A REPOST from TOB
=====================================================================================================Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - tryagain-5 (Fri Apr 28 2006 11:01:28 ) Im one of those people who thought the first tent scene came out of nowhere the first time I saw the movie. It wasnt until after I read some stuff here that I understood it better. Still, maybe because Im straight and dont "get" the signals, most of what I see happening looks like normal guy stuff to me--drinking, talking, insulting each other (that harmonica dont sound right either.) Even when Ennis leans back to watch Jack ride off--maybe Im just weird, but when someone leaves my house, I watch them drive away. I guess Im making sure theyre really gone and not coming back in for anything. I just thought Ennis was watching and thinking ok Im alone now. Ill go wash the dishes. Thats obviously not what it was, but thats how I took it. So anyway....
The elk scene. The more I see it, the more I love this scene. This is the first time we see Ennis being really playful and physical with Jack. When he shoots the elk, Jack cheers and shoves Ennis playfully. Ennis teases that hes tired of Jacks dumbass missing and playfully shoves him back. The look on Jacks face is priceless--hes so happily surprised. Then they get up and you see them shoving and jostling a bit more--again, the first time (I think) that Ennis is physical with Jack (in contrast to how he wouldnt let Jack touch him to wipe his face after the bear attack just before this.) To me, this scene shows much more than typical guy comeraderie and I love seeing Ennis being playful.
Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - Atalanta1 (Fri Apr 28 2006 11:08:35 ) UPDATED Fri Apr 28 2006 11:10:20
I love that scene too, it shows how far Ennis has come in accepting Jack and building a level of trust with him in addition to the fact that he REALLY likes him.
It's also an an act of love to be concerned about what they're going to eat, the day before when Jack said no more beans, Ennis ordered soup from the Basque at the bridge even though he doesn't eat soup, AND tells the man that He's the one sick of beans.
Now with their supplies scattered hither and yon by the bear scare and all that's left are beans, which Ennis says don't bother him, Ennis shoots the Elk for Jack, because he is sick of beans and to keep him for butchering one of the sheep and getting in trouble.
For then on we continue to see Ennis open up to Jack until he finally smiles at him when he's clowning around about the rodeo. I love that first smile Ennis gives us, his whole face opens up.
There are no pacts between lions and men
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - clancypants (Fri Apr 28 2006 11:47:01 ) I agree totally with your observations of this scene and its significance to their relationship.
I would also like to add some comments on elk symbolism (I already posted this elsewhere)...
I’ve not noticed a discussion of the elk symbolism. There are three elks in the film and it seems they signify Ennis fulfilling someone else’s desire:
1 – The elk Ennis shot for Jack – Ennis fulfilling Jack’s desire for a varied diet;
2 – The Elks lodge right down the street from Ennis’ and Alma’s apartment – Ennis fulfilling Alma’s desire to move to town; and,
3 – The elk shoot that Ennis offers up to Jack during the final argument scene – Ennis trying to fulfill Jack’s desire for quality time with Ennis – note here that Ennis cannot or will not give Jack what Jack really wants (commitment), so he offers the elk to placate Jack.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - bjblakeslee (Fri Apr 28 2006 11:51:49 )
When he shoots the elk, Jack cheers and shoves Ennis playfully. Ennis teases that hes tired of Jacks dumbass missing and playfully shoves him back. The look on Jacks face is priceless--hes so happily surprised.
It is useful when checking out someone to see how the person reacts to being touched.
Gay guys do it to other guys. It needs to pass as typical horseplay between two guys who attracted but not sure of each other. Straight guys also touch other guys, but it is usually used to establish dominance between males.
The look on Jack's face tells me that there is another purpose here.
Ennis's playing along may or may not mean that he is interested, but it does mean to Jack that Ennis is not opposed to being touched.
Jack's face lights up because Ennis has accepted Jack playfully touching him! (You will perhaps remember that Ennis didn't allow Jack to touch him before when he came back to camp with abrasions on his face. Ennis took the cloth away from Jack and tended his own injuries.)
Straight guys do it to women when they are trying to pick them up, but it usually takes the form of grooming behavior, "That's a nice dress! It looks soft. Do you mind?", or "Let me help you with your coat", or "You have a little something on your shoulder, let me get that for you." Women will accept these gestures or not. If a women does not allow that kind of touch, she has no intention of allowing anything more physical to happen. These all serve socially acceptable functions of gauging interest in a partner, and sending a signal that touch is welcome.
No sexual encounter happen between people without some sort of "go" signal that physical touch will be accepted.
This moment is major moment for Jack, because Ennis is giving him a subtle "go" signal.
Shoot as fast as lightnin' but it loads a mite slow...
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - tryagain-5 (Fri Apr 28 2006 12:28:01 ) Wow, I never thought of all that. I didn't realize that the horseplay even meant so much more. But now that you mention it, I see that. I'm not a touchy-feely person myself (not averse to it, but I don't feel like I have to go around hugging my friends all the time, and I'm often uncomfortable initiating touch) so I can see how much it would mean when Ennis returns the touch. I noticed that also in the first tent scene--not only did Ennis NOT punch Jack out, but he grabbed him, not by the shoulders, but by the face and head, which is extremely intimate touch.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - David-Indiana (Fri Apr 28 2006 12:46:01 ) >>The elk scene. The more I see it, the more I love this scene. This is the first time we see Ennis being really playful and physical with Jack. When he shoots the elk, Jack cheers and shoves Ennis playfully. Ennis teases that hes tired of Jacks dumbass missing and playfully shoves him back.<<
I agree with everything everyone said. Still, I felt so sorry for that poor elk.
:-(
David.
I'm really not that smart. I just have a wide aperture.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - BocaGarrett (Fri Apr 28 2006 12:50:16 ) I love Ennis' face in that scene. Right after he chastises Jack about his "dumbass missing" and before Jack says "Lets get. Before game and fish catch us with an elk" or whatever he says. Ennis has this incredible goofy look on his face that makes him seem so endearing and loveable. I've actually seen Heath give that same face in interviews he's done, so I know it's not just a face he made up for this movie, it's part of him.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - David-Indiana (Fri Apr 28 2006 12:53:28 ) >>I've actually seen Heath give that same face in interviews he's done, so I know it's not just a face he made up for this movie, it's part of him. <<
Awww! Heath is SO cute. I just wanna hug him!
:-)
David.
I'm really not that smart. I just have a wide aperture.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - stitchbuffymoulinfan (Fri Apr 28 2006 13:19:48 ) I have always enjoyed this scene (I did sort of feel bad for the elk though, I must admit). I like the elk symbolism too. Another very interesting tidbit.
www.jlodown.com www.petitionspot.com/petitions/jlodown Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - BannerHill (Mon May 1 2006 23:23:35 ) yes
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - mr_kovax (Mon May 1 2006 23:26:39 ) I loved that scene... especially Ennis' comment to Jack: "Tired of your dumb ass missin'!" Great scene!
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - BannerHill (Mon May 1 2006 23:50:07 ) That Heath....what a looker! Their chemistry in that scene is palpable.
Re: Anyone else a fan of the elk scene?
by - braintumorgod (Tue May 2 2006 08:39:15 ) I think this is a really interesting observation, and I must agree with the OP. I must say that, now that I think about it, I do the same thing behavior wise. Playful shoving and what not. I also thought about how the stuff they do together would be considered typical guy things. "Straight" guy things. It's letting you know that there are guys out there who are into other guys and don't speak in swirls or wear skimpy clothes (even though this is becoming popular among ALL young guys in St. Louis at least) with their hair styled. These are the same guys that say they're gay and you follow up with this statement: "I had no idea" or "I would have never guessed".
