Author Topic: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...  (Read 15424 times)

Offline Kd5000

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ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« on: February 24, 2007, 09:40:48 pm »
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/zodiac/       :)

Excellent reviews from Variety and Hollywood Reporter.

Possible spoiler from a reviewer. :(

Quoting from VARIETY
"Playing the author of the book on which the film is based, Gyllenhaal carries the burden of the large structure capably and lightly. Starting as an almost naive foil for Avery's urbane cynicism, Graysmith ultimately sustains his obsession longer than anyone, and with endurance comes reward, even if his complete immersion costs him his second wife (Chloe Sevigny)." Was that a spoiler??


Offline opinionista

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2007, 06:24:07 pm »
I can't wait to see this movie! I wonder when is opening in Spain. Thanks for posting the link KD.
Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement. -Mark Twain.

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2007, 03:28:53 pm »
I'm seeing it this Friday night - get this - with the hubby, even!   :o   ;D

It's kind of part of my birthday gift extravaganza, since he screwed up *again* and scheduled himself to be flying on my actual birthday.  ::)

Hmmmm...  Maybe I can get a pre-season baseball game followed by a visit to Blue Martini out of him, too...

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Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2007, 03:33:51 pm »
Oh, and in light of those five glowing reviews, that person who saw a screening of it last week and posts that it "is not very good" must be a raving looney or idiot or both.  What - not enough explosions and flying body parts for ya?

 ::)

Like the one responder said, I think I'll take the critics' word over yours, thanks.  Especially given the fact that you said the following:  "(Jake)  tends to look like he's sleepwalking through his roles, and Zodiac is no different."

Huh-WHA?

Babe, either you and I aren't watching the same movies, or you're doing some serious drugs just beforehand.
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Offline Lumière

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2007, 03:44:43 pm »
Who gives a F about reviews anyway?  :P

If all the Zodiac reviews are bad, still won't change the fact that I am going to see it!  8)


Offline belbbmfan

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2007, 06:53:37 am »
I'm seeing it this Friday night - get this - with the hubby, even!   :o   ;D

It's kind of part of my birthday gift extravaganza, since he screwed up *again* and scheduled himself to be flying on my actual birthday.  ::)

Hmmmm...  Maybe I can get a pre-season baseball game followed by a visit to Blue Martini out of him, too...



Let us know what you think. The movie won't be released over here until May 9th   :(
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Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2007, 09:31:23 am »
Let us know what you think.

You won't have to ask me twice.  You all will be the first to know.  :)

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Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2007, 07:16:01 pm »
Run time is 2 hours 45 minutes!   :o  :D

Why couldn't BBM have been 2:45!  ???  >:(

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2007, 07:23:32 pm »
Run time is 2 hours 45 minutes!   :o  :D
Jesus H! This distinctly limits the probability of my seeing this in the theater. An intermission might make it more feasible and pleasant (whatever happened to those?).

Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2007, 07:29:28 pm »
Jesus H! This distinctly limits the probability of my seeing this in the theater.

Really?

moremojo

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2007, 07:33:43 pm »
Really?
I'm afraid so. Long running times are hard on me, and more and more movies these days are clocking in well over two hours. Now seeing these in home-entertainment formats is much less daunting, but in the theater, 2-hours + tends to scare me off.

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2007, 08:38:25 pm »
I don't mind a long movie if it holds my interest the entire time.  The Departed was about 2 hours and 40 minutes long, and that whizzed by.  And movies that others call "slow" don't bother me unless they're not furthering the narrative at all in one or more scenes.

Everything I've read about this one (yet I'm trying to avoid reading too much, ya know?) leads me to believe it's my cup o' tea.  The reviewers keep saying things like "intellectually stimulating," "makes you think," and "stays with you long afterwards."  I'm in.

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Offline delalluvia

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2007, 12:53:05 am »
Luckily long running times aren't a problem for me.  I've been to two movies that were so long they had intermissions - in this day and age! - one was 70 mm Lawrence of Arabia re-release at some art house and I don't recall the name of the other movie, but it was about Gettysburg.  Clocked in at 4 hours, I think.  We got an intermission at 2 hours.

Offline SFEnnisSF

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2007, 01:07:05 am »
I wish Brokeback Mountain was 3 hours long...  :D

(With the majority of the new 45 minutes being them up on the mountain, and in the Siesta Motel, and the third night in the tent!  :D  :D  :D )

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2007, 12:40:22 pm »
(With the majority of the new 45 minutes being them up on the mountain, and in the Siesta Motel, and the third night in the tent!  :D  :D  :D )
Now that's a running time I could live with!

Actually, some of my favorite films are long ones, including Jacques Rivette's Celine et Julie vont en bateau (well over three hours) and Andrei Tarkovsky's Solyaris. Long running times are hard on me, for a variety of reasons, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate a long film.

Offline Kd5000

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #15 on: March 01, 2007, 07:06:01 pm »
Now that's a running time I could live with!

Actually, some of my favorite films are long ones, including Jacques Rivette's Celine et Julie vont en bateau (well over three hours) and Andrei Tarkovsky's Solyaris. Long running times are hard on me, for a variety of reasons, but that doesn't mean I can't appreciate a long film.


Hey, I'm big fan of the Tarkovksy film SOLARIS.  The truncated Sodenberg version just didn't leave me thinking for days so to speak. 
Films are getting longer, they say on average..  One critic said something about how the camera just seems to linger for quite some type over the beautiful landscapes in BBM before anything happens. Fine with me. It set the mood. Just wish I had been able to see it in IMAX.   ;) 

Offline Meryl

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2007, 02:55:59 pm »
ZODIAC got a rave review from Jeffrey Lyons and Alison Bailes on "Reel Talk" on TV this morning.  They compared it in quality to "Silence of the Lambs" and said even though it's 2-1/2 hours long, they could have happily watched it longer.  Sounds like another hit for Jake!  8)
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Offline Kd5000

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2007, 03:13:04 pm »
Unfortunately, it only made USD 4,000,000 on Friday.   Do adult films have a prayer anymore or do they choose to watch things on dvd?.  It opened with good reviews.  I enjoyed the film. It seems ppl want popcorn films which offer escapism and a simplistic storyline.  This is not a feel-good film and you do have to pay attn as 99.5% of the audience stayed seated the whole time when I saw it yestereday.  Maybe ppl are renting the movies that scored big or were nominated for award season.  THE DEPARTED, BABEL are already out on DVD.  I really think the studios have made a mistake in getting ppl conditioned to the idea that it's going ALMOST straight to DVD, give it three months.

"Not good. That means it will make about 14 to 15 million this weekend. Will it make it to the 70 million budget. This movie will be like Fight Club. A boxoffice Flop but a great film."    I saw this posted on IMDB.com.   :(

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2007, 06:38:31 pm »
It's a shame Fight Club didn't do better.  I think it's Fincher's best film - I think it's better than Seven - much better.  I own it and watch it again every several months or so and it's still fresh.  It'll be a shame if this one follows suit.

But you know what?  People are stupid.  Largely, it's true.  They want to be "entertained," and then they want to go home and not have to think about it any more.  Hell, they'd rather not have to think about it while they're watching it if that can be helped.  I'll tell you what - as you and I just discussed privately, KD, there's a scene in this movie that's so disturbing, it keeps flashing across my mind when I least expect it and literally giving me a chill.  Brilliantly, devastatingly done.  I just asked my husband if it keeps coming back to him, too, and he goes, "OH yeah.  And thanks so much for reminding me."

I think it'll ultimately make back its costs and then some.  And FWIW, the people around us last night applauded when the credits started to roll, and were saying as they were walking out, "Wow.  That was GREAT."  I still just felt a little stunned.  Hmmmm...  Kinda like how I felt at the end of another movie after my first viewing of it...
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Offline delalluvia

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2007, 11:04:31 pm »
Just came from seeing it.

The movie was very very good.  Too bad it came out so early in the year.  It will probably be forgotten by awards time next year.

It's almost documentary style, sticks to the facts and rarely 'Hollywood-izes' anything.
POSSIBLE SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!   POSSIBLE SPOILERS!!!!!!!!  POSSIBLE SPOILERS!!!!!!!!!!!!





Jake's character's presence in the movie was pretty negligible for the first hour or so.  Made you wonder why he was even in the movie. Chloe Sveigny (sp?) was wasted in a role that was very brief and not pivotal at all.  Jake was much better when you knew nothing about him other than he was a father.  He was like this enigmatic presence, always hovering like a coiled spring, ready to explode into no-one-knows-what.  My friend was puzzled at Graysmith's obssessiveness.  He seemed to have no motive for getting obssessed.  I think it was just his character.  Described as a retard, obviously quiet, didn't smoke, didn't do drugs, didn't cuss and had been a 1st class Eagle scout.  Someone who takes on a project and takes it all the way to the end.  I think that was the clue.  He had a passion for puzzles and he got caught up in one.

What was the name of that blue drink?

And I haven't googled to try to find out, but is it just me?  Or BBM flavoring my thoughts? 

At the end, the children ask why he 'no longer sleeps with mommy', the Graysmiths end up divorced and the man - single man - stays in San Francisco and 'has a good relationship' with his children.  No word of remarrying.

Is it just me?   ???

Offline southendmd

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2007, 12:05:04 am »
Hey Del,

The blue drink with the umbrella is an Aqua Velva, reminiscent of the nasty aftershave of the same name.

I totally laughed when Jake's character received this drink.  After trying it, Robert Downey, Jr's character wanted one.  Then the table was littered with tulip glasses and paper parasols.

I found the recipe:  vodka and blue curacao.  Some include an infusion of mint.  Probably goes down easy.

I agree with you about Jake's character Robert:  why the obsession?  Why was he divorced the first time?  Another obsession ruin his marriage?  We are left to figure it out. 

Paul

Offline delalluvia

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2007, 01:00:08 am »
Hey Del,

The blue drink with the umbrella is an Aqua Velva, reminiscent of the nasty aftershave of the same name.

I totally laughed when Jake's character received this drink.  After trying it, Robert Downey, Jr's character wanted one.  Then the table was littered with tulip glasses and paper parasols.

I found the recipe:  vodka and blue curacao.  Some include an infusion of mint.  Probably goes down easy.

LOL!  :laugh:  Our audience cracked up too.  Thanks for the name, I couldn't remember it.  I remember all those all aqua velva commercials, though.  It sounds like a yummy drink, though I have an aversion to drinking anything blue.  ;D

Quote
I agree with you about Jake's character Robert:  why the obsession?  Why was he divorced the first time?  Another obsession ruin his marriage?  We are left to figure it out. 

Paul

Very much so.  I enjoyed that all of life's secrets aren't so easily solved.

Offline twistedude

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2007, 04:45:16 am »
I wasn't the least bit tempted to leave my seat, nor did I see anyne else doing so. I think it's all been said; here's a little button they were passing out to viewers: 
"We're each of us alone, to be sure. What can you do but hold your hand out in the dark?" --"Nine Lives," by Ursula K. Le Guin, from The Wind's Twelve Quarters

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2007, 10:02:13 am »
I had no trouble understanding why Robert became so obsessed.  I know a little bit about obsession myself, after all.  And in my case, there isn't even a puzzle to solve or a murderous rampage to stop.

I find myself wanting to know more about him, though.  Not so much so I can understand why he did all he did - I do understand that - but I just find him enigmatic and interesting in general.

And no, Del.  It isn't just you.  I thought I read or saw somewhere that he actually had three marriages that failed.  That's quite a few for a guy who doesn't drink (much) or smoke or cuss.
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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2007, 10:41:31 am »
Cross Post from the other Zodiac thread.  My Review.

At two hours and forty minutes without commercial breaks, "Zodiac" would have faired better as a CBS miniseries, with commercial breaks, than a feature film.  Director David Fincher seemes to have consciously toned down the imaginative muse that served him well in his other films.  The result was, despite moments of true thrill and fear, a laconic, drawn out and at times downright boring film.

I could immediately understand why the film treatment of Robert Graysmith's true-crime bestseller would be very difficult to translate into a film that could sustain the level of fear and entertainment that it needed in order to succeed.  The time period stretched over some twenty years, with periods when nothing happens.  Zodiacs own sporadic communications with the authorities could well have caused the collapse of this screenplay, which after the first hour leave the movie goer feeling like it was time to go to bed and watch the rest the next night.

While there were some excellent performances, and some brave attempts at excellent performances, the actors portraying the two main characters were the weak links in the film.  Both Mark Ruffalo as Inspector David Toschi, and Jake Gyllenhaal as San Francisco Chronicle political cartoonist, turned true-crime author Robert Graysmith, seemed miserably miscast. Neither actor were of sufficient age to carry off their respective roles, and in the case of Gyllenhaal, he appeared to de-age as his charectars obsession with Zodiac began destroying everything in his life.  There was very little in the way of flesh to his portrayal of Graysmith, which made it difficult to care about why he became so enthralled with the serial killer.  Ruffalo faired better as Toschi, in part, because much of his performance was paired with the ever entertaining Anthony Edwards as his investigating partner, who eventually requests a transfer off the case and out of the homicide department.  Stand out performances from Robert Downey Jr as the self-destrucitve Chronicle crime reporter Paul Avery, and John Carroll Lynch as the only real suspect in the killings kept me watching whenever they were on screen.

The screenplays largest fault was the far to quick fading of Toschi's obsession, and Graysmiths taking up of the investigation.  It was around the time that Toschi began to not care, that I also began to feel the same way.

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #25 on: March 04, 2007, 12:04:12 pm »
Wow.  Tell us what you really think, Scott.  :)

You make some good points, there, though.  I really found myself the most involved with Paul Avery, and the more I think about it, the more I have to admit it's mostly because of Robert Downey, Jr.'s portrayal of him.  In another actor's hands, I wouldn't have cared about him half as much.

Here's a review from the "Movie Mom" at Yahoo.  I like her because she generally nails the themes of the movies she reviews without giving too much away and, let's face it, because she usually agrees with me.  She liked it a lot more than Scott.  But again, what she seemed to like the most was Robert Downey, Jr.:


We still don't know for sure who was -- or is -- the California serial killer known as the Zodiac, the name he used in a series of letters he sent to San Francisco newspapers in the late 1960's and early 1970's. This movie is not about some big payoff. There are no "eureka" WHO moments and we don't get to see someone solve the puzzle and get a handshake from the mayor and the thanks of a victim's family. We don't get an "aha" WHY moment as we find out that it all began when Zodiac was a little boy and suffered some major trauma.

A puzzle is what it is. Zodiac sent not just taunting letters to the press; he sent four cryptograms, only one of which has ever been solved. While San Francisco's investigation is inactive, the other jurisdictions' files are still open.


This is not the story of the Zodiac, what he did and why. It is the story of what happened to three men whose lives were taken up with their efforts to answer those questions. A superb cast and an absorbing script make a frustratingly complex story accessible and keep even the nearly three-hour running time moving quickly.


Paul Avery (Robert Downey, Jr.) is the chain-smoking hard-drinking newspaper reporter who covered the story. Downey vibrates like a tuning fork, his offbeat rhythms responding to tones only he can hear. It is is heartbreaking to see the sensitivity that makes him a meticulous observer of the world he writes about begin to implode. The movie doesn't ask or answer whether the stress of being a possible target of Zodiac is what finally causes him to unravel or whether working on the story kept his fragile spirit together with a sense of purpose. It just shows us the toll that the story took on the man who happened to have the crime beat when the first letter came in.


David Toschi (Mark Ruffalo) and William Armstrong were the cops assigned to the case in San Francisco. They coordinated with Jack Mulanax (Elias Koteas) and Ken Narlow (Donal Logue), the police officers in the other regions where there were killings tied to the Zodiac. With literally thousands of suspects and no certainty about which crimes were committed by the Zodiac and which by copy-cats or unrelated killers, they are looking for one deadly needle in a haystack that could fill what was then called Candlestick Park.


And then there is Robert Graysmith (Jake Gyllenhaal). He's the newspaper's political cartoonist. It isn't his job to write about the case and it isn't his job to investigate it. And yet, there is something that draws him into it so deeply he will ruin his marriage to devote himself to a story that is twisted and terrible, with an evil genius of a bad guy who is, well, right out of the movies.


Director David Fincher (Fight Club, Panic Room) wisely makes this story not about the monster, but about our fascination with monsters. Like Avery, Toschi, and Graysmith, we are pulled into the puzzle, horrified, but tantalized, stimulated, drawn to the edge of what separates us from a human being who could commit such atrocities and then taunt the people who try to stop him. In his letters, Zodiac may have referred to the classic film The Most Dangerous Game, about a hunter who uses humans as his game -- in both senses of the word. He sees them as the only quarry worthy of him because they can truly test his skill. In a deeper sense, it is Avery, Toschi, and Graysmith who devote their lives to their own most dangerous game, tracking the Zodiac, who continues to elude them, searching for clues and patterns and meaning in a world where kids on lovers lane are killed by a man who dares the world to find him.


Parents should know that this is the story of a serial killer and there are graphic portrayals of some of the murders. Characters drink and smoke and one has some marijuana. A chain-smoking character also abuses alcohol. Characters use strong language and there are brief glimpses of pornography and references to child molestation. Some audience members will be disturbed by the themes of the story, which include serial killing and the impact on the lives and families of those who are involved in investigating the murders.


Families who see this movie should talk about why the story was so important to Graysmith and what he sacrificed in order to be able to pursue it.


Viewers who appreciate this movie will also like the classic Call Northside 777 starring Jimmy Stewart, also based on a real-life case of a reporter's investigation of a murder. And they will enjoy other movies about murders who communicate with journalists or policemen, including Dirty Harry (inspired by the Zodiac case and briefly glimpsed in this film), The Mean Season, and No Way to Treat a Lady. Viewers who would like to find out more about the Zodiac case (and perhaps try to solve some of the still-unsolved coded messages) should read Zodiac and "This Is the Zodiac Speaking": Into the Mind of a Serial Killer. And they might like to take a look at the classic movie that allegedly influenced or inspired the Zodiac killer, The Most Dangerous Game.


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Offline delalluvia

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #26 on: March 04, 2007, 07:19:32 pm »

I really found myself the most involved with Paul Avery, and the more I think about it, the more I have to admit it's mostly because of Robert Downey, Jr.'s portrayal of him.  In another actor's hands, I wouldn't have cared about him half as much.

I was very impressed with all the acting, personally.  After a while, like BBM, I felt like I was actually watching real people and not actors.  Robert Downey was awesome, but the role wasn't much of a stretch for him, was it?  He's essentially playing himself.  His pathos is appealing, because he is.  He garnered a lot of sympathy from people with his struggles with his real life issues.

Offline MaineWriter

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #27 on: March 04, 2007, 07:35:17 pm »

Viewers who appreciate this movie will also like the classic Call Northside 777 starring Jimmy Stewart, also based on a real-life case of a reporter's investigation of a murder. And they will enjoy other movies about murders who communicate with journalists or policemen, including Dirty Harry (inspired by the Zodiac case and briefly glimpsed in this film), The Mean Season, and No Way to Treat a Lady. Viewers who would like to find out more about the Zodiac case (and perhaps try to solve some of the still-unsolved coded messages) should read Zodiac and "This Is the Zodiac Speaking": Into the Mind of a Serial Killer. And they might like to take a look at the classic movie that allegedly influenced or inspired the Zodiac killer, The Most Dangerous Game.



I also read in the review at Pajiba (one of my favorite review sites: http://www.pajiba.com/zodiac.htm) that at the time the investigation was getting going, David Toschi (Mark Ruffalo) was a local celebrity as he had inspired Steve McQueen's Bullitt. So that might be another movie to add to the DVD list. We rented Dirty Harry to watch tonight.

L

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Offline coffeecat33

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #28 on: March 04, 2007, 08:15:23 pm »
I just got home from seeing "Zodiac." I have to say, I think Jake's eyelashes should have gotten separate billing.

Technically, the movie was good, including the acting; all 2 hours 45 min held my interest. However by the time the movie ended and that one guy was talking to the other guy I had to think, Now who are these guys? So when he identified the man it wasn't very dramatic. Because they never identified or caught the Zodiac killer, there is no "done-done-done" music to announce "this is the killer."

cc33

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #29 on: March 04, 2007, 08:37:42 pm »
I also read in the review at Pajiba (one of my favorite review sites: http://www.pajiba.com/zodiac.htm) that at the time the investigation was getting going, David Toschi (Mark Ruffalo) was a local celebrity as he had inspired Steve McQueen's Bullitt. So that might be another movie to add to the DVD list. We rented Dirty Harry to watch tonight.

I agree with this review.  I like pajiba a lot, too, Leslie.  Again usually because they get the themes without giving too much away and because they usually agree with me.  He was also dead on, by the way (and no pun intended), about how that lake scene would make a fine short subject.
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Offline MaineWriter

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #30 on: March 04, 2007, 09:12:36 pm »
I agree with this review.  I like pajiba a lot, too, Leslie.  Again usually because they get the themes without giving too much away and because they usually agree with me.  He was also dead on, by the way (and no pun intended), about how that lake scene would make a fine short subject.

Barb, girlfriend...

When you and I finally get together, you can drink an Aqua Velva, I'll have an unoaked chardonnay and we will agree on everything....

L
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Offline Brokeback_Dev

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #31 on: March 04, 2007, 09:40:29 pm »





Paul Avery (Robert Downey, Jr.) is the chain-smoking hard-drinking newspaper reporter who covered the story. Downey vibrates like a tuning fork, his offbeat rhythms responding to tones only he can hear. It is is heartbreaking to see the sensitivity that makes him a meticulous observer of the world he writes about begin to implode. The movie doesn't ask or answer whether the stress of being a possible target of Zodiac is what finally causes him to unravel or whether working on the story kept his fragile spirit together with a sense of purpose. It just shows us the toll that the story took on the man who happened to have the crime beat when the first letter came in.







Paul Avery also snorted cocaine at the bar where he was drinking the aqua velvets with Graysmith.  Its hard to catch him doing it as he used a spoon, popular back in the day.  You see him snorting the coke from the spoon in the sequence after he and Graysmith move to the booth, the table littered with empty and half emptied glasses of aqua velva.  Just my little side note

Offline MaineWriter

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #32 on: March 04, 2007, 09:47:42 pm »
Paul Avery also snorted cocaine at the bar where he was drinking the aqua velvets with Graysmith.  Its hard to catch him doing it as he used a spoon, popular back in the day.  You see him snorting the coke from the spoon in the sequence after he and Graysmith move to the booth, the table littered with empty and half emptied glasses of aqua velva.  Just my little side note

Thanks, Dev...little tidbits for my next viewing...
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Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #33 on: March 04, 2007, 11:19:17 pm »
I noticed that, too, Dev.  But I didn't put two and two together that the Movie Mom missed it.  Good call!

And yes, Leslie, I'll gladly drink the Aqua Velvas - vodka and Blue Curacao are my friends.  Well, until they make me good and stupid.  Ah, then they're still my friends.

Reminds me of a story.  ;)

One time Ed and I went to Ruby Tuesday for a quick Saturday night dinner - a "power graze" as he called it at their salad bar.  I was feeling peckish, so when the waiter came around and asked me if I'd like to try their special "Blue Whale Martini" while he was in the restroom, I said "Why not?"  They brought me out this very blue drink in, I kid you not, a fish bowl.  Umbrellas and fruit galore.  Ed comes out just after he'd deposited it in front of me.  We still talk about it.

(And it was goooooood, by the way.)
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Offline delalluvia

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #34 on: March 04, 2007, 11:44:35 pm »
the waiter came around and asked me if I'd like to try their special "Blue Whale Martini" while he was in the restroom, I said "Why not?"  They brought me out this very blue drink in, I kid you not, a fish bowl.  Umbrellas and fruit galore.  Ed comes out just after he'd deposited it in front of me.  We still talk about it.

(And it was goooooood, by the way.)

I forgot what the drink was - surprise surprise - but the Hula Hut in Austin on the river serves a drink that comes in a fishbowl as well.  By the time my friend and I polished off half of it, we left the restaurant, stealing a platter of beans and my friend had stuck the fishbowl in her purse.  When we got to the club, her ID was floating in it.

Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #35 on: March 05, 2007, 04:14:12 pm »

While there were some excellent performances, and some brave attempts at excellent performances, the actors portraying the two main characters were the weak links in the film.  Both Mark Ruffalo as Inspector David Toschi, and Jake Gyllenhaal as San Francisco Chronicle political cartoonist, turned true-crime author Robert Graysmith, seemed miserably miscast. Neither actor were of sufficient age to carry off their respective roles, and in the case of Gyllenhaal, he appeared to de-age as his charectars obsession with Zodiac began destroying everything in his life.

I have to quibble with this.  While I agree that they didn't age Jake as effectively as they did Downey, Jr. and Ruffalo, he was indeed old enough to carry off the role.  Robert Graysmith was 24 when the Chronicle received the Zodiac's first letter.  Jake was 25 when he filmed this, and Toschi was in his 30s, as is Ruffalo.


There was very little in the way of flesh to his portrayal of Graysmith, which made it difficult to care about why he became so enthralled with the serial killer.  Ruffalo faired better as Toschi, in part, because much of his performance was paired with the ever entertaining Anthony Edwards as his investigating partner, who eventually requests a transfer off the case and out of the homicide department.  Stand out performances from Robert Downey Jr as the self-destrucitve Chronicle crime reporter Paul Avery, and John Carroll Lynch as the only real suspect in the killings kept me watching whenever they were on screen.

On this count, I don't think Graysmith has to have a reason for becoming obsessed with this case other than that he is an obsessive person.  Why are all of us here (perhaps present company excluded?) obsessed with Brokeback Mountain?  We've never really been able to find a common thread.  It just moved us for some reason that can't always be quantified and here we still are.

I did read an interesting interview of Graysmith, though, where when asked whether he was a reporter at the time, he said something like he wasn't even a writer but a political cartoonist, and he was a political cartoonist partly because he wanted to be a painter and a sculptor and many of the great American painters had started out as political cartoonists and partly because he thought that by being a political cartoonist, he could change things with his art - he could have a politician removed from office, for example.  He said that when the Zodiac's ciphers started coming, he was impressed by his artistic skill - how he had drawn all those symbols perfectly symmetrically spaced and sized without a ruler.  And he was impressed by the idea that this man was using his artistic skill to scare people while he was trying to use his to help people.

Do you think if they had spelled all this out in the movie, you'd have understood his obsession better?  To me, it was understandable.  The problem I had with the performance, and it pains me to say this, was that I don't think Jake pulled off, as Jeremy Fox at Pajiba said, "the unnerving intensity of the truly obsessed."  It bothers me that he didn't pull this off because I know he can.  He did it in "Donnie Darko" brilliantly, and he did it in "Jarhead" as well.  So why not here?  I have to say I was disappointed in his performance because I didn't feel that intensity this time.  He was good, don't get me wrong.  He is always good.  But he just wasn't quite at his best.
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Offline ednbarby

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #36 on: March 05, 2007, 08:24:17 pm »
Hmmmm...  The plot thickens.  This just in: Robert Graysmith and other people from the period think Jake "nailed it" playing him.  Here's the youtube interview of Jake and the other Mr. G. on The Today Show from this past Saturday.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xlDZ_3td1a8

"I didn't think I was obsessed until this man portrayed me."  Spoken like a true obsessive.  ;)

Just goes to show what the heck I know.

How 'bout that waistcoat, by the way?  Oh, to see that sans jacket...

« Last Edit: March 05, 2007, 08:28:53 pm by ednbarby »
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Offline oilgun

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #37 on: March 05, 2007, 09:37:43 pm »
Thanks for introducing me to the Pajiba site folks!  (Any site that titles its article about Anne Coulter's latest idiocy, Transvestite Calls Candidate Faggot will definitely get bookmarked by me, lol!)

I too saw Zodiac and I pretty much agree with the Pajiba review.  I din't find the film long at all, I was engrossed throughout.  (Well, almost, there was a fire alarm at the theatre about 20 minutes before the end.  The screen went dark and we sat there for about 15 minutes before they re-started the film.  It kinda took away from the suspense but I got a free pass out of it at least.)

What really struck me about the movie, and the Pagiba reviewer mentions it as well, is how flawlessly the era is depicted.  It often feels like a movie that was actually filmed in the seventies, that's how good it is.

Offline MaineWriter

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Re: ZODIAC at 100% on Rottentomatoes.com with five reviews...
« Reply #38 on: March 05, 2007, 11:00:50 pm »
Oilgun,

Anyone I can turn on to Pajiba is a friend of mine. I love that site.

I agree...the period details are what kept me watching. How about the scene with Det. Toschi's watch....the watchband with those clip on snappy thingy's (I don't know how else to describe it)...I wore the same damn thing but mine was blue, not brown.

L
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