getting hit hard by offhand revelations (story discussion)

[Front-Ranger]

I love this! Especially the reference to a mountain of laundry!!

I'm sure there are many answers, Scott, but the one that works for me is the ancient custom of young men going up a mountain, or out in the desert to test their manhood or to undergo initiation rites. Let's see, I wrote about this somewhere else in connection with werewolves...let me unbury it for you.

Glad to see you thinking about the story again!! Does this mean you're no longer bored with it? If so, yay!!

[Scott6373]

I don't think I was bored, I think, like so many others, it instigated so many profound changes that, after that whole process wound down, I had little interest in dissecting it anymore.  This morning was truly a "random revelation"..it quite literally popped up out of nowhere.

[serious crayons]

Oh, and one other thing: there is some Eden-like imagery associated with their time on Brokeback, so Ennis' headlong, irreversible fall suggests Adam and Eve's "fall."

[Jeff Wrangler]

They had to be on a mountain because they had to be alone and isolated and pretty much inaccessible for what happened to them to happen.

And they never go back because Brokeback Mountain was their Eden, and once you are expelled from Eden, whether by God or by Joe Aguirre (in his order to bring 'em down), you can never go back. Ennis's sensation of being in a headlong, irreversible fall as he descends from the mountain is, I'm sure, intended to resonate with the Fall of Man from Paradise. 

[Front-Ranger]

To me, the offhand revelations are so hard-hitting because they're the closest that Ennis and Jack get to telling each other the truth. The cowboy way is to speak in code, saying the opposite of what you mean, or, if all else fails, hide behind your hat and be silent.

[Penthesilea]

I think this is a clue:

There were only the two of them on the mountain flying in the euphoric, bitter air, looking down on the hawk's back and the crawling lights of vehicles on the plain below, suspended above ordinary affairs and distant from tame ranch dogs barking in the dark hours.

On the mountain, they are suspended above the "ordinary affairs" of society, distant from "tameness." In other words, they're in the wild, in nature, removed from society's homophobia. The passage has an unworldly, almost heaven-like sound to it: flying, euphoric, looking down on a hawk ...

And then, when they left:

As they descended the slope Ennis felt he was in a slow-motion, but headlong, irreversible fall.

He's falling from their place above the world, back to society's "ordinary affairs" and homophobia, and the process is irreversible.

Like Katherine said: on a mountain, you stand both, figuratively and literally, above things.
Additionally you are literally nearer to heaven/the sky than anywhere else. Mountains are the places on our planet, where the earth and the sky (=heaven) are closest to each other. Everything points to Brokeback as Garden Eden.
The metapher of mountain works on so many levels, both figuratively and literally.

or, if all else fails, hide behind your hat and be silent.

That's Ennis to a T, isn't it?
Is Jack a cowboy then  ? I know we had this discussion before and I don't want to go back to it, but what you said fits so well to said discussion.

[Front-Ranger]

Is Jack a cowboy then  ?

No, he's a bullrider!! (And he ain't no calf roper either!!)

[mlewisusc]

Someone re-direct me if this is the wrong thread to post this in, but here goes: after catching part of BBM on cable tonight, I logged on to IMDB, and there was an old post by Clancy Pants Del Mar reposted by True Oracle of the Phoenix, regarding the post first tent scene talk between Jack and Ennis.  In light of what Clancy was saying (e.g., that Ennis controlled the entire relationship and refused to acknowledge love because of his fear, and Jack tolerated this because of his love/desire for Ennis), I realized that a very important difference between Story and Film could be drawn from this scene, specifically the timing of the scene, as follows: in Film, Ennis is setting the "one shot deal" limit on their relationship immediately after the first tent scene/first sexual encounter, and after the "one shot" scene, is seen struggling regarding whether or not to join Jack in the tent. 

In the Story, of course, they've had LOTS of non-verbal sexual encounters by the time they throw out these comments, in the middle of a sex act!

I wonder how this changes the analysis, if any, of Ennis's behavior?

As always, waiting for your insight . . .

And if there's a better place to put this, please just let me know. 

[Front-Ranger]

This topic started by our absent FRiend Mel is a perfectly good place to discuss this!! As so many things are, this is ambiguous in the story, but I don't think AP meant to say they said these things during sex. However, they are significant because they were the ONLY things said in reference to the sex: "...but saying not a goddamed thing except once Ennis said, 'I'm not no queer," and Jack jumped in with "Me neither. A one-shot-thing. Nobody's business but ours.'"

Clancypants is very perceptive and has great insight, but you have to take anybody's interpretation with a grain of salt because we all apply our personal agendas to the story.

In the movie, Ennis was much more hesitant and reticent, taking his cue from Jack IMO. In the story they were more equals.

[chelseagirl]

This topic started by our absent FRiend Mel is a perfectly good place to discuss this!! As so many things are, this is ambiguous in the story, but I don't think AP meant to say they said these things during sex. However, they are significant because they were the ONLY things said in reference to the sex: "...but saying not a goddamed thing except once Ennis said, 'I'm not no queer," and Jack jumped in with "Me neither. A one-shot-thing. Nobody's business but ours.'"

Clancypants is very perceptive and has great insight, but you have to take anybody's interpretation with a grain of salt because we all apply our personal agendas to the story.

In the movie, Ennis was much more hesitant and reticent, taking his cue from Jack IMO. In the story they were more equals.

I don't know if this what you're asking  but the question of power or control however one wants to look at it is slightly different from ss and the film, but just a little:

IMO: 

Though Jack made the first move that first night,  Ennis took over after that, which after I've watch the movie a few times, was to me the position these guys took, (and I don't mean sexually) but the roles they played after that.  You bring up a good point,  it was control, and Ennis needed to have it. 

 Ennis knew there would a second time, he wanted Jack again, but rules had to be set down, after all he wasn't "queer", and after all it was a one shot thing wasn't it?   

like I said this just my thoughts.