Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
TOTW 01/08: Do you think Jack was murdered or was it an accident?
Brown Eyes:
--- Quote from: Artiste on January 14, 2008, 01:12:17 am ---
Will that prove Jack was murdered??
Hugs!!
--- End quote ---
I don't think there's any way to prove whether Jack died in an accident or whether he was murdered. That's why this question is so endlessly fascinating. We only know what we think, what Ennis believes and what Lureen says. Neither the film nor the story gives us enough evidence to prove anything.
Artiste:
Thanks atz75!
I think that we know more than what we think... surely.
And that (as extentions) become a story to be more full-filled!!
More detective works needed... too with what we have now even with the present Annie book and BM movie!!
Hugs!!
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: brokeplex on January 14, 2008, 01:09:58 am ---I agree with what you have just said. This particular fictional plot lends itself to ambiguity, especially in the scene where Ennis learns the news of Jack's death. My statement above was not meant to be taken that I believed that one MUST believe that Jack was murdered or one is insensitive to gay bashings. Far from it.
--- End quote ---
Thanks, brokeplex. My statement wasn't a direct response to your post. But I do think generally there is a tendency to argue this issue on the basis of whether or not anti-gay violence is common in real life ... and, conversely, whether tire-blow-up accidents are common. Those are both interesting springboards for discussion, but I don't think either is evidence of what Annie Proulx had in mind.
Penthesilea:
Some intermediate poll results after this topic has been in the focus for a week:
. 50 people voted, that's a lot. Thank you!
. I divided the votes in three groups:
* 23 people believe (to a higher or lesser extent) that Jack was murdered. That's almost half of the voters.
* 15 people believe (to a higher or lesser extent) that Jack died in an accident. That's 28%, less than a third.
* 7 people don't know (due to different reasons). That's 14%
. 21 people believe we are not supposed to know. That's the single answer with the most votes and of course it overlaps with other groups.
Since I don't claim this to be any serious science, I think it's fair to generalize that half of the BetterMost Brokies believe Jack was murdered, and the other half believes something else.
Although this question is no longer the TOTW, you're welcome to continue the discussion or pick it up again sometime later.
The poll also stays open to new voters or to people who want to change their vote at a later date.
moremojo:
--- Quote from: brokeplex on January 13, 2008, 05:26:40 pm ---Now, mostly everywhere, all of the time, cops are the good guys trying to protect the rest of us against the violent and the lawless.
--- End quote ---
Cops are not always the good guys, and racism, sexism, and homophobia do persist in various police forces around the country. Police entrapment in public parks and men's rooms still goes on--the Larry Craig incident has some flavor of entrapment (though that doesn't excuse Craig's behavior).
A good friend of mine was entrapped in a sting operation in a public park in Austin, where the undercover police officer approached him and initiated a sexually suggestive conversation. When my friend indicated verbal interest (no profanity, no exposure, not even the shaking of hands), other uniformed officers who had been hiding in the bush jumped out, tackled and tasered my friend, and arrested him on charges of public lewdness. The charges against my friend were eventually dropped, but in the meantime his face and name had been exposed on the local TV news and he was forced to tender his resignation from his job. I for one am still angry at the Austin Police Department for this egregious abuse of power.
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