Author Topic: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor -- by michaelback  (Read 7326 times)

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Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor -- by michaelback
« on: June 22, 2007, 04:43:10 pm »
Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by michaelback     (Mon Feb 6 2006 08:57:43 )   

   
UPDATED Mon Feb 6 2006 09:16:32
Did anyone notice at the beginning of the film when Jack said he didn't want beans anymore? Ennis didn't say anything, but knew that the other alternative (soup) was hard to deliver. In any case he ordered the soup especially for Jack and in the end they both couldn't have the soup as the bear encounter destroyed everything but the beans - so they had to make do with what they had.

I think this shows a couple of things. It firstly signifies Ennis developing feelings for Jack in addition to accomodating his desires. I think this along with Ennis saying he hadn't had the opportunity to sin yet, shows he was trying to instigate some kind of deeper relationship subconsciously.

The other aspect is that the soup and beans are a metaphor for their relationship. They had to make do with beans even though they didn't really like them
(Their unfulfilled family life). Jack wanted the alternative (a life together), but Ennis couldn't provide it for him even though he really wanted to (soup destroyed).

In the end, they do kill a stag (I think that's what it was), but I think the baked beans and soup message is still the same.

Does anyone agree?

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by lvwmprovost      (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:02:00 )   

   
Yet another layer is peeled away ...

Never thought of this metaphor, but yep, it's there. There is so much genius in this film that I am still in awe, two months after having first seen it!

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by dietcokie     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:05:57 )   

   
I really like your metaphorical discussion on the beans
and soup. I will say the most successful ideas are the
ones that are not directly planned but have been more
or less thought of continously throught out a film.
When you think a certain way it will show.
Deliberate is clever - unplanned is genius.

"If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it" - Ennis Del Mar

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:17:11 )
   

Very interesting line of thought.

Additionaly, when Ennis says "I'll stick with beans" and Jack says "Well I won't", a lot is being foreshadowed. Ennis is saying "I'll stick with my lot in life" and Jack is saying "Well not me. I am going to go on to bigger and better things. I am not going to live small"

See what I mean?




"Say 'hi', girls"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by filmlooks     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:25:12 )   

   
I just wanted to point out that Ennis and Jack had not yet 'consumed' their relationship when Ennis gives in the grocery list asking for soup. Initially I thought the asking-for-soup-scene came about after they slept together, but I was wrong. I believe this demonstrates that Ennis is trying to befriend and accomodate his new friend Jack.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by fenrislupus     (Sun Jul 23 2006 19:48:08 )   

   
you meant consumated right... ?

"I'm sorry... my Karma just ran over your Dogma..."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by michaelback     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:31:34 )   

Yep, that scene also portrays the metaphor in my eyes.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by RobertPlant     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:14:22 )   
   
They had to make do with beans even though they didn't really like them
(Their unfulfilled family life). Jack wanted the alternative (a life together), but .......

Yes...
Ennis: I'll stick with beans
Jack: I won't.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by kenpadgett26     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:46:55 )   

   
"I'll stick with beans."
"I won't."
This exchange sums up who these men are perfectly.

Let be. Let be.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by dietcokie     (Mon Feb 6 2006 12:33:58 )   

   
re: "I'll stick with beans."
"I won't."
"This exchange sums up who these men are perfectly. "

I agree - wonderful forehsadowing - but it also set
the stage nicely for Jake's character. Plus when
they kill an elk (?) this is their sacrifice when
then were unable to get the "soup" because the bear
(which is implies deadly danger) takes that away.
Elk is their lives, their wives and children.
Emotional blood.

I love Ang and Annie - GENIUS!!

and
"There ain't no reins on this one"<-- That line gets me - its
so passionate sounding yet so matter of fact.

"If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it" - Ennis Del Mar

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by netflix_chick     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:17:00 )
   
   
Wow, I would have never even contemplated that idea! That was one of the best metaphorical ideas in this film that I have heard. Thanks for your input!

Hmm I going to make that my signature now!




Ennis: "I'll stick with beans"
Jack: "Well I won't" -- Brokeback Mountain

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor (spoiler)   
  by Front-Ranger     (Mon Feb 6 2006 12:06:02 )   
   
The original story didn't talk about eating beans on Brokeback Mountain, but at the end when Ennis dreams about his friend, he also sees a luridly-colored can of beans with a spoon sticking out of it. Even in his dreams he can't come to terms with his freind's death by tire iron so he dreams about the spoon instead. I think the spoon, shepherd's crook, hanger, and tire iron are all related. Perhaps they signal to us that that which "hooks" us on life can also be the cause of our death. Also, that Brokeback Mountain and the experience Ennis had there, "hooked him in" for life. He couldn't get away from it ("There ain't no reins on this one").

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by JeterzGirlNJersey     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:45:39 )   

   
You guys never cease to amaze me with the many interesting ways to look at BBM. This is one of the better posts I've seen in a while. Thanks!

A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice~Bill Cosby

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stitchbuffymoulinfan     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:52:57 )   
   
I agree with everything said. This is a really intriguing, beautiful metaphor.

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Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by LuvJackNasty     (Mon Feb 6 2006 19:04:40 )   

   
Wow! I love reading these type of threads! So beautifully stated.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Wed Mar 8 2006 12:42:48 )   

   
I'd rather talk about baked beans and soup than Hollywood

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by seaweed727     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:40:24 )   
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Me too Front-Ranger...

Much rather look for gems in these sensible discussions than wade through some of the *beep*

"I got a boy. Eight months old.... Smiles a lot."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by lil_toons     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:17:13 )
   
   
I'm not sure if this is pertinent to the metaphor because I saw BBM once and the scene I'm about to describe may or may not also have some connection to the Beans and Soup Metaphor. But, one scene I remember, which Ennis drops off the children to Alma at the store with the explaination that he's needed immediately at work but really intends to go meet Jack. After he leaves store, a shelf full of cans collapses onto the floor, when either Alma leans against it or the kid knocks it over. Not sure what kinds of cans they were.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:31:39 )   


big jars of peanuts



"Hey Ennis, do you know someone named 'Jack'?"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by MtBecky      (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:41:36 )   

   
...I thought they were some kind of nuts? Pistachios maybe?

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by northernlad      (Tue Mar 14 2006 12:48:07 )   

   
This is the type of stuff that makes me love coming here. I hadn't really considered the beans and the soup. I also like what is said here about Ennis saying he'll stick with the beans, but Jack says that he won't. It's so true about their characters.

"And I need you more than want you and I want you for all time"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by pipedream     (Tue Mar 14 2006 13:07:38 )
   
   
Sticking with the beans, yeah that's Ennis ("If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it"); Funnily he seemed very keen to fix the things he thought could actually be fixed, like the tent that Jack hadn't properly set up. Jack didn't care about it, yet Ennis had to fix it.
That's sort of revealing, too, isn't it? I think Jack had a better feeling for what was really important to him and set different priorities. He wanted Ennis and tried to persuade him again and again to establish a life togehter. Yet this was so out of the question for Ennis, he just couldn't.
Only in the end when he discovered the shirts in Jack's room he realized what a fundamental mistake he had made. Too sad.

 

If ever I should tell the moment: Oh, stay! You are so beautiful! Then you may cast me into chains, then shall I smile upon perdition! (Goethe)

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Tue Mar 14 2006 19:10:58 )   

   
Great insight, pipedream!

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by taj_e     (Tue Mar 14 2006 19:37:49 )
   
   
UPDATED Tue Mar 14 2006 19:55:19
They settled with an elk (wild game) at the end
The fact that Ennis was willing to go for soup was one of the indication of Ennis nurturing instinct. I've initially thought that Ennis might have develop strong feeling (love) a day before he set up the tent (in excitement). However Ennis was seen and heard humming away prior to the bear incident. He might have the 'wild idea' of the possibility of having a 'relationship' with Jack

The bear was perhaps the first 'warning' of how wild his idea was
Bear: ROARRR! (Don't even think about it!)

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by The_Almighty_Bobo     (Sun Mar 19 2006 09:46:23 )   

   
But they couldn't open one container of freaking pudding. >:[

"Did having my brother inside of you infect you with stupid?!"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stevme     (Wed May 24 2006 13:47:54 )   
   
taj_e, I haven't seen the bear discussed before, but I think you are on to something. That encounter is a signal that all hell is about to break loose, and the tidy work routine is about to get a big jolt.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by taj_e     (Mon Jul 10 2006 11:31:09 )   

   
stevme
I hope by now you have seen lots about the bear thing

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Sat Apr 1 2006 10:57:45 )   

   
This is a discussion from our renaissance period just before the Oscars (I think of the post-Oscar month as our baroque period).

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by rrb     (Sat Apr 1 2006 11:08:34 )   

I hope this thread is meant to be a joke --

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Sat Apr 1 2006 13:46:07 )   

rrb, I think you've ushered us into our deconstructivist period.

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by christian-posch     (Sat Apr 1 2006 14:05:41 )   
   
michaelblack and all you other guys, you are geniuses in my eyes.
I never really considered the bean and soup thing.
Great post.
That makes it worth coming back again to this bord.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Mon Apr 3 2006 11:57:00 )   

   
There are a lot of great threads like this but they get buried and after 5 weeks if there are no more posts they are deleted. Go back about 10-15 pages and you'll find some treasures.

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Fri Apr 14 2006 10:27:58 )   
   
Hey this thread is still alive. That is nice. I'll stick with beans...Well I won't.

Is that an Annie Proulx line, or was it from the screenplay?




"Hey Ennis, do you know someone named 'Jack'?"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Fri Apr 14 2006 13:28:47 )   


Good question, Bannerhill. Actually, I can't find a reference to beans anywhere in the story during their time on BB Mountain. Once when Jack comes back from herding he eats a couple of cans of peaches, but no beans. The story does refer to beans later when Ennis says to Alma that Jack is not the restaurant type. And at the very end Ennis has a dream about Jack in which beans appear (I talk about that earlier in this thread). So, the question inevitably becomes Why did McMurtry/Ossana expand the role of beans in the story? I don't know the answer but I'll hazard a guess. I think it was actually Ang Lee who added the beans reference, and it was because beans are an Oriental symbol of male fertility. Other thoughts?

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."


Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by edd_joey     (Mon May 15 2006 16:33:02 )   

   
great metaphor this movie is full with these

You have turned me into this...

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stevme     (Wed May 24 2006 13:52:22 )   
   
Front-Ranger

Here is the first reference to "beans" in the short story:

"Well, I'm goin a warsh everthing I can reach," he said, pulling off his boots and jeans (no drawers, no socks, Jack noticed), slopping the green washcloth around until the fire spat.

They had a high-time supper by the fire, a can of ****beans**** each, fried potatoes and a quart of whiskey on shares, sat with their backs against a log, boot soles and copper jeans rivets hot, swapping the bottle while the lavender sky emptied of color and the chill air drained down, drinking, smoking cigarettes, getting up every now and then to piss, firelight throwing a sparkle in the arched stream, tossing sticks on the fire to keep the talk going, talking horses and rodeo, roughstock events, wrecks and injuries sustained, the submarine Thresher lost two months earlier with all hands and how it must have been in the last doomed minutes, dogs each had owned and known, the draft, Jack's home ranch where his father and mother held on, Ennis's family place folded years ago after his folks died, the older brother in Signal and a married sister in Casper. "

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by riverviewantique     (Sun Jun 4 2006 14:27:25 )   
   
when the dvd came out they had an interview with Dianna and larry. they said they had to create a lot of things as Annie's story was a short one. Also when Ennis says he will switch with Jack, he is also showing how he is glad to help jack as he now cares for him. But he can never move in with Jack as a result of his childhood vision of the Rich guy getting murdered. He was always scared something would happen to Jack of himself. They were safe on the mountain but he feared the real world would find out about their affair, and it did... with tragic results for both of them


Re: bump   
  by TheFutureMrs     (Thu Jun 22 2006 19:08:44 )   
   
I knew the beans and soup meant something, but my friends wouldnt let me rewind the DVD so I couldnt be sure. That's amazing.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by revolution-hk     (Fri Jun 23 2006 00:29:53 )   
   
I thought the bear scene was right after Ennis ordered soup from basque, which mean the soup will arrive one week later?

- Strong back, strong mind.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by robotsu     (Sun Jul 23 2006 18:45:32 )   
   
You are correct...

killing the 'stag'   
  by internetdigger     (Mon Aug 14 2006 22:49:50 )   

   

. "In the end, they do kill a stag " is this just your Fraudian slip or can we start a debate about the killing of the "stag" and find its true meaning
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Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor -- by michaelback
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2007, 10:14:14 am »
There are some nuggets of info in this, but I think it would be a good idea if we synopsized this thread.
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Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor -- by michaelback
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2015, 01:16:32 pm »
You'd think we've talked about everything there is to talk about re: Brokeback Mountain, but I've found that we've just barely scraped the surface in many places. Like for instance, beans vs soup. This is the only place I've found we've discussed it, and it wasn't even on Bettermost, it was on IMDB. It's  not Thursday, but I'd still like to revive this conversation. It's reassuring to think about nice hot soup today! Beans too!
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Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor -- by michaelback
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2016, 01:58:05 pm »
For anyone here who loves beans!

Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by michaelback     (Mon Feb 6 2006 08:57:43 )   

   
UPDATED Mon Feb 6 2006 09:16:32
Did anyone notice at the beginning of the film when Jack said he didn't want beans anymore? Ennis didn't say anything, but knew that the other alternative (soup) was hard to deliver. In any case he ordered the soup especially for Jack and in the end they both couldn't have the soup as the bear encounter destroyed everything but the beans - so they had to make do with what they had.

I think this shows a couple of things. It firstly signifies Ennis developing feelings for Jack in addition to accomodating his desires. I think this along with Ennis saying he hadn't had the opportunity to sin yet, shows he was trying to instigate some kind of deeper relationship subconsciously.

The other aspect is that the soup and beans are a metaphor for their relationship. They had to make do with beans even though they didn't really like them
(Their unfulfilled family life). Jack wanted the alternative (a life together), but Ennis couldn't provide it for him even though he really wanted to (soup destroyed).

In the end, they do kill a stag (I think that's what it was), but I think the baked beans and soup message is still the same.

Does anyone agree?

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by lvwmprovost      (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:02:00 )   

   
Yet another layer is peeled away ...

Never thought of this metaphor, but yep, it's there. There is so much genius in this film that I am still in awe, two months after having first seen it!

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by dietcokie     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:05:57 )   

   
I really like your metaphorical discussion on the beans
and soup. I will say the most successful ideas are the
ones that are not directly planned but have been more
or less thought of continously throught out a film.
When you think a certain way it will show.
Deliberate is clever - unplanned is genius.

"If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it" - Ennis Del Mar

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:17:11 )
   

Very interesting line of thought.

Additionaly, when Ennis says "I'll stick with beans" and Jack says "Well I won't", a lot is being foreshadowed. Ennis is saying "I'll stick with my lot in life" and Jack is saying "Well not me. I am going to go on to bigger and better things. I am not going to live small"

See what I mean?




"Say 'hi', girls"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by filmlooks     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:25:12 )   

   
I just wanted to point out that Ennis and Jack had not yet 'consumed' their relationship when Ennis gives in the grocery list asking for soup. Initially I thought the asking-for-soup-scene came about after they slept together, but I was wrong. I believe this demonstrates that Ennis is trying to befriend and accomodate his new friend Jack.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by fenrislupus     (Sun Jul 23 2006 19:48:08 )   

   
you meant consumated right... ?

"I'm sorry... my Karma just ran over your Dogma..."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by michaelback     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:31:34 )   

Yep, that scene also portrays the metaphor in my eyes.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by RobertPlant     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:14:22 )   
   
They had to make do with beans even though they didn't really like them
(Their unfulfilled family life). Jack wanted the alternative (a life together), but .......

Yes...
Ennis: I'll stick with beans
Jack: I won't.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by kenpadgett26     (Mon Feb 6 2006 09:46:55 )   

   
"I'll stick with beans."
"I won't."
This exchange sums up who these men are perfectly.

Let be. Let be.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by dietcokie     (Mon Feb 6 2006 12:33:58 )   

   
re: "I'll stick with beans."
"I won't."
"This exchange sums up who these men are perfectly. "

I agree - wonderful forehsadowing - but it also set
the stage nicely for Jake's character. Plus when
they kill an elk (?) this is their sacrifice when
then were unable to get the "soup" because the bear
(which is implies deadly danger) takes that away.
Elk is their lives, their wives and children.
Emotional blood.

I love Ang and Annie - GENIUS!!

and
"There ain't no reins on this one"<-- That line gets me - its
so passionate sounding yet so matter of fact.

"If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it" - Ennis Del Mar

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by netflix_chick     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:17:00 )
   
   
Wow, I would have never even contemplated that idea! That was one of the best metaphorical ideas in this film that I have heard. Thanks for your input!

Hmm I going to make that my signature now!




Ennis: "I'll stick with beans"
Jack: "Well I won't" -- Brokeback Mountain

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor (spoiler)   
  by Front-Ranger     (Mon Feb 6 2006 12:06:02 )   
   
The original story didn't talk about eating beans on Brokeback Mountain, but at the end when Ennis dreams about his friend, he also sees a luridly-colored can of beans with a spoon sticking out of it. Even in his dreams he can't come to terms with his freind's death by tire iron so he dreams about the spoon instead. I think the spoon, shepherd's crook, hanger, and tire iron are all related. Perhaps they signal to us that that which "hooks" us on life can also be the cause of our death. Also, that Brokeback Mountain and the experience Ennis had there, "hooked him in" for life. He couldn't get away from it ("There ain't no reins on this one").

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by JeterzGirlNJersey     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:45:39 )   

   
You guys never cease to amaze me with the many interesting ways to look at BBM. This is one of the better posts I've seen in a while. Thanks!

A word to the wise ain't necessary - it's the stupid ones that need the advice~Bill Cosby

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stitchbuffymoulinfan     (Mon Feb 6 2006 15:52:57 )   
   
I agree with everything said. This is a really intriguing, beautiful metaphor.

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Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by LuvJackNasty     (Mon Feb 6 2006 19:04:40 )   

   
Wow! I love reading these type of threads! So beautifully stated.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Wed Mar 8 2006 12:42:48 )   

   
I'd rather talk about baked beans and soup than Hollywood

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by seaweed727     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:40:24 )   
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Me too Front-Ranger...

Much rather look for gems in these sensible discussions than wade through some of the *beep*

"I got a boy. Eight months old.... Smiles a lot."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by lil_toons     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:17:13 )
   
   
I'm not sure if this is pertinent to the metaphor because I saw BBM once and the scene I'm about to describe may or may not also have some connection to the Beans and Soup Metaphor. But, one scene I remember, which Ennis drops off the children to Alma at the store with the explaination that he's needed immediately at work but really intends to go meet Jack. After he leaves store, a shelf full of cans collapses onto the floor, when either Alma leans against it or the kid knocks it over. Not sure what kinds of cans they were.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:31:39 )   


big jars of peanuts



"Hey Ennis, do you know someone named 'Jack'?"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by MtBecky      (Wed Mar 8 2006 13:41:36 )   

   
...I thought they were some kind of nuts? Pistachios maybe?

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by northernlad      (Tue Mar 14 2006 12:48:07 )   

   
This is the type of stuff that makes me love coming here. I hadn't really considered the beans and the soup. I also like what is said here about Ennis saying he'll stick with the beans, but Jack says that he won't. It's so true about their characters.

"And I need you more than want you and I want you for all time"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by pipedream     (Tue Mar 14 2006 13:07:38 )
   
   
Sticking with the beans, yeah that's Ennis ("If ya can't fix it Jack, ya gotta stand it"); Funnily he seemed very keen to fix the things he thought could actually be fixed, like the tent that Jack hadn't properly set up. Jack didn't care about it, yet Ennis had to fix it.
That's sort of revealing, too, isn't it? I think Jack had a better feeling for what was really important to him and set different priorities. He wanted Ennis and tried to persuade him again and again to establish a life togehter. Yet this was so out of the question for Ennis, he just couldn't.
Only in the end when he discovered the shirts in Jack's room he realized what a fundamental mistake he had made. Too sad.

 

If ever I should tell the moment: Oh, stay! You are so beautiful! Then you may cast me into chains, then shall I smile upon perdition! (Goethe)

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Tue Mar 14 2006 19:10:58 )   

   
Great insight, pipedream!

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by taj_e     (Tue Mar 14 2006 19:37:49 )
   
   
UPDATED Tue Mar 14 2006 19:55:19
They settled with an elk (wild game) at the end
The fact that Ennis was willing to go for soup was one of the indication of Ennis nurturing instinct. I've initially thought that Ennis might have develop strong feeling (love) a day before he set up the tent (in excitement). However Ennis was seen and heard humming away prior to the bear incident. He might have the 'wild idea' of the possibility of having a 'relationship' with Jack

The bear was perhaps the first 'warning' of how wild his idea was
Bear: ROARRR! (Don't even think about it!)

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by The_Almighty_Bobo     (Sun Mar 19 2006 09:46:23 )   

   
But they couldn't open one container of freaking pudding. >:[

"Did having my brother inside of you infect you with stupid?!"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stevme     (Wed May 24 2006 13:47:54 )   
   
taj_e, I haven't seen the bear discussed before, but I think you are on to something. That encounter is a signal that all hell is about to break loose, and the tidy work routine is about to get a big jolt.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by taj_e     (Mon Jul 10 2006 11:31:09 )   

   
stevme
I hope by now you have seen lots about the bear thing

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Sat Apr 1 2006 10:57:45 )   

   
This is a discussion from our renaissance period just before the Oscars (I think of the post-Oscar month as our baroque period).

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by rrb     (Sat Apr 1 2006 11:08:34 )   

I hope this thread is meant to be a joke --

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Sat Apr 1 2006 13:46:07 )   

rrb, I think you've ushered us into our deconstructivist period.

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by christian-posch     (Sat Apr 1 2006 14:05:41 )   
   
michaelblack and all you other guys, you are geniuses in my eyes.
I never really considered the bean and soup thing.
Great post.
That makes it worth coming back again to this bord.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Mon Apr 3 2006 11:57:00 )   

   
There are a lot of great threads like this but they get buried and after 5 weeks if there are no more posts they are deleted. Go back about 10-15 pages and you'll find some treasures.

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by BannerHill     (Fri Apr 14 2006 10:27:58 )   
   
Hey this thread is still alive. That is nice. I'll stick with beans...Well I won't.

Is that an Annie Proulx line, or was it from the screenplay?




"Hey Ennis, do you know someone named 'Jack'?"

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by Front-Ranger     (Fri Apr 14 2006 13:28:47 )   


Good question, Bannerhill. Actually, I can't find a reference to beans anywhere in the story during their time on BB Mountain. Once when Jack comes back from herding he eats a couple of cans of peaches, but no beans. The story does refer to beans later when Ennis says to Alma that Jack is not the restaurant type. And at the very end Ennis has a dream about Jack in which beans appear (I talk about that earlier in this thread). So, the question inevitably becomes Why did McMurtry/Ossana expand the role of beans in the story? I don't know the answer but I'll hazard a guess. I think it was actually Ang Lee who added the beans reference, and it was because beans are an Oriental symbol of male fertility. Other thoughts?

Front-Ranger
"There ain't no reins on this one."


Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by edd_joey     (Mon May 15 2006 16:33:02 )   

   
great metaphor this movie is full with these

You have turned me into this...

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by stevme     (Wed May 24 2006 13:52:22 )   
   
Front-Ranger

Here is the first reference to "beans" in the short story:

"Well, I'm goin a warsh everthing I can reach," he said, pulling off his boots and jeans (no drawers, no socks, Jack noticed), slopping the green washcloth around until the fire spat.

They had a high-time supper by the fire, a can of ****beans**** each, fried potatoes and a quart of whiskey on shares, sat with their backs against a log, boot soles and copper jeans rivets hot, swapping the bottle while the lavender sky emptied of color and the chill air drained down, drinking, smoking cigarettes, getting up every now and then to piss, firelight throwing a sparkle in the arched stream, tossing sticks on the fire to keep the talk going, talking horses and rodeo, roughstock events, wrecks and injuries sustained, the submarine Thresher lost two months earlier with all hands and how it must have been in the last doomed minutes, dogs each had owned and known, the draft, Jack's home ranch where his father and mother held on, Ennis's family place folded years ago after his folks died, the older brother in Signal and a married sister in Casper. "

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by riverviewantique     (Sun Jun 4 2006 14:27:25 )   
   
when the dvd came out they had an interview with Dianna and larry. they said they had to create a lot of things as Annie's story was a short one. Also when Ennis says he will switch with Jack, he is also showing how he is glad to help jack as he now cares for him. But he can never move in with Jack as a result of his childhood vision of the Rich guy getting murdered. He was always scared something would happen to Jack of himself. They were safe on the mountain but he feared the real world would find out about their affair, and it did... with tragic results for both of them


Re: bump   
  by TheFutureMrs     (Thu Jun 22 2006 19:08:44 )   
   
I knew the beans and soup meant something, but my friends wouldnt let me rewind the DVD so I couldnt be sure. That's amazing.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by revolution-hk     (Fri Jun 23 2006 00:29:53 )   
   
I thought the bear scene was right after Ennis ordered soup from basque, which mean the soup will arrive one week later?

- Strong back, strong mind.

Re: Baked Beans and Soup Metaphor   
  by robotsu     (Sun Jul 23 2006 18:45:32 )   
   
You are correct...

killing the 'stag'   
  by internetdigger     (Mon Aug 14 2006 22:49:50 )   

   

. "In the end, they do kill a stag " is this just your Fraudian slip or can we start a debate about the killing of the "stag" and find its true meaning
When you see the smiley face in the sky, the pandemic will be over!