Fan Fiction - Popularity Contest or Formula for Orthodoxy?

[twistedude]

Is that THE Magic Mountain? (Had an echo of it in one of my stories, but that part of the stoiry didn't work out, so it's--pretty much gone. Love Thoimas Mann). There are also all sorts of ways to treat Jack--fill in the blanks: someone is doing a whole sereies of the 4 lost years; there's pre-Ennis, and Jack makes a nifty ghost. There are other, apparently small, blanks that can occupy much space. These are all orthodox tratments--cannon faithful. Othwerwise, the story is frequently treated as a non-tragedy, as has already been mentioned. .

[Marge_Innavera]

In the novel The Forsythe Saga the heroine Irene has a similarly doomed grand love affair with Philip Bossiney who also dies. She goes on to marry Soames Forsythe and we trace her fortunes as well as other members of the family in subsequent years. I guess it depends where we train our focus and whether we stop at one segment of Ennis' life - the Love Affair of which both Ennis and Jack are integral parts - or whether we continue on with Ennis as the main protagonist as he journeys through different parts of his life.

There are a number of fanfics that center around his family relationships over the subsequent years.  But if the story is to continue past the point of the original ending, then Jack not being physically present has to be dealt with some way or another. Or there are the alternatives of "pre-quels" (not very common but some out there), fill-ins of scenes and characters not developed (e.g. Randall, the vacation at Don Vroe's cabin only mentioned in passing in the film) or AU. I've read examples of all these and some work, some don't just like in any other kind of fiction.

Sometimes the orthodoxy centers around how crushed Ennis is "expected" to be, and how intransigent his fears and homophobia are perceived as being. The film in particular leaves all that unresolved, as well as the question of how much Ennis is going to be affected by changing attitudes toward homosexuality, or whether he'll be affected by it at all, how his relationships with his daughters are going to evolve over time. There does seem to be a certain percentage of resistence to the idea of his being able to do anything but grieve, drink and feel guilty; and there's a limit to where a plot line can go with that.

And some of that orthodoxy is essentially a reflection of the question: whether that closet door where the shirts are at the end represents a retreat into fear or an enshrining of the relationship and what it meant. If it's the former, then there's the question of how to apply that to Jack, as he had the shirts much more hidden than Ennis does, and that isn't addressed very often.

[louisev]

I am pleased that there is such a varied and in depth discussion of the ideas of orthodoxy.  Some of you here have far more experience in fan writing and participating in "fandoms" than I do - which is very little! - and the more I learn, the more fascinated I am.

BBM Fan fiction is a very new thing, barely six months old.  In January 2006 there were barely any stories... and now they are breaking out all over.  One of the most fascinating things for me is how such a wildfire phenomenon could develop a strict orthodoxy so rapidly, and so intransigently.  I am looking forward, as a co-moderator of Bettermost's expanding Fan Fiction forum, to nurturing all visions and all types of BBM plots - even crossovers with other fandoms.  I have had a rumor from one of my own readers that she has a crossover fic nearly completed, and I would be very interested to see what that one holds!

[notBastet]

Do you guys think this orthodoxy thing is strictly a product of the fan fiction world? Or do you think there are parallels throughout society, and thus it happens in fan fiction cause we are products of our world?  (And perhaps a better question, do the first two questions make any sense?)

Kelly

[Marge_Innavera]

IMO it's definitely a reflection of human society at large. Something starts out in an undefined creative field; and eventually both power claims and fear of not being in control narrow that field down with dicta about the "right" this, the "wrong" that, this or that guru or icon who is not to be questioned, you name it. It happens with religions with depressing regularity, and they continue on their momentum for centuries after their clergy are essentially suckling a dead litter.

That means, among other things, that it's vitally important to keep as much diversity as possible.  When a significant number of people refuse to accept the power of orthodoxy at the beginning, it's less likely to metastasize past the point of no return.

[louisev]

Small town, yes!  What a great metaphor.

Everybody knows everybody, and there are neighbors' expectations and opinions to live up to... and everybody has to toe the line... because there is nowhere to run, and nowhere to hide.

[RouxB]

Crazily enough I started replying to this over a week ago. I spent over an hour composing a reply only to have a very dear friend appear at my back door at 11:30 pm barefoot, in her bathrobe with a bleeding and blackening eye. Real life and perspective can do a number on cyberlife.

Having had time to think about this, I no longer need an hour to compose a reply. I am a reader, not a writer, of fanfic (though I have written some drabbles that will never been seen by anyone but me-if that) so I come from that perspective. I will read pretty much anything, most of what I read comes to me by recommendation, though I prefer AU. I have had the "dead Jack" experience in the best way possible so really don't need to repeat it in my pleasure reading-been there and done that sadness.

I am fascinated by the degree of difference within the sameness of most of the AU fanfic. Gives me an insight into how the author interpreted the movie or book characters and how the interpretation differs from my own.

Bottom line-I can't speak to the popularity aspect as when I am compelled to write it is to arrange the world to make me happy and I suspect this is true with many other writers. And, what makes a lot of us happiest is E&J Forever

[twistedude]

E and J forever? Romeo and Juliet forever? I suppose our opinions are just an expression iof our experience, but when I read or see, or in any way expereience, a great work of art with a tragic ending, I don't dare alter it. It feels to me like a sacrilege. It makes a certain kind of sense, and it's not my business to turn it into a different kind of sense.

The odd thing is, I enjoy reading E and J forever; I just can't WRITE it...

[Marge_Innavera]

I am fascinated by the degree of difference within the sameness of most of the AU fanfic. Gives me an insight into how the author interpreted the movie or book characters and how the interpretation differs from my own.

Bottom line-I can't speak to the popularity aspect as when I am compelled to write it is to arrange the world to make me happy and I suspect this is true with many other writers. And, what makes a lot of us happiest is E&J Forever

What the discussion in this case is essentially about is the tendency of many to take the route in insisting that it isn't what would make the reader or writer 'happy' or what would be the most rewarding to them - even though fanfic writers know there will be no financial rewards forthcoming - but rather toeing the line on what plotlines, interpretations or even, in the case of some 'ultra-orthodox' authors, what reactions are "acceptable" and what not "acceptable". The result, if that approach gets its way, can be people quite wasting their time and creative energy trying to fit their reading or their work into an arbitrary mold. And when that approach gets its way, whether one compares it to a small town or uses any other metaphor, you might as well put creativity through a shredder and flush it down the toilet.

After all, in the end what good came out of the campaign to stamp out "decadent art"?   

[louisev]

Having had time to think about this, I no longer need an hour to compose a reply. I am a reader, not a writer, of fanfic (though I have written some drabbles that will never been seen by anyone but me-if that) so I come from that perspective. I will read pretty much anything, most of what I read comes to me by recommendation, though I prefer AU. I have had the "dead Jack" experience in the best way possible so really don't need to repeat it in my pleasure reading-been there and done that sadness.

How curious, Rouxb.... when I got here on the first page of the E &E thread you described yourself as a devoted reader of the Laramie Saga.  I guess I'm confused.