Author Topic: Marajuana  (Read 10135 times)

Offline Shakesthecoffecan

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Marajuana
« on: August 15, 2006, 03:08:51 pm »
In all of my extensive reading of posts on numerous boards, I cannot recall any discussion of Jack rolling a joint and handing it to Ennis. It is almost like the other details of the story/film were so incredible that this statement was not worth the effort. What was Jack's party habits? Randall apparently was not that long out of Texas A&M so did he turn Jack onto pot? And what of Ennis? Where on his coffee pot would the other pot have ever made its presence known? When I first saw the film I was like "hey they're smoking a joint!" and then nothing more.

I have nothing against them or anyone getting high, the silence surprised me more than anything.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2006, 10:33:16 pm by shakestheground »
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Offline Penthesilea

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2006, 05:42:57 pm »
Now that you say it, yeah, it's surprising it was never brought up as a topic, given that we discuss vividly about coffee pots, fans, a single cherry in a pie and thousand other subtle details.

When I first saw the movie, I found it really cool that Ang Lee let the pot smoking happen so casually and naturally. Because this is what it is in reality: people do smoke dope in their leisure time just as casual as they have a drink. But in movies either it is non-existent or it's made a big deal.

Annie Proulx describes it in the story in the same way:

Jack and Ennis passed a joint back and forth, the fire burning late, Jack restless and bitching about the cold, poking the flames with a stick, twisting the dial of the transistor radio until the batteries died.

Her essay "Getting movied" ends with the words:

[...] an accumulation of very small details gives the film authenticity and authority: Ennis's dirty fingernails in a love scene, the old highway sign ENTERING WYOMING not seen here for decades, the slight paunch Jack develops as he ages, [....] Ennis and Jack sharing a joint instead of a cigarette in the 1970s, [...] the speckled enamel coffeepot, all accumulate and convince us of the truth of the story. People may doubt that young men fall in love up on the snowy hights, but no one disbelieves the speckled coffeepot, and if the coffeepot is true, so is the other.

Annie Proulx is spot-on: it is one of the unnumberable details that make this movie so real.
But it wasn't in the 70s, it was at their last meeting, May 1983, in both story and movie.

Quote
And what of Ennis? Where on his coffee pot would the other pot have ever made its presence known?
I like your phrasing here, lol
Reasoning from what we see, it was not their first shared joint. Thinking about it, it may be a little bit surprising, regarding Ennis. I think it was Jack who brought the dope. And I like the thought that, being together with Jack, Ennis was relaxed enough to have a shot at it.
Somehow I can't see Ennis in his trailer smoking a joint, but I don't have a problem picturing him nursing several (too many, probably) beer bottles.
But maybe I should give Ennis more credit here. He may have lived in rural Wyoming, travelling only around the coffeepot, but he clearly wasn't living under a rock. So maybe their first time sharing a joint was just like the one time we witness: no big deal.



Quote
What was Jack's party habits?
I don't know when and where Jack may have made his first aquitance with dope. Maybe in the Rodeo curcuit? But I don't think so. His rodeo days ended when he met Lureen, mid-sixties. Probably too early. I don't think smoking dope was as widespread in the mid-sixties as it was in the 70s.
But in the 70s I think it was widespread. And Jack had more of a social life than Ennis. He came around, travelling for Newsome Farm Equipment, and he and Lureen apparently had an active social life in the communitiy of Childress.

moremojo

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2006, 05:43:23 pm »
Hey, shakes, Judy and Pete and I broached this topic at our dinner last night (lovely people, great food, and LOTS of BBM discussion--what's not to like?). We all thought it rather astonishing that our boys, with their conservative, rural backgrounds, would partake of the wacky tobaccky, but agreed that Jack must have introduced it into the relationship, given his greater worldliness and more cosmopolitan outlook due to wider peregrinations.

As you point out, the detail comes straight from Annie's original story, where it also receives nothing past a brief reference. I remember reading that Proulx was anxious that this detail not be elided due to overly PC sensibilities on the studio's part, and in this, as in so many other ways, the filmmakers preserved the integrity of Ms. Proulx's vision. Still, how did Ennis, with his inclination to stodginess and conservatism, manage to be persuaded to take this trip on the wild side? That Jack Twist apparently had lots of tricks up those blue sleeves of his!

 ;)

Offline serious crayons

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2006, 06:05:51 pm »
To be honest, I don't like this part. And not because I disapprove of marijuana (believe me, I really, really don't disapprove of it ::) ;)).

But it just never struck me as realistic. Back in '83, I was much younger than Jack and Ennis are in that scene, and I knew lots of people who smoked pot. Pretty much everyone I knew did, in fact (most did much more than that). But I knew very few people in their late 30s who did. And I lived in a fairly large, liberal city.

Now, admittedly, at that point in my life I knew very few people in their late 30s, period. But it always seemed to me that pot never particularly caught on among pre-baby boomers (and Jack and Ennis are just out of baby-boomer range). Of course, there are tons of exceptions. But would those exceptions be people who lived in conservative small towns, who socialize with pretty conservative folks, and who to all appearances have no younger or hipper friends?

I'm not saying it's impossible. It just seems unlikely. So that scene has always made me kind of uncomfortable (as does the line in the story). It seems a little, I don't know, gratuitous or something.




« Last Edit: August 15, 2006, 06:35:58 pm by latjoreme »

Offline nakymaton

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2006, 06:24:45 pm »
I would bet that Jack's and Ennis's kids knew exactly where to get pot in 1983. I would bet that the kids, at least, knew people who grew it. My experience in the early 80's was that kids who would grow up to be very socially and politically conservative were the wildest partiers in town.

As for whether Jack and Ennis would know... hmmm. I bet that the younger ranch hands that Ennis worked with smoked pot. And Jack was more worldly and willing to experiment in any case.

So I didn't find it surprising at all.
Watch out. That poster has a low startle point.

Offline opinionista

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2006, 06:28:33 pm »
To be honest, I don't like this part. And not because I disapprove of marijuana (believe me, I really, really don't disapprove of it ::) ;)).

But it just never struck me as realistic. Back in '83, I was much younger than Jack and Ennis are in that scene, and I knew lots of people who smoked pot. Pretty much everyone I knew did, in fact (most did much more than that). But I knew very few people in their late 30s who did. And I lived in a big, liberal city.

Now, admittedly, at that point in my life I knew very few people in their late 30s, period. But it always seemed to me that pot never particularly caught on among pre-baby boomers (and Jack and Ennis are just out of baby-boomer range). Of course, there are tons of exceptions. But would those exceptions be people who lived in conservative small towns, who socialize with pretty conservative folks, and who to all appearances have no younger or hipper friends?

I'm not saying it's impossible. It just seems unlikely. So that scene has always made me kind of uncomfortable (as does the line in the story). It seems a little, I don't know, gratuitous or something.


I thought it was realistic. They're from 1960's generation after all (I know they weren't born then, but you know what I mean, I think). I don't think  liberal city people were the only ones who smoked pot then, it was pretty widespread, especially during the 1980's. Ennis and Jack weren't city boys, but Jack travelled some because of his job, and Ennis probably met other ranch hands who knew about pot and stuff. So, I think it's possible and realistic they had a joint or two. 
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.

Offline delalluvia

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2006, 06:52:00 pm »
I think Jack picked up more than men in his travels to Mexico.  ;D

Offline serious crayons

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2006, 07:06:25 pm »
I think Jack picked up more than men in his travels to Mexico.  ;D

Now, there's a thought! I like that. To me, it seems a more realistic possibility than being turned onto it by a combine customer.

Offline nakymaton

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2006, 09:33:36 pm »
"You been to Mexico, Jack Twist?"

"Hell yes, I've been to Mexico. Where the hell do you think that weed came from?"
Watch out. That poster has a low startle point.

Offline Shakesthecoffecan

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Re: Marajuana
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2006, 12:09:09 pm »
Wow, these are some insiteful observations, I'm amazed.

I think those born in the years just after WWII would be more likely to smoke pot than those slightly older. I do know people Jack and Ennis's age who partake, but it was never a big thing in their lives. I think many who were in the war in Vietnam were exposed to it there and brought it back with them, so contemporaries of theirs could have turned them on to it.

This makes me think about the draft, knowing Jack was too busted up to be drafted, I wonder about Ennis. Perhaps he got a deferment for being married, then one when each daughter was born, but by 1967 it seems like he would have been vunerable. O-well, it's a story now, ain't it? But imagine Ennis in Vietnam. He may have been read for Texas when he got back. 
"It was only you in my life, and it will always be only you, Jack, I swear."