Jake's father was a gay man?

[David In Indy]

I wonder.

Seriously.

Since when did you know a GAY MAN to hocker into a spitoon?

It just ain't natural, I tell ye! 

Nope! No decent gay man would EVER do such a thing.

[brokebackjack]

lmao

true

I have never known a gay man to spit into anything except a handkerchief....except for gay construction workers who spit on the floor.

but  a cup at dinner table, what a faux pas!

[Artiste]

Thanks Ross In Illinois!

Your comment and description of Mr. John Twist (Jack's father) is endearing, I find!!

Your words:
The way I see it  Jack Twist sr loved his son. He refused to give him up to the Mountain and that proves that to me. I think what you saw in the movie was a "broken man" un happy with his life with no way out thats all. Holding on to Jacks ashes was the only power he had left.
...

I think that too as you do!! Do you think that Jack's father is trying to hold on too to Ennis ??

Awaiting your news,

hugs!!
 

[Artiste]

Thanks brokebackjack!!

Your comment is difficult for me!! I am not an expert as you are in this, so I re-read your thought:
He didn't give a damned about jack or Jack's ashes. He knew what his son wanted and refused it.It was the mother who cared.

And he refused....because he wanted to. And was 'a terrible old man.'
...

You say that Jack's father knew what Jack wanted?? What do you mean... please describe that??

Hugs!!

[brokebackjack]

Well, Jack's wishes as expressed to his wife were that he be not buried, but cremated. Because Jack had told her that, SHE had sent half of those ashes up to his family in Lightening Flat, telling them that Jack wanted to have those ashes scattered on Brokeback Mountain.

Lureen kept half of Jack's ashes in Texas, erecting a 'grave stone' for her husband in Childress.

This is why Ennis visited the Twists, who knew through Lureen what Jack wanted. He wanted to express sympathy to his parents, and take the ashes to scatter on the mountain, giving Jack his final wish.

The old man bitterly and angrily refused, denying his son's  wish; even after death, Jack did not get what he wanted. Even dead, he had 'it' taken from him.

The entire scene is a total emotional devastation...

[Artiste]

Thanks brokenbackjack (I was going to say Ennis! Wow!)

As your description is very understandable, I am very pleased to read it, and thanks very much!!

You say this concerning Jack's father when he refuses Ennis's first visit after Jack's death:
The old man bitterly and angrily refused, denying his son's  wish; even after death, Jack did not get what he wanted. Even dead, he had 'it' taken from him.
...

Do you think that Ennis went back a second time and asked for some or all that the Twist's parents had of the half of Jack's ashes??

Dare I ask?

Hugs!!

[RossInIllinois]

Thanks Ross In Illinois!

Your comment and description of Mr. John Twist (Jack's father) is endearing, I find!!

Your words:
The way I see it  Jack Twist sr loved his son. He refused to give him up to the Mountain and that proves that to me. I think what you saw in the movie was a "broken man" un happy with his life with no way out thats all. Holding on to Jacks ashes was the only power he had left.
...

I think that too as you do!! Do you think that Jack's father is trying to hold on too to Ennis ??

Awaiting your news,

hugs!!
 

Im not sure if Jacks father was trying to hold on to Ennis but the Twists were welcoming of him for sure. The old man might even have been slightly bitter to Ennis for not coming to his ranch and making a home there with his son. The fact they let him take Jacks belongings without question tells me they knew the situation quite clear. He was also asked to come back any time. 

[Artiste]

Thanks RossInIllinois!!

I do agree with you that Mr. John Twist likely had wanted that Ennis come before that time, with Jack at Mr. and Mrs. John Twist's home!! I think that!

You say:
Im not sure if Jacks father was trying to hold on to Ennis but the Twists were welcoming of him for sure. The old man might even have been slightly bitter to Ennis for not coming to his ranch and making a home there with his son. The fact they let him take Jacks belongings without question tells me they knew the situation quite clear. He was also asked to come back any time.
...

I say that it could very well be that Mr. John Twist wanted to hold on to Ennis, because he knew that Ennis was a decent man who had and still love his son Jack Twist!! That was John Twist's way of telling Ennis off, man to man, of not having come to stay with Jack at the Mr. and Mrs. John Twist's home, in order to make it his home too as two lovers, maybe?? Mr. John Twist does stress this, it seems to me, that Jack had said that he wanted to Ennis to come, that must have been mentioned to Mr. and Mrs. John Twist many, many times by Jack in those 20 years!! ??

You are right that both Mr. and Mrs. John Twist let Ennis leave with Jack's belongings like wiht that shirt, was it?
They either or both could have refused that
Ennis brought back with him either of the shirts!!

As civil as they were, Mr. and Mrs. John Twist did allow Ennis into the house, even upstairs alone in Jack's room!! That to me was a lovable act by both of Jack's parents, since they knew that Jack and Ennis were best pals, working buddies, and likely too as known lovers!! The movie scene seems to indicate that by all the actors!! Does Annie's story do so to that extent??


Awaiting your news,

hugs!!

[brokebackjack]

Im not sure if Jacks father was trying to hold on to Ennis but the Twists were welcoming of him for sure. The old man might even have been slightly bitter to Ennis for not coming to his ranch and making a home there with his son. The fact they let him take Jacks belongings without question tells me they knew the situation quite clear. He was also asked to come back any time. 

Ross, look at the scene again; as Ennis passes by Jack's father he withdraws the shirts AWAY from John Twist in fear that he might say NO, you can't have them.. The mother nods-- she set it up, knew those shirts were in the closet. The closet door was also opened FOR Ennis as if she was leading him to the shirts. Plus, SHE invited him to go to Jack's room, not the father who denied him a wish as expressed by his dead son's own WIFE. Why? Because he didn't WANT to. Look also at what Mrs Twist is wearing; her clothes are a deliberate echo of the colors, etc., of Jack and Ennis' Brokeback shirts...and she had a look of what could only be describes as horror as her husband meanly denied his son's wish to rest on Brokeback. SHE told him to come again, not the father.

Whatever his motive, this is the same man who urinated all over his own son at age 4. He has lost none of his angry meanness. None of it. Some forget, if they had come to that ranch they would have been doing him a FAVOR and it's quite obvious he would have accepted the help while making it as unpleasant for both as possible. That comes through in short story AND film, loud and clear.

[RossInIllinois]

Ross, look at the scene again; as Ennis passes by Jack's father he withdraws the shirts AWAY from John Twist in fear that he might say NO, you can't have them.. The mother nods-- she set it up, knew those shirts were in the closet. The closet door was also opened FOR Ennis as if she was leading him to the shirts. Plus, SHE invited him to go to Jack's room, not the father who denied him a wish as expressed by his dead son's own WIFE. Why? Because he didn't WANT to. Look also at what Mrs Twist is wearing; her clothes are a deliberate echo of the colors, etc., of Jack and Ennis' Brokeback shirts...and she had a look of what could only be describes as horror as her husband meanly denied his son's wish to rest on Brokeback. SHE told him to come again, not the father.

Whatever his motive, this is the same man who urinated all over his own son at age 4. He has lost none of his angry meanness. None of it. Some forget, if they had come to that ranch they would have been doing him a FAVOR and it's quite obvious he would have accepted the help while making it as unpleasant for both as possible. That comes through in short story AND film, loud and clear.

I disagree, The shirts were placed in the bag right in front of old man Twist, The movie bends things a little. Go read Annie Proulx's short once again for that's the true version of the story. 

http://home.earthlink.net/~chicagoblt/broke.htm