Author Topic: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread  (Read 25518 times)

vkm91941

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread - merged
« Reply #20 on: May 07, 2006, 04:31:41 am »
I love Jack's Mom with her careworn face and her heart in her eyes....she seemed kind of sad and desperate when she asked Ennis if he would stop by again sometime to visit...of course, we all know Ennis never will. Can you imagine how much Jack's Mom would have loved it if the old man wasn't there and she could have had a long heart to heart talk with Ennis about her son? To see Mrs. Twist and Ennis alone at that table, hugging and crying... Breaks my heart to think about it.  :'(
« Last Edit: May 12, 2006, 04:18:44 am by Roland »

TJ

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #21 on: May 07, 2006, 12:19:55 pm »
While almost all of the younger generation and the right-wing fundamentalist Bible-thumpers want to call anyone who has a sexual relationship with a person of the same sex, "gay," instead of "homosexual" even if the person is in the closet. I would not have thought that Mrs. Twist would have even considered Ennis to have been her son-in-law or even gay.

I just think that since she "believed in the Pentecost," she also put into practice what Jesus and His disciples preached and what his disciples wrote, too. Believers in Jesus are supposed to offer hospitality to strangers because in doing so, they might be entertaining angels without being aware of it. Literally speaking, all of the Angels in the Bible's pages look like normal men with no wings (the heavenly creatures in the Bible with wings are NEVER called angels).

I say that the way that Mrs. Twist acted toward Ennis would have been similar to how my own mother, who was a Pentecostal, would have acted if I had been dead and a person, who had been my best friend in the way that Ennis was with Jack, showed up at her home and she had never known that I was gay. (But, my father was not anything like Mr. Twist at all; Dad was just as hospitable toward strangers and my friends as Mom was.) In 1983 and early 1984, my parents liked my best friend whom I visited with a lot and even stayed overnight in his home and they had no idea that our friendship began with a sexual encounter. They did not have a clue about my sexual orientation at that time.

I do like the way that Roberta Maxwell played the role as it was written for the movie and how she interpreted it personally, too. The taking of the shirts by Ennis and the paper sack provided by Mrs. Twist was a movie thing. That's not in the book at all. But, if Ennis was going to carry the shirts out in plain sight, it was logical that she would give him a sack to put them in.

TJ

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #22 on: May 07, 2006, 12:33:59 pm »
I believe that if Mr. Twist had not been there when Ennis showed up at the house on the ranch; she would have spent some time visiting with Ennis. I believe that she might have offered more solid food than cherry cake, and offered to fix him lunch instead.

While my own Pentecostal believing/practicing mother never met my partner/husband, Ed, in person, she did talk to him on the phone when I was not a home. She even visited with him that way before she found out that I was gay. Before finding out, she just thought I was living with a friend.

Speaking of father's here: Until after I went home for Christmas before I was out to them, Dad sometimes asked, "Are you still living with that man?" He did not mean that in a negative way. I flew back to Tulsa for Christmas in 1985 and Ed found out that Dad wore the same size of coat he did. Ed had a winter coat which was in good shape but too warm to wear in LA. He told me to take it with me and give it to my dad.

After I got to the folks from the airport, and got just a little settled, I took the coat out of a suitcase and gave it to Dad. I told him that was from Ed who wanted him to have it. Dad was so thankful that he had me dial our number because he wanted to talk to Ed. That was the 1st time he had talked to Ed; Dad was not the type to call people on the phone, although he would talk to callers. I heard Dad thank Ed for the coat and he said, "Ed, if you was here, I would hug your neck!"

TJ

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #23 on: May 08, 2006, 07:42:38 pm »
Interesting response and background, TJ.  I can understand and/or accept most of what U wrote except that Mrs. Twist could not know that her son Jack was Gay -- and he was and she knew it -- and then consider his boyfriend as "not Gay".  ???
<snip>
Will

In the strictest sense of the word and what I know from my own experiences and from real people from the country and rural areas in the Central states of the USA and the gays whom I have met since I left the closet more than 22 years ago (I did live in the North Hollywood section of Los Angeles for almost 8 years - 1984--1992), I would say that Jack's parents would have only thought that Ennis had been Jack's best friend but not his boyfriend. As remote and isolated as the Twist ranch was at Lightning Flat in Crook County in the extreme NE corner of Wyoming, they might not have even known if any of their acquaintances or neighbors were even homosexual when they actually were.

In January 1992, before I moved back to Tulsa, I stayed with my friend, Richard, in Panorama City in the San Fernando Valley for 3 weeks. During one of those weeks, Richard's mother came for a visit from Amery, MA. While she knew that Richard was openly gay, she never knew that I was. While I slept in Richard's bedroom, I did not sleep in his bed. Richard had not lied about me when he had told his mother, his sister and his brother back in his home town about me to them. He just did not tell them things which they did no have a need to know. He told them in around April 1991 that he had become friends with a born-again Christian and he attended morning worship services with him on Sundays at the First Assembly of God in North Hollywood. I lived half a mile from the church and Richard rode the bus to there.

Because I was involved in a sort of "bar ministry" while being a member of the Spiritual Advisory Committee of AIDS Project Los Angeles (APLA) as an independent Pentecostal evangelist, Richard's mother only assumed that I had not gone to the same club that Richard had on the Friday night she was visiting and when she guessed that we just both happened to be on the same bus going home, Richard and I just let her believe that part to be true. I did not have to lie about my ministry; because I did visit with guys whom I knew had HIV/AIDS at the club (even though some of them did not even know I was a volunteer with APLA where they were clients -  but, they knew my late partner, Ed, got services from APLA before he died on March 2, 1991).

The last time that I talked to Richard's sister on the phone was about 4 years ago. From what I could tell by the way she talked, she still did not have a clue about my sexual orientation. Their mother, who was also Pentecostal, had gone on to be with the Lord. But, before I left Richard's in January 1992, she had asked me to inquire about Richard's relationship with the Christ. I did visit with him where he just volunteered information and he did assure me that he was saved and prayed, too. Richard took a day off from work to spend a special day with me and we went to a local park to enjoy the warm sunshine. I talked to her before I left town and told her how I knew he was also born-again.


Offline Lumière

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2006, 12:55:02 pm »
Will-U, I am here at last  :P!

I personally love Mrs Twist because she was a compassionate, non-judgemental, loving woman who loved her son deeply.  Everyone would want to have a mother like her.  She clearly knew that her son was gay, but she didn't lash out or chastise him.  We know this because her actions speak louder than words.  The way she looked at Ennis, the way she touched his shoulder as if to alleviate the burden of his pain, the way she looked into his eyes when she said "You come back and see us again." - these gestures showed her deep respect for her son at moments when her husband had nothing but scorn to dish out. 

I love Mrs Twist because although she said so little, she spoke volumes to Ennis and to all of us!
She was a warm, kind, generous soul, and God bless her for it!  :)


Offline southendmd

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread - merged
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2006, 02:27:32 pm »
I love Mrs. Twist because she is the only one who understands Ennis's loss and tries to comfort him. 

Ennis said kind words to Lureen, and to the Twists (I knew him a long time; we was good friends, etc).  But, no one else in Ennis's life would know what Jack meant to him.  Not Alma, nor Alma Jr.

Her hand on his shoulder is one of the simple, moving moments in the film.

BTW, how did we learn her name is Mary?? Did I miss something?
« Last Edit: May 13, 2006, 03:29:46 pm by Roland »

TJ

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2006, 03:55:29 pm »
It's interesting how we can assume something about fictional people like Mrs. John C. Twist (or even other story characters) from a movie and "guess" exactly what they were supposed to have known and yet never met any person like the fictional character.

In the way that Roberta Maxwell described Jack's mother and how she played her, and add to that the fact that Jack's family ranch was way out in the middle of nowhere, and then, for myself, knowing country women who were definitely Practicing Pentecostals, I just have to say, "There was no way that Mary Twist knew what Jack's sexual orientation was. My own parents who were also Pentecostal had no idea that, Bill, my best friend in the early 1980s was bisexual (also heterosexually married) and that we slept together when I spent the night at Bill's house."

Oh, Bill's wife, Carolyn, and I were friends, sorta like brother and sister in our family of choice. She was exclusively heterosexual and she knew Bill's sexual orientation before she married him. She approved of my relationship with her husband. One time she told me, when he was not around to hear it, "Joe, I trust Bill with you; because when I know he's with you, he is not going to get into anykind of trouble."

My parents also like Carolyn and their children.

So, I will stick to my own personal opinion that Jack Twist's mother never knew Jack's and Ennis's sexual orientation and the Twists probably would not have known a homosexual if they had seen one.

TJ

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #27 on: May 10, 2006, 06:19:22 pm »
TJ, why is it that the only person here whom you allow to assume anything about these characters seems to be you?  Just wondering.

Read the first paragraph of what I wrote again!

Quote
It's interesting how we can assume something about fictional people like Mrs. John C. Twist (or even other story characters) from a movie and "guess" exactly what they were supposed to have known and yet never met any person like the fictional character.

Notice the we! That includes me!

My personal opinion and I mean MY own opinion is not based on what is in the book but, about what Roberta Maxwell said about her role in the movie.

Offline ProwlAmongUs

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #28 on: May 10, 2006, 09:11:59 pm »
I'm sure Mrs. Twist knew about her son's sexual orientation; speaking as a parent myself, I really always knew pretty much what was going on "behind the scenes" with both my daughters. Whether she accepted it or not only she knew. I also believe that, as a believer in the Pentecost, she put into practice what Christ taught; that is, that it wasn't for her or anyone else to judge her son--that task should be left to a higher power.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2006, 09:16:10 pm by ProwlAmongUs »
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Offline ProwlAmongUs

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Re: The "I LOVE everything Jack's Mom" thread
« Reply #29 on: May 10, 2006, 11:16:53 pm »
I totally agree with you, DeeDee. Thanks for a nice post.
Nightmares may be products of our subconscious, but dreams are magic windows through which we see our desired reality.