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Stop the Hate
louisev:
--- Quote from: bradINblue on March 04, 2009, 05:53:18 pm ---The above description of your politics makes much more sense in understanding where you stand. Sounds like your not extremely liberal after and that was my point.
Brad
--- End quote ---
well there shouldn't be a lot of confusion about what I stand for since I listed in my original post just about every political position I support. And I would stress that progressives, particularly "independent progressives" are considered the "extreme left wing." We're the ones who don't get upset when you call us socialists, because there is a lot to be said for the aims of social democracy. And we know Obama is not a socialist.
brokeplex:
--- Quote from: atz75 on March 04, 2009, 01:08:41 pm ---I take Jeff's comment to mean that the social conservatives in the Republican party feel no hesitation at having government control/restrict/meddle with the rights of gay people and the rights of women to make their own medical decisions, along with their doctors of course.
--- End quote ---
Some "social conservatives" do wish to stop same sex marriage from becoming a reality, so do some "liberals" like Obama.
Most social conservatives are less interested in protecting a woman's "right" to an abortion than they are protecting the "rights" of the unborn baby who can't speak for him or herself.
I am not a social conservative, and neither from what I can tell is Kaiser, but we are both conservative and right of center.
Conservatives come in all shades of the rainbow, some of the colors are bright and glowing, some are more muted pastels.
pnwDUDE:
--- Quote from: louisev on March 04, 2009, 07:00:26 pm ---well there shouldn't be a lot of confusion about what I stand for since I listed in my original post just about every political position I support. And I would stress that progressives, particularly "independent progressives" are considered the "extreme left wing." We're the ones who don't get upset when you call us socialists, because there is a lot to be said for the aims of social democracy. And we know Obama is not a socialist.
--- End quote ---
According to progressiveindependent.com, you're not quite near the extreme left as they (and I) am referring too. After looking at their site, now I'm very curious why someone like you who is knocking on the Socialist door would/could vote for B. Obama, who is IMO close to the right of the Dem notch.
Brad
brokeplex:
--- Quote from: HerrKaiser on March 04, 2009, 04:07:08 pm ---
Nobody is interested in what goes on in bedrooms, unless it is illegal with a minor or illegal due to criminal ssault. Nobody is interested in obgyn offices either, unless the law is being broken. To label an entire party and conservative-thinking people with a broadstroke that suggests they are akin to 'Hitlers' willing executioners' and would, based on the sentiment expressed, endorse raids on gay households and doctors' offices has a ring of hysteria and offensiveness to it.
The conservative positions on gay issues and abortion extend over the same range as those of anyone else--from very much opposed to very much in favor. Yes, conservatives generally fall on that scale in different locations than their so-called liberal colleagues, but both issues have a ton of gray space where most people land.
Do not forget Mr. Clinton on gay marriage and gays in the military... and Mr. Obama on gay "marriage". Most people have little issue with civil union rights that mirror a man/woman marriage. And don't forget more than just "social conservatives in the republican party" voted Yes on Prop 8.
What are the other issues? Adoption. Clerical. Instiutional (eg BSA). Adoption seems to be working out well. Clerical...Ah, the liberal view is that church and state should be completely separate, so this should not be an issue; Churches should do what they want. Institutional issues are also working just fine; the public sector institutions have no barring policies, and even private concerns tend not to; they all obey the law or get sued.
Abortion is the only procedure that apparently gives rise to the omnibus claim that conservatives want to control the relationship between women and their docs. One would think that such a claim could only come if abortions are 90% or more of all reasons to be in a obgyn office, but that is not the case. Is it?
again, the range of postions on abortion is broader than labeling conservatives as intrusive nut cases. Most people, left and right, are not in favor of late term abortions, which Roe v Wade allows...in fact up to the point of labor.
just as it is between the genders, there are a few more similarities than differences among the spectrum of people who lean left or right, and the labeling of half or more of the nation as private-life-intruders for some perverse control need is just plain hysteria.
--- End quote ---
there seems to have been a lot of broadbrush painting on this thread.
the position that conservative = social conservative = Republican is absurd.
the position that either party's platform is relevant beyond as paper liners for Parakeet cages is also absurd.
those who are self-identified as conservative have a spectrum of opinions on all the issues, and many conservatives do not affiliate with any party at all.
louisev:
well thank you for asking, Brad. I voted for Obama because he had a clear and focused agenda for a) ending the war in Iraq b) restoring progressive taxation and eliminating corporate welfare and giveaways to the rich c) restoring the rule of law and closing Gitmo d) instituting health care reform e) supporting the middle class and sensible domestic economic policy f) he had good advisement from the best economic team available led by Paul Volcker, the SUCCESSFUL former head of the Fed g) he is not a Washington pol and h) he's honest and intelligent.
Edwards was my second choice, and I am sure glad we dodged the bullet with that one.
And yes, I am tickled silly so far with how he has done.
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