Author Topic: Why does Jack....?  (Read 4989 times)

Offline BBM-Cat

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • Brokeback Got Me Good
  • *****
  • Posts: 611
Why does Jack....?
« on: December 30, 2006, 03:15:03 am »
Ok, I thought it was only fair to have a 'Why does Jack' thread since there is a 'Why does Ennis' thread - unless, of course there is already one but I did not see one.

One thing that I keep thinking about is why, in one of the final camping scenes, when Ennis asks Jack if everything is 'normal' between he and Lureen and Jack just kind of nods (as if to imply, 'yeah, why wouldn't it be?'....) I really think Jack missed an opportunity to reassure Ennis about some of his fears. Because Jack gave the impression that things were 'normal' and Lureen did not 'suspect', that made Ennis feel even more uncomfortable. Especially, regarding Ennis' fears and paranoia that people 'knew'. Again, I wish Jack would have taken the opportunity to reassure Ennis about his thoughts and fears like: "yeah, sometimes I feel like at times the whole world knows too but then I remember that you're up here in WY and I'm in TX".  Or, something reassuring like that - did anyone else feel like that was a missed opportunity? ..not that there weren't plenty more in the story : )
Six-word Stories:  ~Jack: Lightning Flat, lightning love, flat denied   ~Ennis: Open space: flat tire, tire iron?

Offline Ellemeno

  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • ********
  • Posts: 15,367
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2006, 03:48:16 am »
Yeah, Jack wasn't at his usual warm-hearted best at that point.  He'd recently faced that Ennis was probably never going to agree to live together, had the shitty Thankasgiving with his father-in-law, and was lost in shallow financial concerns.  His heart was too wounded a place at that point, and he couldn't live in it.  He was more in his head.

Why does Jack tell Old Man Twist that he is bringing Ennis up to lick the ranch into shape, but never invite Ennis to do so?


Offline Brown Eyes

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • BetterMost Moderator
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,377
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #2 on: December 31, 2006, 04:34:38 pm »
I think Jack tells Ennis that everything's "normal" with Lureen for the same reason that in the later camping trip Ennis "brags" about dating the "waitress" (Cassie) and Jack makes up the story about the ranch foreman's wife.  They seem to have never given up the game of pretending that they "aren't queer" to one another.  As unnecessary as this all seems to be the longer the relationship goes on.  Jack also might say that things are normal with Lureen because he already doesn't want Ennis to suspect that he's had flings with other men (been to Mexico, etc.).

More on that conversation by the stream... I think Jack believes he's jumping on an opportunity to maybe convince Ennis to move one baby-step closer to living with him or closer to him.  As miscalucated as it might be... he may be trying to use this little opening to suggest the move to "maybe Texas."  But, you're right he doesnt' take the opportunity to reassure Ennis of his fears.

Clarissa, that's a good question about the invitation about Lightning Flat.  I think, though, that all the suggestions of moving in together might have (in Jack's mind) started with a trip to Lightning Flat.  Jack maybe assumed that if they both did get divorced and took the "plunge" together... they might have to do something like go up to Lightning Flat at least for a while until they worked some plans out.  If they got divorced they would both really be out in the cold (assuming that Jack wouldn't come away from that divorce with much money at all).  I remember a really amazing observation once (in some old thread here in Open Forum surely) about the ranch in Lightning Flat.  When Ennis pulls up to the house there's a second building (an old bunk house or shed or something) not far from the main house.  Someone once suggested that that house represented the house that Ennis and Jack could have shared together... but now it's decayed and falling apart from neglect.
 :'(
« Last Edit: December 31, 2006, 04:38:46 pm by atz75 »
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline welliwont

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • Brokeback Got Me Good
  • *****
  • Posts: 806
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #3 on: December 31, 2006, 04:36:48 pm »


Why does Jack tell Old Man Twist that he is bringing Ennis up to lick the ranch into shape, but never invite Ennis to do so?


Ahh Elle, you ask the toughest questions!  :o :o

I don't know the answer to this one, but if I had to guess.....   Is it because Jack is waiting waiting waiting for some little word from Ennis to show that he is moving forward, and coming closer to having the sweet life with Jack?  Every fishing trip Jack is waiting for a sign from Ennis?  And after every fishing trip he goes up to LF and tells his old man the same thing?  Jack, ever the optimist...  :'(



Then the clouds opened up and God said, "I hate you, Alfafa."

Offline Ellemeno

  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • ********
  • Posts: 15,367
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #4 on: December 31, 2006, 04:37:55 pm »
Amanda, pick the next Why does Jack....?  :)

Offline Brown Eyes

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • BetterMost Moderator
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,377
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #5 on: December 31, 2006, 04:43:38 pm »
Amanda, pick the next Why does Jack....?  :)


OK, sure enough.

Why does Jack pick that particular moment in the "prayer of thanks" camping trip to suggest the cow and calf operation?  I've always thought he was moving way too fast here (as cute and sweet as he is).  I mean they've just gotten back together. 
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline BBM-Cat

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • Brokeback Got Me Good
  • *****
  • Posts: 611
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #6 on: December 31, 2006, 11:11:15 pm »
Hi Amanda, thanks for your perspective on the discussion by the stream - that certainly seems to fit with Jack's and Ennis' pretense of heterosexuality - the lie that is built throughout their relationship. I liked your perspective of Jack trying to get Ennis to move to 'maybe Texas' - far from subtle, hunh? LOL.

Well I thought someone else should take a crack at your next Jack question but just wanted to comment. It's 3 hours to New Year's here in Texas - got to ring in the New Year right with a DVD showing of BBM. Happy New Year everyone!
Six-word Stories:  ~Jack: Lightning Flat, lightning love, flat denied   ~Ennis: Open space: flat tire, tire iron?

Offline BBM-Cat

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • Brokeback Got Me Good
  • *****
  • Posts: 611
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2007, 02:20:21 am »

OK, sure enough.

Why does Jack pick that particular moment in the "prayer of thanks" camping trip to suggest the cow and calf operation?  I've always thought he was moving way too fast here (as cute and sweet as he is).  I mean they've just gotten back together. 

Really good question - yes, it does seem rather fast. Apparently, presuming the idea had been on Jack's mind for quite awhile pre-reunion, perhaps one of those fleeting, "wouldn't-it-be-nice..." kinds of thoughts or daydreams, it seems he acted (or verbalized aloud, rather), his idea because it felt like the right moment. It was almost on impulse but not quite - there was certainly caution and hesitation in his voice before he broached the idea with Ennis, but there was also the sense that Jack had been formulating some kind of a plan for the two of them to be together – regardless of how haphazard or even unrealistic it might sound.

Jack certainly could not have predicted beforehand how well the reunion would go - it seems he ‘acted’ (verbalized his idea) - while the iron was hot so to speak. I think Jack desperately did not want to lose the connection with Ennis again after the four-year hiatus – I think he was hoping that the idea would appeal to Ennis as a way for them to be together always. (Darn Ennis’ cognitive controls!)  :)

Be interested to hear other answers to Amanda's question
Six-word Stories:  ~Jack: Lightning Flat, lightning love, flat denied   ~Ennis: Open space: flat tire, tire iron?

Offline Brown Eyes

  • BetterMost Supporter!
  • BetterMost Moderator
  • The BetterMost 10,000 Post Club
  • *****
  • Posts: 10,377
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2007, 11:34:23 pm »
I'll go ahead here for fear of seeming silly for trying to answer my own question....  I think that Jack's quick suggestion to live together may just be a natural extension of his personality.  When he wants something he tends to go right ahead to try to get it and he'll complain and complain if something isn't to his liking.  Maybe he thought he should suggest this while the moment was still really positive and Ennis was seeming to be so thoroughly content in the reunion anyway.  Oh, poor Jack.

Hey Bud, your turn to ask a "why does Jack...?" question!
 :D
the world was asleep to our latent fuss - bowie

Offline Katie77

  • BetterMost 5000+ Posts Club
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,998
  • Love is a force of Nature
Re: Why does Jack....?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2007, 07:16:41 am »
Before Jack says, "I miss you so much, I can hardly stand it"......he says "Truth is", then there is a long long pause.......

Why does he think so long before he says it.....was he actually gonna tell him the truth about him and Randall, or was he just thinking about whether he should say something so strong about his feelings?
Being happy doesn't mean everything is perfect.

It means you've decided to see beyond the imperfection