What would you like Ang to comment on?

[serious crayons]

Funny (or charming) how different we are in this! I love hearing Heath talking in his native tongue, wearing sunglasses and all.

Well, just to clarify, it's not that I find anything intrinsically unappealing about shades-wearing Aussie Heath (au contraire!). But one of my personal BBM-related psychological frailties is the confusion I get from seeing Jack and Ennis looking so different. Even weirder, I get kind of jealous of Jake and Heath because I fear they "know" Jack and Ennis better than I do! 

I don't mean they understand the story better, though. Mikaela, I'm with you on not taking their statements as gospel. But again, it's confusing. I don't like having to fight the feeling that they might have some greater authority on the subject. I don't think they do, but it's easier just not to have to hear it.

I remember once getting in a protracted argument here over something Diana Ossana said about Ennis' "inability to access his emotions." My co-arguer used that to suport his view of Ennis' psychology. I had a different view, so I found myself having to debate not only him but also Diana, who supposedly would know more about Ennis' character than I would because she'd had a hand in creating it. I don't think Diana or anyone else is the ultimate authority. And I especially don't take as gospel someone's offhand five-word remark in an interview (or in this case, an essay). But I'd rather just not have her dragged into it in the first place.

I think from the interviews I've seen that both Ang Lee and the actors are aware of this and entirely respectful of their audience's views and interpretations - never wanting to come across as if they have the one true answer to what anything means or what any character feels.

I agree, and I really appreciate that, too.

I wouldn't say no to seeing every single first night and second night and reunion takes while I'm dreaming

Me neither! (Insert nonexistent blushing icon here)

[Mikaela]

from Lee
But, do you think we're ever going to get any kind of special edition? It seems like all of the players have gone on to other things and "forgotton" our beautiful film.

I admit I'm gettting worried.  One reason that I remain so exceedingly peeved at the AMPAS for handing the Best Film Oscar where it didn't belong, is that I'm absolutely sure there would have been a collector's edition BBM if our film had gotten the "Best Film" nod. But still, it is a contemporary classic, it defined contemporary cultural discussion (and talk show jokes) for a good while,  it got more awards than any other of its year, and so I can't believe Focus would not want to prepare a DVD with more in-depth, informative and better bonus material than the meagre stuff on the currently available retail DVD.

But there's been no word that a collector's edition film is forthcoming. And even if it does happen somewhere down the road, the more time since the filming, the less spontaneous will be the commentaries. Which will be such a pity! Filming took place several years ago - the filming process will be dwindling in everyone's memory unless they get to it soonish. All those little things that die-hard fans like us would love to hear will be forgotten.    Focus, can you heaaaaaaar me?  **stamps foot while making pleading puppy dog eyes**

From Katherine
it's not that I find anything intrinsically unappealing about shades-wearing Aussie Heath (au contraire!). But one of my personal BBM-related psychological frailties is the confusion I get from seeing Jack and Ennis looking so different.

Jake as himself looks pretty much like young Jack, I think, so there's not so much of a problem there. But Heath seems and looks to be Ennis's very opposite in many respects. I can say in all honesty that watching Heath Ledger interviews, apart from making me appreciate the actor himself a lot,  has given me a better understanding of what pure and true acting is all about. It's not so much what he says, but his behaviour while he says it. He fidgets and twitches and is constantly all over the place, seeming absolutely unable to keep his face, hands or eyes still for as much as a second. (Very charming, distinct personality, and it makes him seem like a completely *real* person, without artifice of any kind.) That he managed to transform himself into creating our Ennis Del Mar is a marvel of acting and a fantastic gift to acting appreciation. (And here I go, back to beeing peeved at the AMPAS some more, this time on Heath's behalf.  )

[serious crayons]

Jake as himself looks pretty much like young Jack, I think, so there's not so much of a problem there. But Heath seems and looks to be Ennis's very opposite in many respects. I can say in all honesty that watching Heath Ledger interviews, apart from making me appreciate the actor himself a lot,  has given me a better understanding of what pure and true acting is all about. It's not so much what he says, but his behaviour while he says it. He fidgets and twitches and is constantly all over the place, seeming absolutely unable to keep his face, hands or eyes still for as much as a second. (Very charming, distinct personality, and it makes him seem like a completely *real* person, without artifice of any kind.) That he managed to transform himself into creating our Ennis Del Mar is a marvel of acting and a fantastic gift to acting appreciation. (And here I go, back to beeing peeved at the AMPAS some more, this time on Heath's behalf.  ) [/quote]

I agree with you about everything. Whereas Jake looks pretty much like Jack with an updated hairstyle (in retrospect, I should have excluded the reference to him in my earlier post), Heath and Ennis act and look so different it's almost hard to believe they are (sort of) the same person.

When some friends and I were talking recently about who we considered today's best actor (Sean Penn? Johnny Depp? etc.) I of course named Heath. Someone laughed outright at that, I guess because she felt Heath didn't have a resume full of great performances. And it's true that, while he has been good in some other movies, he doesn't have the long stellar history of Penn or Depp. But this one performance so eclipses all of theirs that I think it earns him the title.

And I, too, am permanently peeved at the AMPAS for the reasons you give. I feel bad for BBM and Heath not so much because they missed out on the temporarily and quickly forgotten applause at the award show itself. It's because they were denied all the perks that come with an Academy Award.

[Penthesilea]

in all honesty, Jake and Heath could read the New York telephone directory in their normal voices and dialects and I'd be majorly pleased. I like both their voices so much.  (Why isn't there a blushing icon available when you need it?  ) Just hearing them all reminiscing about the shooting etc. would be great. 

Yes yes and yes. We even had a poll about this  Have you seen that youtube vid, where Jack narrates the story about Philippe Petit? I listened to it twice. First time I followed the story, second time I concentrated on Jake's voice. And I'm a Heathen, not a Gyllenhalic, lol.
But I like both their voices, too. Jake's is so sweet and Heath's is more manly, so deep *mmmm*

In case you haven't seen the vid, here it is. 10 minutes Jake's voice, reading "The Man Who Walked Beteween the Towers":

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nq52n9TyfO4

The one thing I do not want to see,  is an extended version of the film. I'd love to see each and every outtake and scene cut for time, but not inserted into the film. No way. The film is perfect as it is. Tinkering with it to insert hippies, or an additional Ennis-vision of Jack's death or any other scene we know was actually filmed might ruin it for me. The flow of the thinkg, the emotions, the characters...... one little scene might change too much. So while I'm ready to campaign for a DVD with each and every deleted scene as a bonus feature on the side, and I wouldn't say no to seeing every single first night and second night and reunion takes while I'm dreaming - I'm saying: Please Focus - don't give us no extended film! Don't change what's perfect already!

I agree. I want to see all deleted scenes, every bit part of it. David(inHartford) said, he'd even like to see every minute of those 20 years: Ennis in the shower, Jack doing his tax forms, Ennis working on a ranch, and so on. I like this thought of him, lol. Wouldn't mind Ennis in the shower (now I need a blushing icon, too).
But I would not want to see the deleted scenes inserted in the movie for the reasons you mentioned.

[Penthesilea]

But Heath seems and looks to be Ennis's very opposite in many respects. I can say in all honesty that watching Heath Ledger interviews, apart from making me appreciate the actor himself a lot,  has given me a better understanding of what pure and true acting is all about. It's not so much what he says, but his behaviour while he says it. He fidgets and twitches and is constantly all over the place, seeming absolutely unable to keep his face, hands or eyes still for as much as a second. (Very charming, distinct personality, and it makes him seem like a completely *real* person, without artifice of any kind.) That he managed to transform himself into creating our Ennis Del Mar is a marvel of acting and a fantastic gift to acting appreciation. (And here I go, back to beeing peeved at the AMPAS some more, this time on Heath's behalf.  )

*sigh* Again, I couldn't agree more. I wrote nearly the same long ago on TOB. I love Heath fidgeting and talking with his hands and face, it's sooooo cute (*insert another sigh*). He seems to be a nervous wreck in most interwievs. The first time I saw him in two interwievs on youtube, I was more than surprised.
I thought wow!, how could this agile, fidgety guy manage to portray our stoic and taciturn Ennis? He was so robbed of that Osacar!

And I like both so much: stoic, quiet Ennis and fidgety, agile Heath. And despite the differences in body language and demeanour I got the impression there is some Ennis in Heath. Not the tragic, full of self-doubt Ennis (hopefully for Heath), but some of Ennis's earnestness or seriousness or reliability (there's no word in the English language which is an exact translation for the German one I'm thinking of - hope you get the picture anyway). I mean I got the impression he's not one who shrugs off things easily.

[Mikaela]

Thank you for the link to the Towers story. It's lovely and lighthearted - not what I'd have expected just reading the title. Jake reads it well and lively, too. 

some of Ennis's earnestness or seriousness or reliability (there's no word in the English language which is an exact translation for the German one I'm thinking of - hope you get the picture anyway). I mean I got the impression he's not one who shrugs off things easily.

I've got the same impression and I do get the picture - it's well observed and accurately described. I'm curious as to which German word you're thinking of..... my German is too rusty these days but I'd like to know. 

Oh, and I'm *so* in agreement with your shower comment!  **Looks around for a bald little blushing icon, but there's none - so this one will have to suffice:  **

From Katherine
Well, just to clarify, it's not that I find anything intrinsically unappealing about shades-wearing Aussie Heath (au contraire!). But one of my personal BBM-related psychological frailties is the confusion I get from seeing Jack and Ennis looking so different.

I realized there's one thing that gives me the exact same confused, head-spinning, alternate-reality feeling, and that is seeing various on-set pictures of Heath and Michelle cuddling in costume between takes. It's almost surreal to see Ennis and Alma so close and affectionate! 

[Penthesilea]

I've got the same impression and I do get the picture - it's well observed and accurately described. I'm curious as to which German word you're thinking of..... my German is too rusty these days but I'd like to know. 

The German word was "Ernsthaftigkeit", which could be translated as earnestness. But my dictionary also offers graveness, seriousness, severity, sincerity, sobriety and wholeheartedness as translations.
But when translating the English words back to German (or knowing them and their common using), none of them hits the point exactly.

[Mikaela]

Danke schön! 

I have the same difficulty sometimes in finding the exact English word that fits the expression I'm thinking of. Translation is a tricky but very interesting subject.


(I wonder why some of the smileys still are missing their Cowboy hats. They look doubly bald now that the others have them.......)

[serious crayons]

If you're still having a problem with the cowboy hats, reportedly it can be resolved by clearing your cache. I'm just glad to get the laughing one back!

 

Back to Chrissi's earlier point, I think it's true that there seem to be similarities between Heath and Ennis, as well as between Jake and Jack. Heath is more serious, Jake more voluble. I'm sure they could switch roles and be convincing, because they are good actors. Still, it's hard to imagine. The casting was perfect.

[dly64]

OMG you guys!! I am just getting caught up on some of these threads and I am cracking up because there are so many POV (but isn’t that the way it should be?)

In all honesty, I don’t want to see an extended version. There are very few extended versions that I think really augment the theatrical release version. Sometimes ex-versions even change the essence of the entire film. What I would like to see, however, are the deleted scenes. I know there are several since many of them were used in the trailer.

As for commentary, there should be three: Ang with the editor and cinematographer; Heath, Jake, Ann, and Michelle; and Diana Ossana and Larry McMurtry.

I agree that Ang would probably not give any commentary on motivation. From what I have read and heard … this guy speaks in riddles. (Ang in regards to Lureen and Jack: “You go together like milk and water.” Hunh?? Does anyone have a clue as to what that means??)

I like the idea of commentaries because they can be there for those who want to listen to them. I have found some commentaries very interesting and educational (like the Roger Ebert’s commentary for “Citizen Kane” or Sam Mendes commentary for “Jarhead.”)

What I would like the most, in all honesty, is a nicely packaged DVD that has photos and production logs, etc. That’s just me. Does anyone else agree?


Forgot to add ... I want to see outtakes. I love that kind of stuff.