Brokeback Mountain: Our Community's Common Bond > Brokeback Mountain Open Forum
Jack and Alma Jr.- Parallels?
Brown Eyes:
Greetings BetterMostians,
So, I'll start with the now-standard disclaimer. I apologize if this topic has already come up in other threads... but this has been on my mind a bit lately.
I've been thinking about potential parallels between Jack and Alma Jr., as odd as that might sound. But I think it's a valid issue and might pose some interesting questions about Ennis. Essentially, the biggest issue is that Ennis denies himself the opportunity to live with both Jack and Alma Jr. Both Jack and his daughter offer him this opportunity explicitly (obviously we hear Jack offer this option to Ennis more than once and Alma Jr. sort of begs Ennis to let her live with him... in her own quiet way). Also, both Jack and Alma Jr. seem to be associated with birds... or bluebirds in particular (and also eagles in the case of Jack). And... Jack and Alma Jr. (and I assume Jenny) are the people that Ennis seems to love the most in his life... and in all cases he denies himself the potential happiness of building a daily life with them. I don't know exactly what my question is here. It just seems to be an interesting angle that hasn't come up so much before. I guess for me this observation shows that Ennis was capable of denying himself happiness on multiple levels (not just with Jack). Poor Ennis. :'(
Ellemeno:
And they are the two who love him as he is.
I like the direction we're headed as we reach the new year.
BBM-Cat:
Ennis was capable of denying himself happiness on multiple levels (not just with Jack). Poor Ennis. :'([/quote]
Very interesting perspective - a case could also be made for Ennis denying himself a "daily life" with Cassie as well. Of course, I understand he was only dating her, although five years is a long time and especially to not be able to give yourself 'fully' to another person. Someone, (perhaps you Amanda) in another post alluded to the bookends of Ennis not believing himself to be worthy of other people's love or affection (i.e. 'what are you doing' lines to Jack and to Cassie, separately). I definitely agree with the view of Ennis' style of self-denial - likely a culmination of many factors - chiefly, deprivation (economic, emotional, etc.) - all leading to a sense of self-preservation. I loved Jack's comment to Ennis in one of the final camping scenes, "you want to live your miserable life? go ahead!" - implying Ennis had control over many situations, even if he did not believe so himself.
welliwont:
--- Quote from: atz75 on December 30, 2006, 01:28:03 am ---Greetings BetterMostians,
So, I'll start with the now-standard disclaimer. I apologize if this topic has already come up in other threads... but this has been on my mind a bit lately.
I've been thinking about potential parallels between Jack and Alma Jr., as odd as that might sound. But I think it's a valid issue and might pose some interesting questions about Ennis. Essentially, the biggest issue is that Ennis denies himself the opportunity to live with both Jack and Alma Jr. Both Jack and his daughter offer him this opportunity explicitly (obviously we hear Jack offer this option to Ennis more than once and Alma Jr. sort of begs Ennis to let her live with him... in her own quiet way). Also, both Jack and Alma Jr. seem to be associated with birds... or bluebirds in particular (and also eagles in the case of Jack). And... Jack and Alma Jr. (and I assume Jenny) are the people that Ennis seems to love the most in his life... and in all cases he denies himself the potential happiness of building a daily life with them. I don't know exactly what my question is here. It just seems to be an interesting angle that hasn't come up so much before. I guess for me this observation shows that Ennis was capable of denying himself happiness on multiple levels (not just with Jack). Poor Ennis. :'(
--- End quote ---
Awright, here's me, attacking Ennis again, but I will try not to be too harsh.
Poor Ennis??? Ennis is a goof, denying himself. The guy is a goofball, why he would deny his daughter to live with him, to me it tells me that he wants to be alone, wants to be lonely. That's my gut impression. If I try and dig deeper....
His little daughter is asking to live with him, and in the very next breath Ennis throws up his reasons for denying her. He does not even consider it for one milli-second. "I ain't set up for that. I'm gonna be gone on the round-up." There are very manageable work-arounds for both these excuses. Ennis doesn't want her to live with him. that is the way I read it. I don't see any underlying reasons for him turning Alma Jr down.
Now for me, if I want something, I work and strive to have it, no two ways about it. If Ennis does not work and strive to have Alma Jr or Jack live with him, my deduction is that he doesn't really want them living with him.
Am I thick?? ??? ???
Marge_Innavera:
--- Quote from: JakeTwist on December 30, 2006, 12:55:02 pm ---Am I thick?? ??? ???
--- End quote ---
Well, there are quite a few aspects to this you seem to have either dismissed or not considered.
Ennis' problems, like most intractible problems that can cripple a person's life, cannot be overcome just by "striving" and trying hard. This is a person who has spent his life cut off from connections to other people one way or another. Yes, he does deny himself happiness but to simply dismiss that as being 'a goof' is equivalent to saying that someone who has a problem with stuttering is lazy and doesn't care about communicating clearly because "after all, all he has to do is stop stuttering."
Here's a few other things that you might consider taking into account:
Guilt. This is a person first of all ridden with guilt over parts of himself that he can't accept, and typically people who don't feel they deserve something - or someone - often seem to throw it away. The fact that Alma Junior iis disappointed but doesn't give up trying to reach him suggests that at some level she understands that this isn't a personal rejection of her as his daughter.
Difficulty in communicating. As much as he loves his daughters, Ennis is never quite at ease around them once they're past early childhood.
A fractured life. His fears and inability to accept his own sexual nature has led him to keep his relationship with Jack his life's great secret, even as that relationship is the most important thing in his life. And it's one thing to go off on "fishing trips" when their mother is at home with them or when he's living alone; quite another, and a complication, with one or both of the children living with him.
Legal and visitation problems. This is arguably the 500-pound gorilla in the room. Ennis might not be well educated but it's amazing how quickly people can get an education about family law when they get divorced; especially when children are involved.
At this point in the story, Alma clearly knows what his relationship to Jack is, and an attempt to get primary physical custody, which is what Junior is talking about in the legal sense, would involve a court hearing and a family law judge going over every detail he/she can get hands on. Ennis' financial situation would be contrasted to Alma's and Monroe's and Alma might just see this as the final straw that would get her to go public about the reason their marriage broke up. If she should do that, Ennis would not only not get custody of either of the girls, he might well lose visitation rights. If he'd had a heterosexual affair, that revelation in court might not be as traumatic for him but the result would likely be the same and this is still true in family law in many states.
Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. The reasons Ennis gives Junior might not be the whole story, but they're legitimate reasons. Ranch work isn't a Monday-Friday 8:30-5:00 deal; it involves very long hours and frequent absences. Again, do-able when he was married and their mother lived in the same household; not necessarily a good living situation for a teenage girl at this point. And he's probably aware that her complaint about Alma and Monroe "being too strict" with her is to some extent a teenager's perspective and necessarily limited.
Maybe not the complete answer and it doesn't let him off the hook entirely; but 'trying harder' simply can't address every human tragedy or smooth over every rough spot in family relationships.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
Go to full version