, he knew that it was in his soul forever, and that he had definately gone in the wrong direction, but now could find no way out of it.
Being happy doesn't mean everything is perfect.

It means you've decided to see beyond the imperfection

Offline LauraGigs

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #28 on: December 03, 2008, 12:14:01 pm »
Katie and Holden, your thoughts are so well put. "In his soul forever..."  Totally.


You are all funny.  I never thought the Jolly Minister represented anything... 

IMO, there was one major telling moment with the minister:

"I now pronounce you man and wife"
[Ennis leans in to kiss Alma, then straightens up as minister speaks again]
"You may kiss the bride."
[Ennis leans in again, then straightens up as minister speaks again]
"And if you don't, I will."
[Ennis laughs weakly with the group, then finally kisses Alma]

It's a microcosm of Ennis's dilemma; he can't express love without outside approval.

Offline Brown Eyes

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Re: Ennis & Alma's wedding scene
« Reply #29 on: December 03, 2008, 12:24:09 pm »
It's a microcosm of Ennis's dilemma; he can't express love without outside approval.

Ooooooooooooo, this is really good Laura!  What a good, concise way to describe Ennis's frame of mind when it comes to love and convention.




the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie