Author Topic: Was Ennis Gay?  (Read 10700 times)

Offline David In Indy

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #30 on: March 06, 2007, 04:02:52 am »

     I have always thought he was bi.. He really had no aversions to gay, other than the fears
his own father had put into him.  He had decided he liked women ok, and he found one that
liked him ok... and probably would have continued his life in a rather ho hum situation, if not for
having met jack..Jack however taught him that love and sex were intertwined.  NOt just a by-product of a marriage.  From then on, he knew what he wanted. 
     He however still had the fear,  all that, would mean..Plus he didnt want to leave his children, orphaned, as he had been..I think he then decided to make the best of the unfortunate situation.  To carry on an affair, and just keep on keeping on...No satisfaction for anyone.  But that is what kind of a decision a passive aggressive person would tend to choose.  It would seem like the logically simple answer...However as we all know,,,it just doesnt work out that way in the end...He then was set on a path, that he neither could or would detour from.
     He then found he was too late smart..that he was gay, and he had obstructed his entire
life and Jacks as well.  And possibly hastened the very thing he was so afraid of. The coming of the "tire irons."
   im not a male and im not gay, or lesbian either, its just my observation of human nature.
                                                                                              janice

Those are great observations Janice!  :D

But can society actually dictate one's sexuality? Certainly one can conform if necessary. But can it actually change or alter the intrinsic nature or sexual identity of an individual? I think Ennis conformed. Not be cause he wanted to, but because he had to. This is a big difference. Unfortunately, many gay people are still doing this today, in the 21st century. We conform to survive. Not because we want to, but because we have to. Certainly this would have been true in 1960's Wyoming. Societal pressure can be an awesome yoke to bear for certain groups; gays included.

Great post Janice!  :D
Dogs have owners. Cats have staff.

Offline Artiste

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2008, 08:24:12 pm »
Wow!

Quote
  But can society actually dictate one's sexuality? Certainly one can conform if necessary. But can it actually change or alter the intrinsic nature or sexual identity of an individual? I think Ennis conformed. Not be cause he wanted to, but because he had to. This is a big difference. Unfortunately, many gay people are still doing this today, in the 21st century. We conform to survive. Not because we want to, but because we have to. Certainly this would have been true in 1960's Wyoming. Societal pressure can be an awesome yoke to bear for certain groups; gays included.

 

.........

Wow, wow... too to all others here who brought such great thoughts!

Au revoir,
take care,
hugs!

Offline brokeplex

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #32 on: March 17, 2008, 06:33:46 pm »
Emotionally Ennis was gay.

Sexually he functioned as a bi because of the strictures of his society, but I don't think in defining Ennis's character that should mean a great deal.

Offline Artiste

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #33 on: March 17, 2008, 07:15:56 pm »
As acted by Heath, Ennis was probably or possibly NOT gay!

Could that be considered so?

Hugs!

Offline brokeplex

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #34 on: March 17, 2008, 10:36:08 pm »
As acted by Heath, Ennis was probably or possibly NOT gay!

Could that be considered so?

Hugs!

he was not gay?

 so he was just bored with Alma when he agreed to meet with Jack after 4 years? sorry that just doesn't make sense to me. if he wasn't gay, and his sex with Jack on the mountain was just for convenience, then after 4 years he would have had no interest in Jack.

Offline Artiste

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #35 on: March 17, 2008, 10:40:30 pm »
Thanks brokeplex!

You say:
he was not gay?

 so he was just bored with Alma when he agreed to meet with Jack after 4 years? sorry that just doesn't make sense to me. if he wasn't gay, and his sex with Jack on the mountain was just for convenience, then after 4 years he would have had no interest in Jack. 
 
 
........

May I say that possibly Ennis can be viewed as straight, since some heterosexual men do have sex with another man (who is straight or gay), and do you think so, or seen that??

Hugs!

Offline brokeplex

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #36 on: March 17, 2008, 10:43:44 pm »
Thanks brokeplex!

You say:
he was not gay?

 so he was just bored with Alma when he agreed to meet with Jack after 4 years? sorry that just doesn't make sense to me. if he wasn't gay, and his sex with Jack on the mountain was just for convenience, then after 4 years he would have had no interest in Jack. 
 
 
........

May I say that possibly Ennis can be viewed as straight, since some heterosexual men do have sex with another man (who is straight or gay), and do you think so, or seen that??

Hugs!
sure but they don't "reconnect" after "four fuckin' years" unless they are gay. Ennis had to feel something beyond the need for a quicky with Jack. That means he was gay, he was not straight, and his bisexuality was just for appearances.

Offline Artiste

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #37 on: March 17, 2008, 10:51:44 pm »
Thanks brokeplex!

I would like to think like you: that Ennis is gay!
...
You replied to my post:
sure but they don't "reconnect" after "four fuckin' years" unless they are gay. Ennis had to feel something beyond the need for a quicky with Jack. That means he was gay, he was not straight, and his bisexuality was just for appearances. 
 
 
............

And may I reply: that is just it: Ennis wanted more but he did slave himself to appearances!!
He thought maybe too much that society (some in it) would kill him if ever he considered himself gay?
So, he did ONLY appearances with Jack, once in a while!! - That way, he is straight!

Gay wise, Ennis is something else?

Au revoir,
hugs!

Offline optom3

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #38 on: March 17, 2008, 11:03:20 pm »
I think initially he was sexually naieve,
Then he very reluctantly realises he could be gay,he is attracted to Jack.In TS2 he goes to Jack.
Then he realises he is in love and gay,as per the alley scene after comming down from the mountain.
He quashes those feelings, but interestingly ,although he conforms by marrying,he,sorry no other way to put this,always takes Alma from behind.He also tells her he would be quite happy to leave her alone if she doesn't want any more kids.
He obviously does not want sex with her, just to have sex.
He may never be happy with the fact that he is gay,but I still think he none the less knows it.That i s what makes it so gut wrenching for me.Sort of in another time, another era, another place,it may all have been different.
The 2 most poignant sentences in the book for me is when they are in the motel,and Ennis says to Jack,"Took me about a year a figure out it was that I shouldn't a let you out a my sights.Too late by then by a long long while"
That is said by a man in love.In love with another man,which I think means gay.
He is trapped by convention ,prejudice,and his own fears, into a life that is untrue to his feelings and sexual inclination.But it does not mean those inclinations do not represent the man.
In much the same way some men are trapped in mens bodies and vice versa.


Offline Artiste

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Re: Was Ennis Gay?
« Reply #39 on: March 17, 2008, 11:10:41 pm »
Thanks optom!

Very, very well detailed and said!!
......

However, I have known some men who have sex with me, often, and never did consider themselves gay!

What about those?

You can answer and others can too,

hugs!