Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
Why is the "dozy embrace" in the film?
dly64:
--- Quote from: atz75 on July 27, 2006, 12:10:00 am ---In any case, the definitions for "embrace" seem quite poetic when we think about our boys. "Hold" contains within it some more problematic meanings. The more I read the definitions of "hold" the more disturbing it actually is to think of it as being part of a marriage ceremony (a context noted in an earlier post)- since its main meanings have to do with possession, physical containment and control - even repression. In a way, the choice of the word "embrace" seems to be a pretty direct word to choose to convey the idea of a sweet hug. It seems like a much less complex word and a more unproblematically romantic word.
--- End quote ---
Amanda – the sad thing is, I read those definitions previously and found that “hold” was more permanent, not so temporary. (What does that say about me?) But, I see your point and the others’. “Embrace” is a much more affectionate term.
--- Quote from: latjoreme on July 27, 2006, 01:38:08 am ---Very good point, Mel. Although I'd argue that those are different kinds of examples. When Ennis sees the tent coming down, his look to me is purely about disappointment over having to part with Jack prematurely, not discomfort about their relationship itself. Same thing in the motel; he's sad that the happiness with Jack can't last. But in the cow-and-calf scene and the post-divorce "kiss me" moment -- as well as the "why don't you move to Texas" scene -- his reaction more clearly shows him feeling that Jack is coming on too strong.
As long as their relationship stays status quo and sticks to Ennis' rules, he's happy when they're together. Even in those last scenes he seems very content. There's no doubt that Ennis was uncomfortable about the fact that he was in a relationship with a man. But he didn't let those doubts affect his affectionate behavior toward Jack, except on those occasions when Jack tried to push their relationship to a different level.
--- End quote ---
Their relationship on the mountain was different than post-mountain. What I mean by this is that, yes, Ennis was unable to face the reality that this was a man he loved. What they had on BBM, however, was freedom. It implies in the film (it is more explicitly stated in the story) that they started having sex only at night in the tent and then moved it outside in “full daylight”. At their reunion, their passion for each other is intense. Untypical of Ennis, he can’t wait to kiss Jack so he pushes Jack into the stairwell. It is important to note one thing …. after they have stopped kissing and Jack’s hand is still holding Ennis, Ennis pulls the arm down. Ennis gives Jack an affectionate nuzzle, but after that point Ennis never takes the risk again to be seen with Jack publicly.
When Jack comes to see Ennis post divorce, there are a few things that make Ennis uncomfortable. One is that Jack has come to see him at his residence. You can see Ennis’ paranoia when the pickup drives by. The second thing is that Jack wants to kiss Ennis. Notice this time that Ennis pulls Jack’s arm down and backs away (which is a contrast to the nuzzle at the time of their reunion).
I bring all of this up because I don’t think Ennis believes Jack is coming on too strong (except for the Texas conversation …). I think it all lies in Ennis’ childhood memory of seeing a dismembered and mutilated Earl. He doesn’t have a life with Jack because he is homophobic and full of fear. This leads to Ennis’ mantra for the remainder of their relationship:
“… we’re around each other and this thing grabs hold of us again in the wrong place, at the wrong time, and we’re dead ….
Two guys livin’ together? No way. We can get together once in a while way out in the middle of nowhere, but …”
Ennis remains affectionate and vulnerable towards Jack, but is unable to give himself in the way that Jack craves.
nakymaton:
--- Quote from: dly64 on July 27, 2006, 10:07:08 am ---When Jack comes to see Ennis post divorce, there are a few things that make Ennis uncomfortable. One is that Jack has come to see him at his residence. You can see Ennis’ paranoia when the pickup drives by. The second thing is that Jack wants to kiss Ennis. Notice this time that Ennis pulls Jack’s arm down and backs away (which is a contrast to the nuzzle at the time of their reunion).
I bring all of this up because I don’t think Ennis believes Jack is coming on too strong (except for the Texas conversation …). I think it all lies in Ennis’ childhood memory of seeing a dismembered and mutilated Earl. He doesn’t have a life with Jack because he is homophobic and full of fear.
--- End quote ---
Yeah, there are a lot of things in the post-divorce scene that hit Ennis's low startle point. (I shortened it way too much by just mentioning Jack's attempt to kiss Ennis.) Jack at Ennis's house, Ennis's daughters sitting there in Ennis's truck, those ten people Jack asked where Ennis had gone, that white truck that goes by... all of those would make Ennis feel very unsafe out there in his driveway. I think Jack was too elated about what he thought Ennis had meant in that postcard to realize that Ennis's driveway wasn't the middle of nowhere, at least not to Ennis.
I don't think that Ennis's peaceful look is the result of being in control of the situation. I see it as moments when Ennis isn't thinking about what he's supposed to be, or about what could happen... moments when Ennis simply IS. (I'm imagining something like the state that one is supposed to try to acheive in Zen meditation, I guess.)
serious crayons:
--- Quote from: dly64 on July 27, 2006, 10:07:08 am ---I bring all of this up because I don’t think Ennis believes Jack is coming on too strong (except for the Texas conversation …). I think it all lies in Ennis’ childhood memory of seeing a dismembered and mutilated Earl.
--- End quote ---
Well, I think he also believes Jack is coming on too strong in the cow-and-calf scene -- when I say "coming on too strong," I mean Ennis feels he's trying to push the relationship to a level that makes Ennis uncomfortable.
In the post divorce scene, it's true that Ennis shies away at a number of points, several of them innocuous, like the white truck and Jack asking the 10 people. (And somebody pointed out that, by the same token, 90 percent of the people in town don't pay much attention to Ennis' business.)
But I'll have to say I guess I can understand why Ennis would hesitate to kiss Jack in front of his daughters. For reasons that go even beyond homophobia.
jpwagoneer1964:
--- Quote from: latjoreme on July 27, 2006, 12:49:01 pm ---Well, I think he also believes Jack is coming on too strong in the cow-and-calf scene -- when I say "coming on too strong," I mean Ennis feels he's trying to push the relationship to a level that makes Ennis uncomfortable.
--- End quote ---
There is a look Ennis gives at the end of "cow calf operation..." just as Jack touches his ear like 'I know I wish we could but...' or 'You only make it worse when you reach for me, that we cant be together.'
dly64:
--- Quote from: nakymaton on July 27, 2006, 12:12:33 pm ---I don't think that Ennis's peaceful look is the result of being in control of the situation. I see it as moments when Ennis isn't thinking about what he's supposed to be, or about what could happen... moments when Ennis simply IS.
--- End quote ---
I agree. The truth is, Ennis mostly just “IS” while on BBM … before the “real world” stripped him of his inhibitions and before he had domestic responsibilities. What they could have had just breaks me in two every time I think about it!
--- Quote from: latjoreme on July 27, 2006, 12:49:01 pm ---Well, I think he also believes Jack is coming on too strong in the cow-and-calf scene -- when I say "coming on too strong," I mean Ennis feels he's trying to push the relationship to a level that makes Ennis uncomfortable.
--- End quote ---
Alright … that makes more sense to me.
--- Quote from: latjoreme on July 27, 2006, 12:49:01 pm ---In the post divorce scene, it's true that Ennis shies away at a number of points, several of them innocuous, like the white truck and Jack asking the 10 people. (And somebody pointed out that, by the same token, 90 percent of the people in town don't pay much attention to Ennis' business.)
But I'll have to say I guess I can understand why Ennis would hesitate to kiss Jack in front of his daughters. For reasons that go even beyond homophobia.
--- End quote ---
Yeah … I can see that, too. The girls look a little puzzled as to who this guy is (even though I figure Alma, Jr. sort of figured it out when she got older).
OT: I happened to think of this while I was writing. The following exchange has always puzzled me. Unsure why, but it does. Alma, Jr. and Cassie have this dialogue in the bar:
Cassie: …. Your daddy ever gonna see fit to settle down again?
Alma, Jr. Don’t know … Maybe he’s not the marrying kind.
Cassie: You don’t think so? Or you don’t think I’m the one for him?
Alma, Jr. You’re good enough.
Cassie: You don’t say much, but you get your point across.
What is really being said here? I have always thought that Alma, Jr. figures that Ennis is gay and has no idea why he is wasting time with this person. I just don’t know. Any thoughts?
--- Quote from: jpwagoneer1964 on July 27, 2006, 12:56:03 pm ---There is a look Ennis gives at the end of "cow calf operation..." just as Jack touches his ear like 'I know I wish we could but...' or 'You only make it worse when you reach for me, that we cant be together.'
--- End quote ---
Are you saying that Ennis has inner turmoil? If that is the case, yes. Every time they get together and have to say goodbye, I think it is tense. Secretly does Ennis want a life with Jack? I think so … but that is the romantic in me again.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version