Bullying

[starboardlight]

It's hard to imagine something like that happening in the US, other than in gym class. We have to keep in mind that, that kind of punishment is common in schools outside the US. Being punish at all for honest mistakes is humiliating for any kid, whether it be standing in the corner with the dunce cap or made to do push ups. When I was a child in school in Thailand, we actually got hit on the hand with a cane when we would get answers wrong.

I do think the teacher went too far, but I'm curious to find out if the teacher realizes that. When she said it was a joke, did she sound like she was trying to console the boy? or was it more a brush off attitude? I wonder if she might realize she'd gone too far when the boy started crying. I think that's where you as a parent come in. You might try and have a talk with the teacher and see if that kind of thing is to be expected from her. Parents have to take more active role in schools and actually give input on how they expect their children to be educated.

[Lynne]

It's hard to imagine something like that happening in the US, other than in gym class. We have to keep in mind that, that kind of punishment is common in schools outside the US. Being punish at all for honest mistakes is humiliating for any kid, whether it be standing in the corner with the dunce cap or made to do push ups. When I was a child in school in Thailand, we actually got hit on the hand with a cane when we would get answers wrong.

I do think the teacher went too far, but I'm curious to find out if the teacher realizes that. When she said it was a joke, did she sound like she was trying to console the boy? or was it more a brush off attitude? I wonder if she might realize she'd gone too far when the boy started crying. I think that's where you as a parent come in. You might try and have a talk with the teacher and see if that kind of thing is to be expected from her. Parents have to take more active role in schools and actually give input on how they expect their children to be educated.

Starbie - interesting factoid about school discipline in Thailand!  What a barbaric concept to my way of thinking - physical punishment for getting an answer wrong?!?

This thread reminded me of an incident in 3rd grade in Roman Catholic school.  I was talking in line when I shouldn't have been and the male (non-priest) teacher thumped me on the head hard with his class ring.  It didn't bother me that much because I liked him as a teacher.  Needless to say, however, my mother had a cow.  The principal (a nun, Sister Mary Eileen) went ballistic -I can still hear her voice in my head.  'Mr. Totten, you DO NOT EVER strike these children!'  It stuck with me because I was always a bit fearful of the nuns - they somehow managed to instill a lot of respect, fear, awe by their very presence.

About the idea of 'mollycoddling' ... I guess I don't think defending your child against an uncaring school authority figure falls in that category, especially when they're young.  It's a parent's responsibilty to protect the child.  You have to pick and choose your battles, of course.  Ideally, you can demonstrate how to handle conflict effectively and they'll learn from you so that as they mature they'll be able to handle situations themselves.

[serious crayons]

It's a parent's responsibilty to protect the child.  You have to pick and choose your battles, of course.  Ideally, you can demonstrate how to handle conflict effectively and they'll learn from you so that as they mature they'll be able to handle situations themselves.

I've got quite a bit of first-hand experience with this, actually. My older son is briliant -- he gets perfect grades on all subjects, scores in the 99th percentile on all the standardized tests, was reading at a 12th grade level in fourth grade, has a better vocabulary than the president of the United States (OK, so that not a very high bar). He's also outgoing, good looking, assertive, charismatic, culturally savvy, socially fearless. So in many ways he's easy.

But behaviorally, he can be a huge pain in the (neck). I have gotten calls from every day care provider, classroom teacher, principal, gym, music and art teacher he's ever had. Sometimes on a weekly basis. He was supended from school in kindergarten. I never know what advice to give to the teacher about how to handle him, because he's just as difficult at home. (For the past year or so, he's been doing a little better, but he's still very very challenging at home.)

I don't know that I've ever disputed a teacher's complaint, or tried to claim "My son would never do such a thing." Because I know he would. I know he'd be tough to have in class -- a breeze academically, but one of the hardest kids to handle behaviorally. So even if my son has a completely different account of an event -- and he almost always does -- I tend to side with the teacher unless there's really strong evidence to the contrary, and even then I don't usually make any fuss about it. If my son complains, I remind him that in the real world he'll have to work with bosses he doesn't like, and sometimes he has to learn to get along with teachers he doesn't like.

But his teachers have always used discipline methods such as detentions, trips to the principal, isolation, etc. Never anything humiliating. My son would be hard to humiliate anyway; he's extremely thick skinned (one reason he's hard to control). But still. He did start at a new school last year and even he was a bit nervous. The example of the kid driven to tears on his first day, when he's trying really hard to like his new surroundings and make a good impression on his classmates, still makes me really mad.

[Lynne]

Wow, Katharine.  Thanks for sharing about your son.  I have no first hand parenting experience myself - I live vicariously through my friends who almost all have children now.  Also, just what my parents did or didn't do and the many ways the trauma of growing up influenced/inspired/scarred me .

I have to wonder if your older son is just bored because he's so intelligent and advanced and that's why he acts out?  (I'm sure you've thought of this, of course.)

I was a similar child academically but didn't act out as a rule because I was too intimidated, being the child of a ridiculously overbearing mother.  She kept transferring me from school to school - I went to 6 different schools from 1st thru 9th grade.  In 10th grade, I finally stood up to her, said absolutely not ever again; so I was at least able to spend high school in one place.

This is only relevant because Mom insisted I skip 5th grade which was pretty useless because the work still wasn't challenging.  Furthermore, from a social standpoint it was an absolute nightmare for me.  I had to take up tae kwon do to keep from getting my a$$ kicked on the playground pretty much on a daily basis.  The only redeeming factor was that I was getting old enough to involve myself in extracurricular activities to keep the boredom at bay....Childhood...it's amazing any of us survive it, huh? 

[injest]

It's hard to imagine something like that happening in the US, other than in gym class. We have to keep in mind that, that kind of punishment is common in schools outside the US. Being punish at all for honest mistakes is humiliating for any kid, whether it be standing in the corner with the dunce cap or made to do push ups. When I was a child in school in Thailand, we actually got hit on the hand with a cane when we would get answers wrong.

I do think the teacher went too far, but I'm curious to find out if the teacher realizes that. When she said it was a joke, did she sound like she was trying to console the boy? or was it more a brush off attitude? I wonder if she might realize she'd gone too far when the boy started crying. I think that's where you as a parent come in. You might try and have a talk with the teacher and see if that kind of thing is to be expected from her. Parents have to take more active role in schools and actually give input on how they expect their children to be educated.

When I was in the Third grade here in Texas, I had a teacher who would assign 20 questions a night. We had to copy the question and then answer them. If you missed one you would one swat with a board on your behind...one swat per wrong answer. She would a whole production out of it...she'd make you lean over your desk and rub the board all over your behind before she hit you. There was a boy who jumped up and ran out of the class. We never saw him again.