As Easter nears, no Easter in Annie's story or the BM movie?? But??

[Front-Ranger]

Back to Jack being a bullrider, here is a picture of one of the original bullriders, or more accurately bull leapers, of ancient Crete!!

What I find a bit stange  is more than that too! Mr. Twist knows about Ennis before Ennis comes because Jack had told him things, maybe? What is this relationship, friendship, rapport directly told to HIM by Jack, and/or to Mrs. Twist who mentioned it to old man Twist? Any clues there?

I found that strange too, Artiste, that Jack would tell OMT all about Ennis, rather naive and strange. It is strange to see how children of abusive parents destroy their lives in the vain search for approval from them, even long after they are dead!! So strange and saddening. Another thing I noticed is that Jack didn't talk much about his mother even though she is obviously devoted and loving. He said to Ennis as they were about to part, "Guess I'll go up and give my Daddy a hand through the winter," and when he was drunk he had a tendency to talk about daddy. Always daddy and "my old man." I guess it's just human nature. There again are parallels to the Bible. Jesus was one who was always talking about his Daddy, even though his Father doomed him to die a horrible cruel death!!

[Artiste]

Thanks very much Front-Ranger!

Your post sure is instructive!

Yes, why did Jack NOT mention his mother... thought to be Mrs. Twist!!  ??

So, you really think that Jack was abused as a child? By which person(s) ??

Annie must have studied what in order to create the Jack charactor, as abused child?

Did Annie also prefered to ad Ennis as abused too? As a child? Or she accentuated maybe more after his decending the BM with Jack??

Is Annie trying to colour Ennis also as Christ ??

The pentacost, yes Pentacost as an aim, is for both: Ennis as well as for Jack, for Annie??

[Pentacost /i], is Easter here??

Pentacost is consolation for Ennis who survives so far??

But consolation is not for Jack since he was more open as a gay man, showing his orientation to the public?

Front-Ranger and to all too: Easter thoughts and wishes to you, your family and friends,

hugs!! Thanks for that pic too!!

[delalluvia]

Back to Jack being a bullrider, here is a picture of one of the original bullriders, or more accurately bull leapers, of ancient Crete!!

One of my fav pics.  But I'm not sure how Jack as a bull rider is anywhere near equivalent to Jesus riding on a donkey (If a "colt' was 'unbroken', Jesus wouldn't have been riding it).

[Artiste]

Thanks delalluvia!

Why a colt is the same or not for Jack as it was for Jesus??

Do you see the BM film like an Easter story in a way?

Hugs! Happy Holy Friday!

[Front-Ranger]

One of my fav pics.  But I'm not sure how Jack as a bull rider is anywhere near equivalent to Jesus riding on a donkey (If a "colt' was 'unbroken', Jesus wouldn't have been riding it).

All I can say is to recount the conversation, della. I said to Annie Proulx: "You made Jack a bullrider, What about the myth of the bullrider that stretches back to the bull leapers of ancient Crete?" She was nodding her head and then she answered, "I expect the reader to bring this information to the story, because there just isn't time (I think she meant room) to talk about all of it. For instance..." and then she went into the story about Christ riding on the unbroken colt. I think that was one of His many miracles, instantly taming a colt, or low-startle-point filly, if you will...

[Front-Ranger]

I do not know if all persons tend to judge too quickly, it seems so; since many do without looking at the facts!! I did that often! Do I do it as often now with my past experiences? Does everbody? Is everyone a Mr. Twist?

Is everyone a Mrs. Twist?

On the other hand, some persons do NOT act fast enough, as some do to SAVE their lives!!

How can one prevent from someone harming you or you harming someone??

WE need to feel as well as to think?? Which comes first??

Is that what the BM movie and Easter is about?

Au revoir,
hugs!

I must say that I am somewhat stumped by your questions, Artiste. You pose very very insightful questions, and I must think for a while before answering. . . just give me a couple of secs here!!

[delalluvia]

All I can say is to recount the conversation, della. I said to Annie Proulx: "You made Jack a bullrider, What about the myth of the bullrider that stretches back to the bull leapers of ancient Crete?" She was nodding her head and then she answered, "I expect the reader to bring this information to the story, because there just isn't time (I think she meant room) to talk about all of it. For instance..." and then she went into the story about Christ riding on the unbroken colt. I think that was one of His many miracles, instantly taming a colt, or low-startle-point filly, if you will...

Well, hmmm.  Based on what little you quoted, I don't think Proulx meant anything other than what she said.  That readers will bring their own knowledge to the story.

As far as we can tell, historically, the Minoans didn't ride the bulls, they did pretty much what you see, more like a circus event, jumping over or onto the bulls during festivals.  Whether Jesus tamed a donkey or not, I'm not sure how partying ancient pagan fertility festival bull jumpers, hard working modern day bull riders and ancient Jewish reformers riding donkeys have to do with each other.  From what I've read, in some versions, Jesus is riding a female donkey with her colt along side her, and that Jesus' entrance to Jerusalem was modeled on something like a triumphal parade, like conquering kings at the time, complete with the crowd waving palm fronds of victory.

I see what you guys are getting at, but to me, they're extreme leaps.

[Front-Ranger]

Here's a link to the coverage of the entire event. Annie of course said a lot more than that.

http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php/topic,4224.0.html

Just to be clear, I have two points: bull-worshipping cultures have existed in many places and throughout history. Secondly, the early Christians borrowed from and appropriated the rituals of earlier religions, and the Easter story is no exception.

In fact, the very word Easter pre-dates Christianity and refers to the Germanic goddess Oestre, who was herself appropriated by the Judeo/Christians and became Esther.

[Artiste]

Thanks Front-Ranger!

I did NOT know the origin of the word Easter! So that is it: Oestre ??

Since it's Holy Friday, do you think that Jack is crucified by being blasted with the tire iron? In film(s), Christ is picked by the arrow of the soldier, a sword? The tire iron is like sword to make him bleed?

Happy Good Friday to you, family and friends!!


Hugs!

[delalluvia]

Here's a link to the coverage of the entire event. Annie of course said a lot more than that.

http://bettermost.net/forum/index.php/topic,4224.0.html

Just to be clear, I have two points: bull-worshipping cultures have existed in many places and throughout history.

True, but what does bull-worshipping have to do with Jesus and Easter?  That is what I'm trying to wrap my head around.  Christians in every generation would have been appalled at the analogy.  After all, bull-worshippers are the "golden calf" worshippers and idolators derided so much in the bible.   The people the Jews and then the Christians have tried so hard to differentiate themselves from.

Secondly, the early Christians borrowed from and appropriated the rituals of earlier religions, and the Easter story is no exception.

Yes, but it was as you say, a Germanic influence, also, the Christians - as usual - hijacked the Passover celebration of the Jews (which had nothing to do with resurrection) and the vernal equinox fertility celebrations of other pagan religions.

I still don't see the connection between bull-worshippers and Easter and BBM.  At best, the only thing I see that they have convincingly in common are livestock.